Kings Cross - New station

[Deerfold]

You can still enter/exit via the side (on York Way) and move to the right to get to the Underground without going outside or into the new concourse. It's just straight ahead that is closed, including all the shops and toilets (which went some time ago). At least that was what it was like last Thursday (with staff handing out a map showing the new layout).

I am not sure how much room there will be when a few trains arrive close together, but I am sure they'll be encouraging people to exit to the right (from the platforms) to go into the new station area. Most commuters will quickly learn, I'm sure (after moaning like crazy for the first few days!).

There's big signs up saying to turn right after the gates - which is annoying as I assumed this meant York Way was close and I didn't come across anyone handing out maps (very half heartedly too!) until I was already near the Underground entrance.

I wonder why there was no notice this time - I passed through Wednesday evening too.

 

[jon0844]

I am pretty sure the York Way entrance is still open and will remain open.

They also have one or two gates allowing you to enter so you don't need to walk all the way to the main station concourse gates.

 

[Mojo]

I can't see fully from the plans/picture, but are customers from arriving trains really going to have to go outside to get into the Underground? There appears to be a short canopy, but surely it can't offer that much protection; especially when a train with over 500 customers arrives.

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/assets...1918/763594bb-263a-483b-9790-8857c0812854.jpg

 

[Deerfold]

I can't see fully from the plans/picture, but are customers from arriving trains really going to have to go outside to get into the Underground? There appears to be a short canopy, but surely it can't offer that much protection; especially when a train with over 500 customers arrives.

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/assets...1918/763594bb-263a-483b-9790-8857c0812854.jpg

No, the entrance(s) inside the station is(are) still available.

 

[Bungle73]

No, the entrance(s) inside the station is(are) still available.

He's talking about when the public square is finished. The canopy looks plenty wide enough to me.

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/assets...1918/763594bb-263a-483b-9790-8857c0812854.jpg

 

[yorksrob]

Given the recent "summer", perhaps Network Rail's computer projections ought to include driving rain rather than clear sunshine

 

[jon0844]

He's talking about when the public square is finished. The canopy looks plenty wide enough to me.

On a biting cold day, or when it's severely windy and blowing rain/sleet sideways, we'll see how wide the canopy is.

Or if you want a preview of how cold it can be - just go to St Pancras!

 

[Bungle73]

On a biting cold day, or when it's severely windy and blowing rain/sleet sideways, we'll see how wide the canopy is.

It's not that far a walk. I'm sure people can stand being outside for the 30 seconds it takes to walk it.

Or if you want a preview of how cold it can be - just go to St Pancras!

St. Pancras? It's all inside.

 

[jon0844]

Really? Go stand in The Circle or upstairs by the EMT platforms in the Winter (or when it's raining/snowing hard) and tell me what it's like.

I've seen snow coming in the huge gap at the side and blow down to the shops. Quite romantic, but f'ing freezing and also not good for keeping the floor dry and slip-free.

Anyway, I am sure people can cope with being outside for 30 seconds but when it's a blizzard then I am sure they'd rather not having got off a nice warm train to get on to the Underground. Okay, so there's another way to the Underground that is sheltered but it's pretty well hidden.

 

[Bungle73]

Really? Go stand in The Circle or upstairs by the EMT platforms in the Winter (or when it's raining/snowing hard) and tell me what it's like.

I've seen snow coming in the huge gap at the side and blow down to the shops. Quite romantic, but f'ing freezing and also not good for keeping the floor dry and slip-free.

Anyway, I am sure people can cope with being outside for 30 seconds but when it's a blizzard then I am sure they'd rather not having got off a nice warm train to get on to the Underground. Okay, so there's another way to the Underground that is sheltered but it's pretty well hidden.

I've been The Circle - I use the SE HS trains often - I can't say it's that bad, unless you're standing right by the entrance.

 

[jon0844]

It isn't bad all of the time. I didn't mean to imply it always is. I was talking about during bad weather. I realise they've got a big open gap due to the use of diesel trains, but if they filled it in then it would be a lot nicer.

Starbucks in The Circle was an awful place to be in the Winter and you can see how they've solved that problem - which suggests it was bad enough that they were losing customers (and probably staff).

 

[LE Greys]

Looks like somebody screwed up! Arriving from the suburban side should be fine, but the main line side distinctly lacks a covered entrance. If an awning or canopy goes up, that would clear the way to the reappearence of the 'African Village', which is precisely what they are trying to avoid in the redevelopment. The only sensible answer would be even more excavating to add yet another Tube entrance somewhere around the York Road corner, so not exactly brilliant.

 

[Nym]

Looks like somebody screwed up! Arriving from the suburban side should be fine, but the main line side distinctly lacks a covered entrance. If an awning or canopy goes up, that would clear the way to the reappearence of the 'African Village', which is precisely what they are trying to avoid in the redevelopment. The only sensible answer would be even more excavating to add yet another Tube entrance somewhere around the York Road corner, so not exactly brilliant.

Or just rape the under croft and have some entrance only lines on the actual platforms part way down for entry into the LUL station...?

 

[swt_passenger]

Looks like somebody screwed up! Arriving from the suburban side should be fine, but the main line side distinctly lacks a covered entrance. If an awning or canopy goes up...

There is to be a canopy. It's clearly shown in all the planning drawings, and it extends out over the LU stairs, which are on your right as you exit through what will be the front of the station.

It's difficult to work out exact dimensions, but it seems to be about 6 metres (20 ft). It will be in line with a canopy next to the Great Northern Hotel (at the south end entrance of the western concourse) and parallel to the end of the station all the way across to York Way.

 

[mirodo]

Work commenced yesterday on the demolition of the canopy.

http://londonist.com/2012/11/demolition-of-kings-cross-canopy-begins.php?showpage=4#gallery-1

 

[DaveNewcastle]

The York Way entrance/exit is indeed still open . . . . . . But the owls have gone!
[anyone unclear about the what and where of the Kings Cross owls please see posts #231 - 236 of this thread]

However, their perches are still intact, so one can hope they will return.

 

[Bungle73]

I tried out the Parcel Yard for the first time today. Very nice. I managed to bag a table by a window looking out onto the trains; only the FCC side though. I had venison pie and a pint of ale. Yummy.

 

[jon0844]

A very nice place, and a nice complement to the Betjeman Arms over the road. Nice staff who were very good with me, the wife and our baby.

The only downside was the price of a pint - but that's London + a train station. I never thought to ask if they take Bite cards though.

If you venture to the toilets, you can get a view of the main station building but I seem to recall there's frosted glass and you might need to jump up a bit!

 

[Bungle73]

A very nice place, and a nice complement to the Betjeman Arms over the road. Nice staff who were very good with me, the wife and our baby.

The only downside was the price of a pint - but that's London + a train station. I never thought to ask if they take Bite cards though.

If you venture to the toilets, you can get a view of the main station building but I seem to recall there's frosted glass and you might need to jump up a bit!

I need to try the Betjeman Arms too, as I've never been in there either....despite using St. Pancras to get to and from Kent frequently - it's at the other end of the station from the SE platforms though, and there's no through route without going downstairs, then up again.

I'll try out the toilets (ahem) next time I'm in there.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
So the Betjeman Arms, is it a proper pub pub - ie one where you go up to the bar to order food and then it gets brought to your table - or is it waitress service? I see they add a "discretionary 12.5% service" charge to you bill. That puts me off a bit.

 

[A-driver]

Think this is the right thread but I thought I'd pass this on-was told today by a colleague that the new escalators on the new footbridge are all to be replaced by stairs. Apparently there has been such as increase in passengers using the emergancy stop plungers to walk up them that they have decided its best to replace them all and make the bridge 2 way. They lasted a long time!

I suppose its the problem with trying to use airport passenger flows at a rail station-not as easy to control the flow.

 

[jon0844]

That's mad. How much money to install and now remove them?!

 

[yorksrob]

I used the Cross today, and whilst I enjoyed the splendour of the new trainshed (or concourse shed), I found the toilet provisions to be frustrating. The signs directed me up the stairs to the mezannine, then when I got there they were pointing left, so I immediately went down the stairs (which were on the left) and got back to the concourse. After asking advice, I was told that the toilet was indeed up the stairs and went up to find a single turnstyle and queue of too many people (for a major London terminal) and gave up because by this time it was time to get the train.

Please God, are the good old loo's under platform (I think) 8 stiill there, because if they are I think I will use them.

 

[Bungle73]

I had a hell of a job trying to find an entrance to the Underground during the evening rush hour a while ago. Every time I followed a sign it lead me to an escalator that was only coming up! I ended up having to cross the road to St. Pancras and entering from there iirc.

 

[Skimble19]

Think this is the right thread but I thought I'd pass this on-was told today by a colleague that the new escalators on the new footbridge are all to be replaced by stairs. Apparently there has been such as increase in passengers using the emergancy stop plungers to walk up them that they have decided its best to replace them all and make the bridge 2 way. They lasted a long time!

I suppose its the problem with trying to use airport passenger flows at a rail station-not as easy to control the flow.

I hope that's just a rumour and not true.. If it is, what a massive waste of money it will be. There's not enough room at the barriers at the end of the bridge for two way traffic for starters.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

If indeed it is a correct summary of the analysis (and a thorough analysis is likely to have been the result of a careful consideration of complex data), then I find myself less concerned at the cost if investment and more impressed at the ability to admit that circumstances did not match the speculative estimates and that an earlier decision should be reversed.

I wish more decision makers would admit that earlier decisions should be reversed instead of trying to justify them despite evidence to the contrary.

I'm confident that there are many, many more examples of speculative investments which have not expectations, and on a much more significant scale.

 

[ainsworth74]

I wish more decision makers would admit that earlier decisions should be reversed instead of trying to justify them despite evidence to the contrary.

I'm confident that there are many, many more examples of speculative investments which have not expectations, and on a much more significant scale.

You're not talking about East Coast's catering policy are you?

But I agree, whilst annoying that money has been seemingly wasted, I would rather that those making the decisions decided that they'd made a bad one and reversed it. Rather than blindly continuing and hoping for the best!

On a wider note, I also think that the signage in the new concourse is woeful and hopefully Network Rail will make some alterations at some point in the near future. One thing that we really need is a small departure board at the southern entrance, if you walk in here you have to walk a considerable distance away from the gateline to actually see the departures! Having a small one right by this entrance would be very useful when you're running late.

 

[A-driver]

I used the Cross today, and whilst I enjoyed the splendour of the new trainshed (or concourse shed), I found the toilet provisions to be frustrating. The signs directed me up the stairs to the mezannine, then when I got there they were pointing left, so I immediately went down the stairs (which were on the left) and got back to the concourse. After asking advice, I was told that the toilet was indeed up the stairs and went up to find a single turnstyle and queue of too many people (for a major London terminal) and gave up because by this time it was time to get the train.

Please God, are the good old loo's under platform (I think) 8 stiill there, because if they are I think I will use them.

The toilets are on the ground floor next to platform 9- underneath the pub. Are there more upstairs to then?

 

[Bungle73]

Turnstile? So you have to pay? At St. Pancras across the road they are free.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

You're not talking about East Coast's catering policy are you?

Who? Me?
Do you think I'm the only First Class passenger left on East Coast's evening departures? I've had to share a coach with as many as 4 other passengers some evenings! Positively rammed!

I also think that the signage in the new concourse is woeful and hopefully Network Rail will make some alterations at some point in the near future. One thing that we really need is a small departure board at the southern entrance, . . . . .

I agree.
I posted some months ago a picture of the portable departures screen which was, at that time, at the preferred south western entrance to the departure hall. (It has since gone).

I've also repeatedly advocated a 'track side' departure screen for the benefit of those who either have already passed through the ticket barriers, or who have no need to do so. My preferred example is a cycle owner whose cycle is in either of the cycle-racks and is travelling on a HST in times of disruption. (Its not reasonable, within the reduced announcement time during disruption, to get from concourse to rack then country-end of an HST in the limited turnaround time during these circumstances, unless by luck the departure happens to be from P0 or 1 with the bike on that platform's racks, or from 8 with bike on that platform's racks).

Despite my several 'requests' for a single platform side disply of departures over the last 10 months, I have received exactly zero responses.

 

[yorksrob]

If indeed it is a correct summary of the analysis (and a thorough analysis is likely to have been the result of a careful consideration of complex data), then I find myself less concerned at the cost if investment and more impressed at the ability to admit that circumstances did not match the speculative estimates and that an earlier decision should be reversed.

I wish more decision makers would admit that earlier decisions should be reversed instead of trying to justify them despite evidence to the contrary.

I'm confident that there are many, many more examples of speculative investments which have not expectations, and on a much more significant scale.

To be honest, I never used the footbridge before (before the rebuild - not likely since it didn't have any stairs) and I've never used it since.

Why would they bother getting rid of them ? Most people go to the old barrier line so they could funnel the upper eschelons towards the footbridge and they've got a sort of upper class entrance.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The toilets are on the ground floor next to platform 9- underneath the pub. Are there more upstairs to then?

There are some up on the Mezzannine (after finding them eventually).

Are the old ones still under platform 8 ?