Ladbrook Grove Disaster 1999

[Multiple Unit]

I was reading an article about this in a 1999 Rail mag and it says that the Dirver of the Thames Turbo Unit PAsaed a red signal (SAPD) across a gatry wher all other Signla swhere red taking his trian on to the wrong cross over ending up causing a head on closion.

Now I would have thoght for statrers that if you couldn't see a siganl clearly then you'd stop anyway and clip the tracks with the emergncy clips etc.

As well if you know your on the wrong road / cross over then you'd stop and do as above.

Also form the distance from one rd to anothe ryoud think youd be able to see the on coming HST.

Like ot hear form other drivers on this subject please...

 

[TGV]

As I understand, the driver in question was quite new to the job. The signal had been identified by others as being poorly sited (had a history of SPADs) and obscured by overhead line structures and equipment. So it's not a case of not seeing it clearly, he probably didn't see it at all until his AWS alerted him to it, but presumably even then, he didn't/couldn't see it for whatever reasons - we'll never know.

However, he also passed through several other previous signals that caused the AWS horn to sound, and he must have cancelled those and carried on - evidence showed that his train was accelerating at the time of, or shortly before, the impact and the AWS was found to be functioning correctly.

I don't think that seeing the oncoming train is an issue - especially at a closing speed around 130mph. He was on an adjacent track until the last minute when his route was set into the path of the HST (which would have been set by ARS) by which time it was too late to do anything about it.

The Cullen report is here if you have time to read it:

http://www.rail-reg.gov.uk/upload/pdf/incident-ladbrokegrove-lgri1-optim.pdf

 

[welshpax]

Funny enough I was reading about this earlier today, the initial reports was that due to the sighting of the signal and the angle of the sun the driver may have thought he had an amber aspect on SN109. This was backed up at the time due the fact the Thames Unit was travelling at around 54 mph.

The layout at the time Bi Directional so the driver who thought he was travelling under amber signals would not have thought there was anything wrong, hence no reason to stop.

I also think that the closing speed of both trains would have made it very difficult to stop either the HST or Turbo until it was too late.

This event was one of the turning points in Railtracks short history and of course sped up the introduction of TPWS across the network.

 

[CarterUSM]

I don't think he meant you anyway welsh pax.

 

[ladydsm]

multiple unit what intrested you about this subject, a full report has been done.
And anyone who talks about it can only guess the real story there is no need to stir up the past. let the people who died rest in peace.

 

[CarterUSM]

multiple unit what intrested you about this subject, a full report has been done.
And anyone who talks about it can only guess the real story there is no need to stir up the past. let the people who died rest in peace.

Yes, it can be a very emotional subject for some, i'd advise you to seek the official version of events for incidents such as this for future reference multipleunit, though i'm sure you meant no offence in the first place.

 

[royaloak]

Read the official report, all the information is in there.
Raking things up for no good reason is just ignorant.
Driving a train is very different from "trainsim" et al, the reasons for the accident are all in the report!
The Thames train driver was found partly to blame but he was as much a victim of the accident as the other people that died due to his lack of documented training etc.

 

[theblackwatch]

Please cut out the sniping at each other, I've deleted the offending posts. Multiple unit - it may be useful to use a spell checker if you have problems with typing and/or spelling.

 

[Turbostar]

Why exactly does Multiple Unit want to know more about this subject??? Like ladydsm has already said, it's done & dusted, why start stirring up the past again, leave it be & let the dead rest in peace. Also, you start asking for details off drivers especially, your likely to encounter harsh reception, as quite rightly so, they don't wanna talk about it, & to be honest, a lot of it probably can't be disclosed for legal reasons. At the end of the day it's got nothing to do with you, & probably you'll be able to get the info you need by 'Googling' it. Let it be, & drop the subject. Maybe it would be a good idea for Mods to lock this thread, before it gets out of hand.

 

[Greenback]

I agree with all of the above posters who have asked that the dead be left in peace. Although not a driver, I was working for FGW at the time in Reading, and it was a horrible time for those that died, and their relations. Please close this thread.

 

[TDK]

I was reading an article about this in a 1999 Rail mag and it says that the Dirver of the Thames Turbo Unit PAsaed a red signal (SAPD) across a gatry wher all other Signla swhere red taking his trian on to the wrong cross over ending up causing a head on closion.

Now I would have thoght for statrers that if you couldn't see a siganl clearly then you'd stop anyway and clip the tracks with the emergncy clips etc.

As well if you know your on the wrong road / cross over then you'd stop and do as above.

Also form the distance from one rd to anothe ryoud think youd be able to see the on coming HST.

Like ot hear form other drivers on this subject please...

Reading this you do not have enough knowledge of the driving grade or about driving to comment so leave it be

 

[royaloak]

Dirver of the Thames Turbo Unit PAsaed a red signal (SAPD)

Ignoring the atrocious spelling, do you not have a spell checker?
Do you mean he danced around the signal?

 

[matt]

Give it a rest you two.

 

[dstrat]

I'd just like to say, talking about incidents is only going to better our knowledge and understanding. Sweeping the topics under the carpet 'out of respect' is ludicrous, considering its not actually disrespetful in any iota.
________
Honda CBR600RR

 

[royaloak]

Talking about it will not improve bugger all, if you are that interested try reading the report!

 

[dstrat]

Yeah won't improve but still. I was just trying to make some sort of crap argument cos I don't think we should just 'ban' talking about it
________
ZL1000A

 

[Lee_Again]

Talking about it wont improve bugger all, if you are that interested try reading the report!

I think you'll find it's won't, not wont.

We're not all perfect. It's worth remembering that.

 

[royaloak]

I didn't say lock the thread, but if there is nothing constructive to add why rake over these sad incidents!


Original post edited for correct Queens English.

 

[Dennis]

Hopefully the OP has gone off to read the 299 page report including the, at times, disturbing evidence and images describing the accident.

Personally, I was looking forward to some informed discussion on this important subject, including comments on how the 89 recommendations have been implemented (or not as the case mey be), how these have influenced the rail industry's behaviour and if anything similar could ever happen again.

Time and again, such dreadful accidents have had important, usually beneficial, implications for the industry and I think it would be true to say that the events of 5th October 1999 ultimately resulted in a safer railway.

 

[Lee_Again]

Original post edited for correct Queens English.

Taken in the right spirit. Good man.

 

[royaloak]

Yep, couldn't put a smillie on when editing

 

[Bittern]

Ignoring the atrocious spelling, do you not have a spell checker?
Do you mean he danced around the signal?