Lack of volunteers ?

[enginedin]

For example, someone who suggests that you can use a desktop program (like Outlook, Windows Mail, or Thunderbird) to set up an automatic out of office reply, obviously doesn't understand that it may only work while that desktop program is running

I feel like that's a slight criticism of my advice (sure, I haven't claimed to be an "expert", although, for context, I do work in a computing role in a very high profile organisation, providing advice and training to a community of several thousand people, so I'd like to think I have some idea of what I'm talking about...)

it may only work while that desktop program is running

that is correct in some, but not all cases. e.g. when outlook is used to connect to an Microsoft-cloud based service, then the out-of-office is synced to the online account and works at the server level

 

[Llanigraham]

There's been much discussion about IT skills - at the end of the day, you don't need to be Gordon Ramsey to cook a Tesco lasagne; we're talking setting an 'out of office' here, not programming the software for a space mission.

If volunteers can learn the myriad of often complex safety rules and whatnot to drive steam trains or be a guard or a signaller or whathaveyou, they can learn how to set an out of office.

The problem with "out of office" is that it applies to ALL emails recieved, and in my situation I still want to receive emails from family and friends, I just don't want to have to deal with "WORK" emails.

 

[m0ffy]

The problem with "out of office" is that it applies to ALL emails recieved, and in my situation I still want to receive emails from family and friends, I just don't want to have to deal with "WORK" emails.

You can set OOO on a per-account basis.

 

[gswindale]

The problem with "out of office" is that it applies to ALL emails recieved, and in my situation I still want to receive emails from family and friends, I just don't want to have to deal with "WORK" emails.

It applies only to all emails sent to a specific email address. So your PC/phone/tablet maybe setup with personal@llanigraham.com and work@llanigraham.com as email accounts, but only one of those needs to have an auto response setup.

It shouldn't be too hard for whoever is responsible for setting up email accounts to be able to do this on the control panel - most hosting providers allow this from my experience.

 

[enginedin]

What this thread highlights is that an adage an old boss used is as true now as it ever was:

technology is never the problem; people are

(i.e. whatever you want to achieve, there will (almost always) be a technical solution. The blocker will be people, either not knowing how to do it, or preventing the solution being implemented)

 

[Llanigraham]

It applies only to all emails sent to a specific email address. So your PC/phone/tablet maybe setup with personal@llanigraham.com and work@llanigraham.com as email accounts, but only one of those needs to have an auto response setup.

It shouldn't be too hard for whoever is responsible for setting up email accounts to be able to do this on the control panel - most hosting providers allow this from my experience.

But I only have ONE email address, as I am quite sure a lot of other volunteers have.

What this thread highlights is that an adage an old boss used is as true now as it ever was:



(i.e. whatever you want to achieve, there will (almost always) be a technical solution. The blocker will be people, either not knowing how to do it, or preventing the solution being implemented)

Quite!

People need to realise that many "back office" volunteers are not computer wizzkids, and that expecting them to set-up numerous email accounts and special systems to deal with things whilst they are on holiday isn't what they want, need or are capable of doing. Now if you want your volunteering offer to be dealt with you promptly whilst someone is on holiday either you are going to have learn to be patient or perhaps offer your expertise to do the job as you want.

 

[YorkshireBear]

What this thread highlights is that an adage an old boss used is as true now as it ever was:



(i.e. whatever you want to achieve, there will (almost always) be a technical solution. The blocker will be people, either not knowing how to do it, or preventing the solution being implemented)

Knowing how definitely. I am early thirties, work in an office based role, good with IT (I thought) and this makes no sense to me at all.

 

[xotGD]

But I only have ONE email address, as I am quite sure a lot of other volunteers have.

So set up a second one, specifically for the railway stuff. And when you are on holiday, set up an auto reply, and don't read the emails until you get back.

 

[m0ffy]

But I only have ONE email address, as I am quite sure a lot of other volunteers have.

Then the railway you volunteer with needs a separate address/account for volunteering enquiries. This stuff isn’t difficult or costly, but it improves the user experience.

 

[gswindale]

But I only have ONE email address, as I am quite sure a lot of other volunteers have.

So, on your railway's website, the address for volunteer enquiries is personal@Llanigraham.com?

I'd be having a word with them in that case as they shouldn't be publishing personal details like that.

I'm now 99.9% certain that they've got a forwarder on so that emails to volunteer@llanigrahamsrailway.org are sent onto you. Therefore quite easy for whoever did that to also setup an auto response.

The main problem seems to be more a case of people not asking the right questions to the right people in the organisation.

It is not for you as volunteer officer to fix the issue, but to ask whoever deals with IT queries.

 

[Ken X]

I have followed this thread with interest as the present Mrs X volunteers as a Brownie Guide leadet, Guide Hall booking secretary and volunteer training planner. She is (whisper it) the wrong side of fifty and has set up an email account for each role and her own private email account so four in total. They all reside on the cloud so she can access them wherever she is on any device she has to hand and it only took a few minutes per account.

She takes great pains to be prompt and professional in her work and expects the same from her fellow volunteers. The result is less work for everyone as there is little duplication and no lack of clarity as to who is doing what. Holiday email diversions and cover are planned without thinking.

Several of her fellow volunteers are not from a Guiding background but enjoy sorting spreadsheets, managing rotas and running finances. They were recruited for their interest in computing and secretarial work, not Guiding specifically and enjoy helping even they never attend Guide meetings with the girls.

Is there a way volunteers who do not have more than a passing interest in heritage railways but love setting up computer packages can be attracted to help. They could even work remotely if it works for them and the railway. Volunteers have many diverse skills and not everyone wants to twirl spanners or shovel coal.

Like it or not, the younger generations are born into a computer heavy world and this is what they are comfortable with. It is up to us oldies to utilise these skills to make our lives easier. Their interest in heritage rail may well grow from volunteering to set up Facebook and WhatsApp groups, build databases and schedule rotas and timetables etc. We just need to plant the seed.

 

[GusB]

The world of work has changed significantly over the last couple of decades. Employers expect their workers to be fully-flexible across a wide range of hours, even on part-time (and zero-hours) contracts. This makes planning one's life outside of work extremely difficult and I don't think it's unreasonable for people in these situations to prioritise their own lives when they do get a rare weekend off. It doesn't matter how committed you are to the cause; you've got to do what you have to do in order to pay the bills and if your hobbies suffer as a result, that's just the way it is.

Heritage railways, like any other organisation that rely on volunteers, are bound to be affected.

I don't really want to get into the ins and outs of an individual's ability to access emails, especially when they're on holiday, but to rely on a single point of contact is a major failure of the organisation; you may be trying to run a steam railway according to 1930s practices, but you absolutely need 21st century methods in order to get people to come and visit. Computer geek + railway enthusiast really shouldn't be a difficult position to fill.

 

[xotGD]

A further consideration is with many company pension schemes being less generous than in the past, fewer people will be able to take early retirement, giving an opportunity for volunteering.

 

[railfan99]

The analogy is the oil tanker whose rudder has been hard to port for sometime but isnt turning yet.

Brilliant!

 

[Lost property]

This thread has made interesting reading, hence I would like to add my perspective.

Culture. Every organisation is underpinned by corporate culture and heritage railways are no exception. This usually becomes evident to new arrivals soon after joining. The culture starts at the top and if the "management" are incompetent, the culture reflects this.

Covid has been mentioned. For many, a railway is their primary interest, however, how many, due to an enforced absence, have thought " do I really want to go back to a toxic culture" ?....how many times has the "group A doesn't like group B" so both did their own thing been mentioned with regard to serious issues on various railways. How many were afraid of repercussions if they complained about issues, but, no longer have to worry as they were no longer able to attend.

"Characters " ...they are everywhere and usually a PITA...full of themselves, can't be criticised due to length of service and never averse, in the case of railways, to forcing themselves onto newcomers and passengers alike...one contributor on here kindly demonstrated this in fact.

The 21st century.

By all means operate vintage stock / locomotives, but, really, is there any necessity to get dressed up like a mannequin to try and create a whimsical impression of an era that never really was. If you want to get dressed up for pleasure, join an amateur dramatics society, or become a morris dancer or go to a fetish club. Albeit all these options would be problematic for many as they would involve meeting and interacting with mature normal adults.

I can understand the practicalities for a steam crew, but, nobody else. A white shirt, black trousers and...a railways corporate wear would be more than sufficient to present a 21st century image. Younger potential volunteers all have their own fashion styles anyway, but could be induced by, as I say, a corporate image.

If the heritage rail sector is going to survive, and attract new members, it needs to get rid, rapidly, of the "this is the way British Railways did things and so are we " ideologies.

 

[Titfield]

A further consideration is with many company pension schemes being less generous than in the past, fewer people will be able to take early retirement, giving an opportunity for volunteering.

But that is making an assumption that only retired people volunteer. It might look that way but flexible working, working from home all give opportunities for those working to volunteer some of their time.

 

[AlterEgo]

People need to realise that many "back office" volunteers are not computer wizzkids, and that expecting them to set-up numerous email accounts and special systems to deal with things whilst they are on holiday isn't what they want

It’s literally setting up an out of office or a second gmail account. It is something anyone can do if they want to, and something someone on the forum could show you how to do in five minutes. If you wanted to.

Now if you want your volunteering offer to be dealt with you promptly whilst someone is on holiday either you are going to have learn to be patient or perhaps offer your expertise to do the job as you want.

People are offering very simple solutions here but you are being defensive. I’m afraid there is a volunteer crisis; I’m entering a stage of my life where I’d like to start volunteering but I’m not sure a heritage railway will get my time. I don’t have only one interest. Organisations should be looking to be as flexible and open as possible when attracting free labour from interested people.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Aug 2024 ==

I don't really want to get into the ins and outs of an individual's ability to access emails, especially when they're on holiday, but to rely on a single point of contact is a major failure of the organisation; you may be trying to run a steam railway according to 1930s practices, but you absolutely need 21st century methods in order to get people to come and visit. Computer geek + railway enthusiast really shouldn't be a difficult position to fill.

Quite.

 

[BongoStar]

A perspective of someone mot a teen anymore nor past 40 either.

I don't mind volunteering my TIME. happy to do that and have signed up for a few of them. What I cannot afford are associated costs. I politely decline opportunities which would:
- cost me money to get there and back
- require me to spend hours and hours in my work week to volunteer on a weekend
- need me to do more than volunteering, almost a part time gig

There are very few true volunteering options out there nowadays which are meaningful. Those where you sign up, show up and done with it end of day.

 

[Belperpete]

A perspective of someone mot a teen anymore nor past 40 either.

I don't mind volunteering my TIME. happy to do that and have signed up for a few of them. What I cannot afford are associated costs. I politely decline opportunities which would:
- cost me money to get there and back
- require me to spend hours and hours in my work week to volunteer on a weekend
- need me to do more than volunteering, almost a part time gig

There are very few true volunteering options out there nowadays which are meaningful. Those where you sign up, show up and done with it end of day.

It depends what you want to do. If you want a safety-critical role, then you are going to need training, and likely that will need you to study things like the rules and regulations in your own time. However, there are non-safety critical roles that can be done with minimal training and are just turn up and go.

Generally, however, the more you put in, the more you get out.

 

[GusB]

I don't mind volunteering my TIME. happy to do that and have signed up for a few of them. What I cannot afford are associated costs. I politely decline opportunities which would:
- cost me money to get there and back

Do we expect everyone who participates in a hobby to be reimbursed for expenses incurred while travelling to and from that activity? In my younger days I was a member of my local model railway club and I didn't expect anyone to cover the costs of getting me to and from regular weekly meetings. Likewise, when I was a member of my local brass band I didn't expect to have the cost of travel to regular rehearsal covered.

- require me to spend hours and hours in my work week to volunteer on a weekend
- need me to do more than volunteering, almost a part time gig

Volunteering is still work, though. If you feel that you do enough work during the week and don't want to do any at the weekend, I'd suggest that volunteering probably isn't right for you.

There are very few true volunteering options out there nowadays which are meaningful. Those where you sign up, show up and done with it end of day.

Yup, it definitely seems to me that volunteering isn't your forte. "Sign up, show up and done with it end of day" screams "turn up, layabout, drink tea, watch others do the work while criticising this that and the next thing"

Volunteering your TIME is one thing; organisations need you to volunteer your EFFORT, too

 

[BongoStar]

You have to look at it from perspective of the potential people who you want to volunteer.

Not everyone is an enthusiast who are happy to go out of their way for the cause. There may be more people who just want to show support and are happy to do their little bit.

If the organisers go with the view that everyone is equally motivated or wants the same fulfillment, then that's not going to work.

Ofcourse it doesn't matter in instances where there are ample enthusiasts to volunteer, but when that supply dwindles, newer strategies need to be tried.

As mentioned above, the more you put in, the more you get. There should be opportunities to put in just 4 hours on a weekend, even if it's to do clean-up after the event.

 

[Skymonster]

Yup, it definitely seems to me that volunteering isn't your forte. "Sign up, show up and done with it end of day" screams "turn up, layabout, drink tea, watch others do the work while criticising this that and the next thing"

Volunteering your TIME is one thing; organisations need you to volunteer your EFFORT, too

Phew! I’m glad you don’t manage volunteers at the place where I do voluntary crewing. Turn up, do some stuff, go home is EXACTLY what should be expected from volunteers. Aside from their passion and the desire to see the organisation prosper, volunteers have no vested interest in the place they do duties - they do not have any financial interest in the prosperity of the organisation, their livelihood is not threatened if it doesn’t succeed, and being able to feed and clothe themselves and heat their houses is not dependent on them continuing to be paid. Remember that preserved railways and tramways are held to very high standards by the ORR / HMRI these days. Many of the volunteers are highly competent and well trained, and if they wanted to could probably get a job on the big railway or urban transport systems - but they chose not to, and do what they volunteer to do to help.

All that can be realistically expected is that volunteers turn up, help a bit and then go home again. Remember, volunteers are not under contract and can just walk away without consequences for themselves if they feel like they being taken advantage of or are being asked to do more than they reasonably believe is within them to do.

In my own case last year I was 4th most active operational crew member. We are almost always tight for crew, if not short. This year I will be no where near 4th - I won’t be in the bottom half of the pile, but I won’t be near the top either. Why? Mainly because I’ve seen how it all unfolds. Last year I leapt in to help whenever there was a shortage of crew - when I could anyway. But there are others who didn’t and won’t lift a finger beyond what they requested they were rostered to do. Some of those won’t even entertain being contacted and being asked to do “more”, even if the shortages are critical.

To put it blunty I’ve got fed up of busting a gut to make things happen when others don’t go above and beyond. All that extra effort [last year] earned me thanks but nothing much more - it just cost me more because it costs me to get to and from crewing duties. So this year I’m doing what I said I’d do and not really extending much beyond that.

Realistically, as I said previously, if heritage organisations want to put on a show worthy of the entrance fees some of them demand, they need a core of paid staff to ensure that service can be provided. And those paid staff will have contracts that place obligations and expectations in exchange for being paid - to turn up and work a certain number of times, for example. Ironic isn’t it? Some say volunteers have no rights because they are not under contract. But conversely volunteers also have more rights, such as the right not to turn if they don’t want to or if it doesn’t suit them, without suffering any consequences.

I simply don’t accept that some of the major heritage operations can’t financially justify / afford to pay operational staff. If they want to put on a reliable service, they need to do pay even if it means raising admissions charges. Alternatively, if they persist in relying on volunteers, they need to accept that operations may often be on a knife-edge or even fall short of public expectations. And volunteers need to be not taken for granted but instead nurtured and cared for - more so in some ways than paid employees are. If an organisation doesn’t value what volunteers do - however much or little - it’ll lose them eventually.