Issued ticket for out of date Railcard

[Richard1979]

I had my ticket checked by a revenue officer yesterday, and produced my ticket I had purchased online, with a Network Card discount applied. Only when he asked to see my Railcard did it dawn on me that my Railcard expired in October last year. I was apologetic and admitted it was my fault and an oversight, and offered to pay for a full price ticket, however he insisted on reporting me. I honestly felt so ashamed as he read me my rights, like a Police Officer would. This is now driving my anxiety to another level (I suffer at the best of times). I've try to pre-empt the notice to prosecute letter and found evidence of all my previous Railcard purchased for the last 7-8 years, which show the Railcard being renewed at the same time each year. Will this help my case? I also immediately purchased another Railcard yesterday straight after this incident. I've had a look around online and pre-prepared the following response, but would welcome thoughts on the content. Also, from other cases, if they offer an out of court settlement, what am I likely to be looking at? I guess it's a standard 'Witness Statement' I've been provided with, but attach it anyway. The revenue inspector also did not sign it, does that matter?

Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: Notice of Prosecution for Not Having a Valid Railcard

I am writing in response to the notice of prosecution dated [date of prosecution letter] regarding my travel on the 8th of January without a valid railcard.

I deeply regret this oversight and would like to explain that the situation was unintentional. I did purchase a ticket, believing that my Railcard was valid. However, upon inspection, I realised that it had expired. This was a genuine mistake on my part, and I fully acknowledge my responsibility for not ensuring that my railcard was up to date. I would also like to add that I have held Railcards for over 10 years, and I enclosed evidence of all my previous Railcard purchases that I’ve managed to find, which show the previous continuous validity of Railcards. I trust you will take this into account when reviewing this situation. There is a gap between 2020 and 2021 due to COVID and not using the trains. Prior to 2018, I would have purchased these from a ticket office, so unfortunately I can’t provide evidence further back to this, apart from one ordered online in 2015. I have also provided confirmation of my new Railcard purchase, which was made straight after this matter was brought to my attention.

I sincerely apologise for any inconvenience and would like to request the opportunity to settle this matter out of court by paying the difference between the fare paid and the full-price ticket, along with any reasonable administration fees that may be applicable. Please let me know the amount and the process for making this payment.



Thank you for your understanding and consideration. I look forward to your response and hope to resolve this issue promptly.



Yours faithfully,

Thanks in advance!

 

[WesternLancer]

I had my ticket checked by a revenue officer yesterday, and produced my ticket I had purchased online, with a Network Card discount applied. Only when he asked to see my Railcard did it dawn on me that my Railcard expired in October last year. I was apologetic and admitted it was my fault and an oversight, and offered to pay for a full price ticket, however he insisted on reporting me. I honestly felt so ashamed as he read me my rights, like a Police Officer would. This is now driving my anxiety to another level (I suffer at the best of times). I've try to pre-empt the notice to prosecute letter and found evidence of all my previous Railcard purchased for the last 7-8 years, which show the Railcard being renewed at the same time each year. Will this help my case? I also immediately purchased another Railcard yesterday straight after this incident. I've had a look around online and pre-prepared the following response, but would welcome thoughts on the content. Also, from other cases, if they offer an out of court settlement, what am I likely to be looking at? I guess it's a standard 'Witness Statement' I've been provided with, but attach it anyway. The revenue inspector also did not sign it, does that matter?

Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: Notice of Prosecution for Not Having a Valid Railcard

I am writing in response to the notice of prosecution dated [date of prosecution letter] regarding my travel on the 8th of January without a valid railcard.

I deeply regret this oversight and would like to explain that the situation was unintentional. I did purchase a ticket, believing that my Railcard was valid. However, upon inspection, I realised that it had expired. This was a genuine mistake on my part, and I fully acknowledge my responsibility for not ensuring that my railcard was up to date. I would also like to add that I have held Railcards for over 10 years, and I enclosed evidence of all my previous Railcard purchases that I’ve managed to find, which show the previous continuous validity of Railcards. I trust you will take this into account when reviewing this situation. There is a gap between 2020 and 2021 due to COVID and not using the trains. Prior to 2018, I would have purchased these from a ticket office, so unfortunately I can’t provide evidence further back to this, apart from one ordered online in 2015. I have also provided confirmation of my new Railcard purchase, which was made straight after this matter was brought to my attention.

I sincerely apologise for any inconvenience and would like to request the opportunity to settle this matter out of court by paying the difference between the fare paid and the full-price ticket, along with any reasonable administration fees that may be applicable. Please let me know the amount and the process for making this payment.



Thank you for your understanding and consideration. I look forward to your response and hope to resolve this issue promptly.



Yours faithfully,

Thanks in advance!

View attachment 172490

Hi and welcome

Hope the following is of help.

Firstly - do not pre empt this by sending anything to GTR / Thameslink yet. Wait for them to contact you.

I assume you gave a correct postal address where they can write to you and you will get that post over the next 6 to 8 months (but they will probably write sooner - maybe in the next 4 weeks or so) - it is then VITAL that you reply to that.

There are lots of cases of people on here who have been caught with expired Railcards that have been unintentionally used when expiry date forgotten. Have a look at those threads.

Basically the railway want you to (in no special order):
- accept what you did was wrong (in your case ensure they understand it was a genuine mistake)
- pay them what you owe
- learn from what happened
- not make the same mistake again

Anything you can do / say to convince them of those things is the route to avoiding being prosecuted, and GTR seem to almost always settle without prosecuting if you engage with them (and things don't get lost in the post like they did in this recent case!) -

Asked to produce railcard within 14 days, railcard 1yr expired. **UPDATE: Letter Received**

Hi all - update on this below, help is much appreciated Hi all, I have now finally received the letter - please see attached. I decided to wait out their letter then respond. I wanted to ask whether my response is still valid and OK to use for my response? I also wanted to ask whether...

www.railforums.co.uk

Unfortunately for errors like this we see increasingly them not being dealt with by simple solutions like the issuing of a Penalty Fare, but being 'reported for investigation' like this - the reason for this seems to be that people who have forgotten their Railcards (or buy tickets at a Railcard discount without ever having a Railcard, which is a deliberate evasion) are likely to have made the error on more than the one occasion. With on line ticket buying it is easy for the railway to check all past purchases from all retailers to look for where there may be similar errors made, and seek to recoup the lost money for all those occasions. This needs back office work rather than the on the spot Penalty Fare

So you need to be prepared for them to go through all your previous tickets since the Railcard expired and seek to charge you for those fares - they may or may not give credit for the amount paid for the tickets you did buy albeit with a discount you were not entitled to.

So one things to do now is to go through your own records (but keep that private) of any tickets you have bought on line from the point at which your Railcard expired up until the point you corrected things and bought a new Railcard, usually charged at the more punitive Anytime Single Fare price I'm afraid. Get that money saved up because they will want it quickly and in one lump sum, along with the usual 'admin fee' they charge in these situations (maybe around £150).

I hope this info helps. Please post any other question you may have and people will help answer them here and advise you at each step of the process.

found evidence of all my previous Railcard purchased for the last 7-8 years, which show the Railcard being renewed at the same time each year. Will this help my case?

Yes, it will. It's something you can say to them to show this occasion was a mistake, not a deliberate evasion.

I guess it's a standard 'Witness Statement' I've been provided with, but attach it anyway. The revenue inspector also did not sign it, does that matter?

I don't think it will matter that it was not signed when they gave you that slip. We see many cases where people are not even given a slip, so it's helpful you have one. Keep it safe in case you need the ref numbers etc on it.

Finally, it is worth noting that what you have done is an offence, and technically they can prosecute you in the magistrates court, but basically they don't want to do that if you co-operate with them. So it should be straightforward to avoid court action, even though you will have to pay them some money to put right what went wrong.

 

[Richard1979]

Hi and welcome

Hope the following is of help.

Firstly - do not pre empt this by sending anything to GTR / Thameslink yet. Wait for them to contact you.

I assume you gave a correct postal address where they can write to you and you will get that post over the next 6 to 8 months (but they will probably write sooner - maybe in the next 4 weeks or so) - it is then VITAL that you reply to that.

There are lots of cases of people on here who have been caught with expired Railcards that have been unintentionally used when expiry date forgotten. Have a look at those threads.

Basically the railway want you to (in no special order):
- accept what you did was wrong (in your case ensure they understand it was a genuine mistake)
- pay them what you owe
- learn from what happened
- not make the same mistake again

Anything you can do / say to convince them of those things is the route to avoiding being prosecuted, and GTR seem to almost always settle without prosecuting if you engage with them (and things don't get lost in the post like they did in this recent case!) -

Asked to produce railcard within 14 days, railcard 1yr expired. **UPDATE: Letter Received**

Hi all - update on this below, help is much appreciated Hi all, I have now finally received the letter - please see attached. I decided to wait out their letter then respond. I wanted to ask whether my response is still valid and OK to use for my response? I also wanted to ask whether...

www.railforums.co.uk

Unfortunately for errors like this we see increasingly them not being dealt with by simple solutions like the issuing of a Penalty Fare, but being 'reported for investigation' like this - the reason for this seems to be that people who have forgotten their Railcards (or buy tickets at a Railcard discount without ever having a Railcard, which is a deliberate evasion) are likely to have made the error on more than the one occasion. With on line ticket buying it is easy for the railway to check all past purchases from all retailers to look for where there may be similar errors made, and seek to recoup the lost money for all those occasions. This needs back office work rather than the on the spot Penalty Fare

So you need to be prepared for them to go through all your previous tickets since the Railcard expired and seek to charge you for those fares - they may or may not give credit for the amount paid for the tickets you did buy albeit with a discount you were not entitled to.

So one things to do now is to go through your own records (but keep that private) of any tickets you have bought on line from the point at which your Railcard expired up until the point you corrected things and bought a new Railcard, usually charged at the more punitive Anytime Single Fare price I'm afraid. Get that money saved up because they will want it quickly and in one lump sum, along with the usual 'admin fee' they charge in these situations (maybe around £150).

I hope this info helps. Please post any other question you may have and people will help answer them here and advise you at each step of the process.

Yes, it will. It's something you can say to them to show this occasion was a mistake, not a deliberate evasion.



I don't think it will matter that it was not signed when they gave you that slip. We see many cases where people are not even given a slip, so it's helpful you have one. Keep it safe in case you need the ref numbers etc on it.

Finally, it is worth noting that what you have done is an offence, and technically they can prosecute you in the magistrates court, but basically they don't want to do that if you co-operate with them. So it should be straightforward to avoid court action, even though you will have to pay them some money to put right what went wrong.

Thank you so much for this reply, very much appreciated, I'll just hold tight and wait for the letter to come through

 

[Richard1979]

Ok, the notice of intention to prosecute has landed on the doormat this morning. All very much the same as other GTR letters, so assume it's a standard template they use. Details of offence has been stated as:

"That you on 08th Jan 2025, Did enter a train for the purpose of travelling on the railway, and upon inspection at Welwyn Garden City; did not produce a valid ticket entitling travel"

I know everyone says this, but it was a genuine oversight, and I think it was very harsh, having travelled for years with valid tickets and being pursued so heavily for an oversight. Nevertheless, I also know there's nothing I can really do but reply nicely and see what comes back, and I know they will likely hit me with an out-of-court settlement.

Here's the response i've drafted. Any advice on any amendments or further details I should include would be appreciated:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: Notice of Prosecution for Not Having a Valid Railcard

I am writing in response to the notice of prosecution dated 19 March 2025 regarding my travel on 8 January without a valid ticket.

I deeply regret this oversight and would like to explain that the situation was unintentional. I did purchase a ticket, believing that my Railcard was valid. However, upon inspection, I realised that it had expired. This was a genuine mistake on my part, and I fully acknowledge my responsibility for not ensuring that my railcard was up to date. I would also like to add that I have held Railcards for over 10 years, and I enclosed evidence of all my previous Railcard purchases that I’ve managed to find, which show the previous continuous validity of Railcards. I trust you will take this into account when reviewing this situation. There is a gap between 2020 and 2021 due to COVID and not using the trains. Prior to 2018, I would have purchased these from a ticket office, so unfortunately I can’t provide evidence further back to this, apart from one ordered online in 2015. I have also provided confirmation of my new Railcard purchase, which was made straight after this matter was brought to my attention.


I sincerely apologise for any inconvenience and would like to request the opportunity to settle this matter out of court by paying the difference between the fare paid and the full-price ticket, along with any reasonable administration fees that may be applicable. Please let me know the amount and the process for making this payment.


Thank you for your understanding and consideration. I look forward to your response and hope to resolve this issue promptly.

 

[WesternLancer]

Ok, the notice of intention to prosecute has landed on the doormat this morning. All very much the same as other GTR letters, so assume it's a standard template they use. Details of offence has been stated as:

"That you on 08th Jan 2025, Did enter a train for the purpose of travelling on the railway, and upon inspection at Welwyn Garden City; did not produce a valid ticket entitling travel"

I know everyone says this, but it was a genuine oversight, and I think it was very harsh, having travelled for years with valid tickets and being pursued so heavily for an oversight. Nevertheless, I also know there's nothing I can really do but reply nicely and see what comes back, and I know they will likely hit me with an out-of-court settlement.

Here's the response i've drafted. Any advice on any amendments or further details I should include would be appreciated:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: Notice of Prosecution for Not Having a Valid Railcard

I am writing in response to the notice of prosecution dated 19 March 2025 regarding my travel on 8 January without a valid ticket.

I deeply regret this oversight and would like to explain that the situation was unintentional. I did purchase a ticket, believing that my Railcard was valid. However, upon inspection, I realised that it had expired. This was a genuine mistake on my part, and I fully acknowledge my responsibility for not ensuring that my railcard was up to date. I would also like to add that I have held Railcards for over 10 years, and I enclosed evidence of all my previous Railcard purchases that I’ve managed to find, which show the previous continuous validity of Railcards. I trust you will take this into account when reviewing this situation. There is a gap between 2020 and 2021 due to COVID and not using the trains. Prior to 2018, I would have purchased these from a ticket office, so unfortunately I can’t provide evidence further back to this, apart from one ordered online in 2015. I have also provided confirmation of my new Railcard purchase, which was made straight after this matter was brought to my attention.


I sincerely apologise for any inconvenience and would like to request the opportunity to settle this matter out of court by paying the difference between the fare paid and the full-price ticket, along with any reasonable administration fees that may be applicable. Please let me know the amount and the process for making this payment.


Thank you for your understanding and consideration. I look forward to your response and hope to resolve this issue promptly.

add a line towards the end if this is true: eg

'please be assured that there was no intention on my part to deliberately evade the fare owed'

 

[Richard1979]

add a line towards the end if this is true: eg

'please be assured that there was no intention on my part to deliberately evade the fare owed'

Thank you - I'm going to get this sent off, and wait for their response. Hoping that the fact I can provide almost 10 years of railcard continuity before this oversight will be recognised. Appreciate your help with this

 

[AlterEgo]

Why are you evidencing 10 years of Railcard they have not asked about? Did their letter ask for this? If it didn't, don't reference it. It is not necessary and you don't want to highlight gaps anyway.

 

[Richard1979]

I was looking to show my genuine oversight. I have no other gaps in my railcard where I've travelled, and when stopped, this was the only journey I've made since my railcard expired

 

[AlterEgo]

I was looking to show my genuine oversight. I have no other gaps in my railcard where I've travelled, and when stopped, this was the only journey I've made since my railcard expired

They already assume it's an oversight, don't give them ideas at this stage to ask you produce the other railcards or justify the gaps (this is a very common tactic with train companies). Eg: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/swr-£1489-fine-for-expired-railcard-–-seeking-advice.283103/

The letter you got is straightforward and can be dealt with by means of a straightforward reply!

 

[Ducatist4]

Its like speeding though, if you get caught then having a clean licence for twenty years makes no difference.

 

[Hadders]

I'm not sure what evidencing historical railcards is going to achieve. I don't think it'll end up impacting the outcome either way.

I know everyone says this, but it was a genuine oversight, and I think it was very harsh, having travelled for years with valid tickets and being pursued so heavily for an oversight. Nevertheless, I also know there's nothing I can really do but reply nicely and see what comes back, and I know they will likely hit me with an out-of-court settlement.

It's always frustrating when an oversight like this happens but the railcards was three months out of date - that's significant. No-one like being penalised, it does feel unfair but when should a genuine oversight be taken more seriously? It's like getting a speeding ticket or parking ticket - annoying to say the least and feels unfair but best to pay up, chalk it up to experience and move on.

 

[Richard1979]

I've just had a letter back to settle out of court for £155.70, so assume this is made up of £150 and the £5.70 discount a had applied to my ticket. Be glad to put this matter to bed now, but certainly puts me off using the railways

 

[Hadders]

Thanks for updating us. This is a decent result in the circumstances.