How did the JLE look like from May to November of 1999 when it wasn’t connected to Central London yet? Was it quite empty? Where did people typically travel to and from? Suppose there wasn’t too many connection opportunities at North Greenwich and later Bermondsey.
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Jubilee Line Extension in 1999
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coupwotcoup
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I worked for Express newspapers at the time and on NYE 1999 there was a monster party on the balcony overlooking the Thames.
When everything died down, we sauntered down to Southwark station where I encountered a 'closed in' platform the first time.
Everything was open that night of course so, the services were pretty hectic and we arrived safely at Stratford before heading off to Metropolitan Essex.
When everything died down, we sauntered down to Southwark station where I encountered a 'closed in' platform the first time.
Everything was open that night of course so, the services were pretty hectic and we arrived safely at Stratford before heading off to Metropolitan Essex.
Was that at the old office on Blackfriars Bridge Road? I worked for IPC Media over the road (Stamford Street) around that time. Plenty of Express / IPC booze ups in Doggett's or the Wine Bar
Back o/t: I seem to recall it being quite well used Waterloo <> CW as per the post above.
The Jubilee Line Extension was not unlike Crossrail. Massively late, over budget, hige negative publicity etc etc. People were saying it should be scrapped but once open, all that negativity went away and we wondered how we ever managed without it! It was the same with HS1 and I expect it will be the same with HS2.
There was a huge amount of pressure to get the line open with the Millennium Dome at North Greenwich (another example of a project being over budget, people saying it should be scrapped etc but a massive enabeler for development on what was an awful part of London - a massively contaminated former gas works).
The first stage opened from Stratford to North Greenwich, there's still a plaque in North Greenwich station that was unveiled at the opening. I travelled on the service and it was very quiet, there really wasn't anything at North Greenwich back then! This bit was important because technically the Millennium Dome was served. The service was weekdays only.
If I remember correctly, next the line opened to Bermondsey and then (I think) to Waterloo. Finally through running started in November 1999 but I don't think Westminster station opened until a few days before Christmas.
Central
Member
No reversing point at Bermondsey,line was extended from North Greenwich to Waterloo then full opening in November 99.
I might be wrong but I thought for a few days passengers had to alight at Bermondsey with the trains carrying on to Waterloo to reverse because Waterloo station wasn't fully finished/signed-off for passenger use.
Central
Member
I was working in control tower at SMD at the time and as far as I can remember trains ran passenger to Waterloo.
Yes - that's how it opened. For the first few months, it was North Greenwich to Stratford on weekdays only (except the first weekend, so everyone could have a look) with last trains at about 8pm. North Greenwich had quite a decent rush-hour traffic fairly quickly - even going via Stratford was a decent alternative to what was at the time being badly run by Connex. They were exciting days!
Canary Wharf had decent commuter traffic too - One Canada Square would have been open for about seven years by the time the Jubilee Line began. Obviously it's much, much busier now - but back in 1999 that station looked absurdly big, especially the roundels! And similarly, Stratford was still an important - if very beaten-up - destination.
Wikipedia says that Bermondsey station opened in September and further stations only in November. But I know it isn’t the best source. Maybe we uncovered one of the biggest Tube related mistakes there
Dstock7080
Established Member
LURS records show second stage to Waterloo opened 17 September 1999, however Waterloo station (as said above) didn’t open at this time and services were detrained at Bermondsey, trains running empty to Waterloo for reversing.London Bridge and Southwark also remained closed.
Waterloo station opened afternoon of 24 September and passenger service was extended to there.
London Bridge opened afternoon of 7 October.
Trains had been able to transfer between Neasden and Stratford depots during this time.
Southwark opened with through running, achieved on 20 November 1999.
bramling
Veteran Member
I vaguely remember being on the first through eastbound train, largely by chance as IIRC it ran rather late for some reason. John Self and some other managers were there. He was a proper old-school manager, very different to the current less effective breed. I seem to remember Westminster was still not ready for opening at the time, but the doors may have been opened in error on that first trip IIRC.
Snow1964
Established Member
I did travel on it early on from Stratford end, and the one thing I remember at North Greenwich was station was cold. Normally tube stations are warm from combination of brake heat, train heating, escalator friction etc.
Within few months had started to warm up.
Central
Member
Before the line opened past North Greenwich they used to swap stock between SMD and Neasden in engineering hours topped and tailed by JLE diesel locos.
We went on it the first weekend of the shuttle between Stratford and North Greenwich, which turned round in the centre platform there. Had seen it in the open north of Canning Town running extensive trials and training for many months, there was a local belief there being "Jubilee Line" that they were trains going all the way to Stanmore. Quite considerable crowds that first weekend, but later very quiet until it opened on to Waterloo. This made a significant difference as Canary Wharf was no longer dependent on just the DLR, where quite a proportion of the staff seemed to live down the SW main line to Waterloo, from City working days.
Trivia from initial opening weekend was the Ms Taunton of the time who came along with me being disappointed at the Cadburys chocolate machines installed on the platforms. Apparently the same as elsewhere. An expectation was given of there being some sort of new wonderful 21st Century machines, even new flavours ...
Trivia from initial opening weekend was the Ms Taunton of the time who came along with me being disappointed at the Cadburys chocolate machines installed on the platforms. Apparently the same as elsewhere. An expectation was given of there being some sort of new wonderful 21st Century machines, even new flavours ...
DynamicSpirit
Established Member
Diesel locos? In the tube tunnels? That can't have been very pleasant with the exhaust fumes.
Central
Member
That was in engineering hours.
Maybe not too bad. I recall seeing a Class 66 at Custom House station on the Elizabeth Line during construction, only accessible by long tunnels from Abbey Wood, and I understand it worked on right through the Core, propelling the concreting train, not even just passing through.
contrex
Established Member
I still call Peter Mandelson the Dome Secretary.
That would be the Schöma fleet which all began life as Diesel Hydraulics (Detroit Diesel Series 60 engines) and yes they were fitted with exhaust scrubbers. They have since had mixed fortunes with some being converted to Battery Electric and some stored before all were sold in 2024.
They were certainly strange little machines if you’re used to a mainline loco cab!
Two photos of the LUL Schöma diesels, the cab photo taken by me and a photo of Number 3 on the Epping and Ongar from Wikipedia.
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Dstock7080
Established Member
No, not commissioned until 2011
Not only that, the trains were stopping absolutely at the platform doors - entirely by conventional driver braking. I think the tolerance there is about 12 inches, if not the train has to go on to the next station. In all the time, more than 10 years, that was going on, I think I had one such miss. When auto driving came along, I experienced several, until it was finally sorted out. But the drivers had it spot on from day 1. The door manufacturers incidentally had said that manual positioning was unreliable ...
There are still quiet times on the line, but the timetable does not recognise this and you hang about with the doors open waiting for time. Occasionally, presumably when delayed, you still do get a notably speedy run (100 km/h; 62 mph?), but not as often as in the early years.
Indeed it did, dmncf. The then Engineering Director, Brian Mellitt, had a vision for moving block from the start but when reality was finally accepted, in that there was no chance it would be ready for the intended opening date, there was a last minute rush to get conventional lineside signalling installed. Even then, there wasn't the time to design and fit a system that would provide the intended capacity (which would have needed "three homes and a starter" in old money) - as I recall, the installed system was very basic.
bluegoblin7
Established Member
The original signalling control system for the JLE is preserved at the London Transport Museum Depot, and has recently been recommissioned to allow it to be demonstrated.
'Original' being the envisioned fancy design, or the initially operating basic design?
torontoaddick
Member
There weren’t two different signalling control systems. When the moving block functionality was descoped the distributed Westrace interlockings remained and were used to control the colour light signals and trainstops in addition to their planned functionality of points control and detection, etc. The signalling control system software was modified to accommodate this.
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