Jeremy Corbyn's Traingate

[JamesRowden]

Corbyn just wants a old-fashioned monopoly. Monopolies are just bad. They only suit those scared of the competition and the real world, and those wishing to exercise power over everyone else.

The combination of everyone else is stronger than the one.

 

[CosherB]

Again, dangerous thinking. Lands many people as members of certain organisations in certain parts of the world I won't mention.

Do you work for MI5? Or some other shady underworld organisation ..... Spectre for instance?!

:roll:

 

[HH]

Add some light-touch supervision from Westminster and you end up with taxpayers underwriting the risk and companies not even bothering to pay UK corporation tax on the profits.

It's a triple whammy. Our taxes paying for profits that in some cases aren't declared in the UK leading to increased dividends helping the lavish lifestyles of Directors and major shareholders many of whom themselves aren't domicled here for tax purposes.

These statements are simply untrue with regard to the railways. Firstly most of the risk now sits with the bidders; secondly supervision (from Horseferry Road, not Westminster) is far from light touch; thirdly the companies bidding for the franchises are UK companies, even if the ultimate holding company is foreign, so they pay UK taxes; fourthly there are very few living lavish lifestyles out of dividends from UK railways and that especially pertains to those companies owned by foreign railways.

 

[nuneatonmark]

If he can't work out how to reserve a seat on a train, how can he be trusted to run a country?

 

[oldman]

Indeed. I did ask earlier in the thread what day it was - but it remains unclear.

If this was Sunday, when there was chaos on the line due to the vulnerable person planning self-harm on the RBB...

Then it is utterly sick and twisted that Guardian and Labour Party are using it for political gain.

It was a Thursday actually, so you might look elsewhere for anything 'utterly sick and twisted for political gain'. (A mirror perhaps .)

 

[theironroad]

If he can't work out how to reserve a seat on a train, how can he be trusted to run a country?

Really? Many people travel at short notice or don't buy tickets in advance, or buy a ticket in advance but really don't know which train they will be able to catch due to other commitments.
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The thing that concerns me by far the most is why was the train full and standing...

I don't know for sure, but with peak summer holidays and all the Edinburgh festivals on the go it's a busy time of year. Maybe major disruption on the day?

 

[The Ham]

Being rather pedantic, wasn't this on a service which was (until fairly recently) in a semi nationalised state. During which time although a fair amount of money was paid to the government, very little was done to improve services. Whilst with no extra trains the private company has provided some extra services.

I admit that one reason that it probably didn't do much was because of a government project to replace the trains (about 12 years for IEP rather than about 4 years for GA fleet replacement).

If those are "good" examples of government run rail projects, then those who want a state run railway may have to be careful what they wish for.

(that isn't to say that privately owned run railways are better, you just need to look at Southern for a bad example of that, rather the grass may not be greener or your glasses may have a slight pink hue to them).

 

[theironroad]

Being rather pedantic, wasn't this on a service which was (until fairly recently) in a semi nationalised state. During which time although a fair amount of money was paid to the government, very little was done to improve services. Whilst with no extra trains the private company has provided some extra services.

I admit that one reason that it probably didn't do much was because of a government project to replace the trains (about 12 years for IEP rather than about 4 years for GA fleet replacement).

If those are "good" examples of government run rail projects, then those who want a state run railway may have to be careful what they wish for.

(that isn't to say that privately owned run railways are better, you just need to look at Southern for a bad example of that, rather the grass may not be greener or your glasses may have a slight pink hue to them).

DOR were only temporary custodians on the east coast after gner went the way of national express, failed private attempts after making unrealistic bids. DOR were simply there to keep the trains running until a new private operator could be found.

 

[ainsworth74]

Really? Many people travel at short notice or don't buy tickets in advance, or buy a ticket in advance but really don't know which train they will be able to catch due to other commitments.

Indeed, but more to the point does he have a Senior Railcard to make sure the Labour Parties costs are kept as low as possible?

 

[Tetchytyke]

Why didn't he(or his support team) book tickets in advance?
Presumably the other standard class passengers who had seats did.

People often don't book seats in advance if their travel plans are subject to change at short notice.

And, I can assure you, if you don't reserve a seat in advance (and even if you do, given how often Virgin Trains can't be chewed have problems with their reservation slip printers) on the ECML these days you will be standing all the way from London to York.

It's good to know Jeremy- like the rest of us who have to suffer Stagecoach's overpriced incompetence- managed to arrive awesome though

 

[Wolfie]

People often don't book seats in advance if their travel plans are subject to change at short notice.

And, I can assure you, if you don't reserve a seat in advance (and even if you do, given how often Virgin Trains can't be chewed have problems with their reservation slip printers) on the ECML these days you will be standing all the way from London to York.

It's good to know Jeremy- like the rest of us who have to suffer Stagecoach's overpriced incompetence- managed to arrive awesome though

I agree.

I imagine that VTEC will be asking the Guard (assuming that he/she could actually get through the train and it wasn't actually offered) why Jeremy was not offered a free upgrade - after all the reporting and images are an absolute PR disaster for the company.....

 

[physics34]

Should be travelling in first class. A politician with work to do and aspirations of running the country.

I dont buy this "man of the people" stigma thing that people think politicians should abide with.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I dont buy this "man of the people" stigma thing that people think politicians should abide with.

No, I'd agree with that, but there's no way Corbyn could travel first class, even though he probably should.

I imagine that VTEC will be asking the Guard (assuming that he/she could actually get through the train and it wasn't actually offered) why Jeremy was not offered a free upgrade - after all the reporting and images are an absolute PR disaster for the company.....

I'd imagine Corbyn would have refused it even if he'd been offered it.

CORBYN SITS IN FIRST CLASS WITH STANDARD CLASS TICKET, DOESN'T WANT TO SIT WITH THE PLEBS.

Not gonna happen

 

[The Ham]

I'd imagine Corbyn would have refused it even if he'd been offered it.

CORBYN SITS IN FIRST CLASS WITH STANDARD CLASS TICKET, DOESN'T WANT TO SIT WITH THE PLEBS.

Not gonna happen

Even if Corbyn refused it wouldn't have stopped VTEC issuing a press statement stating that they had offered it to Corbyn and the press travelling with him to enable all their passengers on that service to have a seat (given that there were only about 20 according to the OP). As their guards are entitled to offer to a few people if they feel that there is sufficient space in first class.

It may have lead to Corbyn asking if others could have it rather than him, but somehow I doubt that would have gone down well with the press travelling with him, in that they would have had to have missed out on first class travel.

This would have left less criticism at the door of the TOC.
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DOR were only temporary custodians on the east coast after gner went the way of national express, failed private attempts after making unrealistic bids. DOR were simply there to keep the trains running until a new private operator could be found.

I am aware of that, however given how much praise has been given to DOR by certain sections then you would have thought that they did a lot more than keep the trains running.

As I said, there are plenty of cases of bad private companies. However, public ownership may not be as great as some suggest.

 

[D1009]

OK, from the OP article we know the train was going from London to Newcastle or beyond, and JC was on it accompanied by a cameraman. We don't know for how much of the journey the train was overcrowded, whether he had a reserved seat but chose to give it up for someone else, or whether there were available seats in other parts of the train. If you wanted to be really cynical you could suggest the whole scene was manufactured for the camera.

 

[DarloRich]

If he can't work out how to reserve a seat on a train, how can he be trusted to run a country?

perhaps he should just do what Tory types do: travel first class away from the dirty oiks who vote for them
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Indeed, but more to the point does he have a Senior Railcard to make sure the Labour Parties costs are kept as low as possible?

I am sure I read somewhere his expenses were low becuase he used his railcard/bus pass as much as possible

 

[highdyke]

perhaps he should just do what Tory types do: travel first class away from the dirty oiks who vote for them

Or take up the seats in second, let the oiks sit on the floor as they can't afford the upgrade.

Bob crow used to live in a council house, laudable you may argue on 130k. The flip side of that he was taking up housing from someone that actually needed it.

 

[ainsworth74]

perhaps he should just do what Tory types do: travel first class away from the dirty oiks who vote for them

Interesting could have sworn that this person was Labour leader at the time the photo was take

 

[WatcherZero]

perhaps he should just do what Tory types do: travel first class away from the dirty oiks who vote for them
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I am sure I read somewhere his expenses were low becuase he used his railcard/bus pass as much as possible

Well he was travelling to a party leadership husting and bragging that he was saving money on his MPs expenses so obviously planning to charge the government rather than the party for the expense.

 

[DarloRich]

Interesting could have sworn that this person was Labour leader at the time the photo was take

see above quote

I don't really mind politicians using first class especially if there is a security risk/ business to be conducted but it would be good thing if a few of them actually traveled in the same conditions as thier voters.
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Well he was travelling to a party leadership husting and bragging that he was saving money on his MPs expenses so obviously planning to charge the government rather than the party for the expense.

You assume that as "leader" of the opposition he isn't within his rights to expense the government for his travel

 

[Tetchytyke]

The flip side of that he was taking up housing from someone that actually needed it.

Do people earning £130,000 a year not need housing?

I'm confused.

 

[highdyke]

Do people earning £130,000 a year not need housing?

I'm confused.

They don't need to be in social housing that's for sure, where there are huge waiting lists.

 

[Envy123]

The thing that concerns me by far the most is why was the train full and standing...

Because the difference in house prices between even the home counties and places like Newark is so big, that a lot of commuters don't bat an eyelid on a 90+ minute commute.

 

[Tetchytyke]

They don't need to be in social housing that's for sure

Why not?

The people earning enough to pay full rent pay the council/housing association enough money to be able to support those unable to pay the full rent. Of which there are many, thanks to the bedroom tax.

In reality, of course, Mr Crow was mainly notable because- unlike many other working people in council housing- he chose not to exercise his right to buy the property. Meaning that, when he died, someone else in need got to have it.

 

[Mojo]

Interesting could have sworn that this person was Labour leader at the time the photo was take

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/04/14/article-1377051-0BA1CB4700000578-925_468x286.jpg

Note the missing antimacassar on his seat too...

 

[ScotTrains]

Perhaps he just wanted to be near some sort of train manhole cover he had just found.

 

[highdyke]

Why not?

The people earning enough to pay full rent pay the council/housing association enough money to be able to support those unable to pay the full rent. Of which there are many, thanks to the bedroom tax.

In reality, of course, Mr Crow was mainly notable because- unlike many other working people in council housing- he chose not to exercise his right to buy the property. Meaning that, when he died, someone else in need got to have it.

You have to admire the pantomime logic of the left at times. People in some parts of the country would be a lot better off learning some new skills or becoming more entrepreneurial, rather than buying onto this rubbish. Having lived various parts of the affluent south and south east, the middle ground of the midlands and the north east, the difference is quite marked how some expect others (mainly politicians) to sort their lives out versus those that try their best against all the odds and receive a considerable amount of stick for it. Reverse snobbism is well and truly alive in this country. It's a cop out, lots of people love being crap or average just in case someone says something and there's plenty that will, the north east is the worst for it.

 

[Master29]

You have to admire the pantomime logic of the left at times. People in some parts of the country would be a lot better off learning some new skills or becoming more entrepreneurial, rather than buying onto this rubbish. Having lived various parts of the affluent south and south east, the middle ground of the midlands and the north east, the difference is quite marked how some expect others (mainly politicians) to sort their lives out versus those that try their best all the odds and receive a considerable amount of stick for it. Reverse snobbism is well and truly alive in this country.

It`s called champagne socialism.

 

[WatcherZero]

see above quote

I don't really mind politicians using first class especially if there is a security risk/ business to be conducted but it would be good thing if a few of them actually traveled in the same conditions as thier voters.
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You assume that as "leader" of the opposition he isn't within his rights to expense the government for his travel

You think contesting a party election is a legitimate government business expense?

 

[DarloRich]

You think contesting a party election is a legitimate government business expense?

I don't know what the rules say - I simply point out it may be a legitimate expense, especially if he threw in some parliamentary business on Tyneside.