Is one ticketing system possible ?

[Halifaxlad]

Under the current arrangement is it not possible to have just one central platform to purchase tickets from ?

Yes I'm referering to both online tickets and paper tickets.

We have too many different machines across the betwork which only makes people think that for example to get a Northern train you have to buy a ticket from a Northern ticket machine.

Ideally National Rail could take the lead on this!

 

[Turtle]

Under the current arrangement is it not possible to have just one central platform to purchase tickets from ?

Yes I'm referering to both online tickets and paper tickets.

We have too many different machines across the betwork which only makes people think that for example to get a Northern train you have to buy a ticket from a Northern ticket machine.

Ideally National Rail could take the lead on this!

Good idea. We could have a single railway organisation for the whole country. British Rail(ways) might be an appropriate name. Hang on, I seem to recollect...

 

[JonathanH]

Under the current arrangement is it not possible to have just one central platform to purchase tickets from ?

So long as it incorporates all the positive features of the diverse mix of platforms at the moment.

 

[30907]

So long as it incorporates all the positive features of the diverse mix of platforms at the moment.

It would certainly need careful specification - though I suspect the "diverse mix" is ignored or even unknown by all but a tiny minority.

 

[yorkie]

Under the current arrangement is it not possible to have just one central platform to purchase tickets from ?

As long as it's the one we offer, I have no objections.

If you are proposing the demise of our booking site, I would object; uf the only booking site was a TOC style site, it result in many people having to pay higher fares, the fastest journey not always being offered and loss of features such as a universal seat selector. No thanks to that!

 

[AlterEgo]

Under the current arrangement is it not possible to have just one central platform to purchase tickets from ?

Yes I'm referering to both online tickets and paper tickets.

We have too many different machines across the betwork which only makes people think that for example to get a Northern train you have to buy a ticket from a Northern ticket machine.

Ideally National Rail could take the lead on this!

Why would only one booking site be desirable? Almost no other European country does this, why should Britain?

 

[tarq]

I would like to see a single system whereby all tickets are recorded in a unified database (like with aviation) but printable as Aztec codes from ticket offices, ticket machines or printers, or shown on device or added to a smartcard.

So regardless of where/how I bought the ticket, I should be able to print / download / update / cancel / show it on any device or any physical location.

 

[Hadders]

Moving to one booking site would stifle innovation and result in increased fares for all.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I agree there should be only one official National Rail one rather than the wasteful duplication of each TOC contracting its own. However the APIs should remain so if commercial sites like Trainsplit or the various corporate systems with their own unique selling point want to exist they can.

 

[fandroid]

I would like to see a single system whereby all tickets are recorded in a unified database (like with aviation) but printable as Aztec codes from ticket offices, ticket machines or printers, or shown on device or added to a smartcard.

So regardless of where/how I bought the ticket, I should be able to print / download / update / cancel / show it on any device or any physical location.

Good point. The universality of the airline ticketing system is remarkable considering what a diverse bunch of operators there are, functioning in an even more diverse bunch of countries, and fiercely competitive too!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Dec 2022 ==

As for TVMs, one feature which should be mandated now is that they should sell the entire range of tickets! Is there any practical reason why this might be impossible?

Another thing I'd like to see is an online site that simply sells the ticket you ask for, without having to invent an itinerary for a journey where exact time is personally unnecessary. A sort of commercial extension of BR fares. After all, that's what TVMs do, and what I always asked for in the dim past when I went to ticket offices

 

[PeterC]

Another thing I'd like to see is an online site that simply sells the ticket you ask for, without having to invent an itinerary for a journey where exact time is personally unnecessary. A sort of commercial extension of BR fares. After all, that's what TVMs do, and what I always asked for in the dim past when I went to ticket offices

I was quite soundly told that EVERY passenger wants an itinerary when I suggested this. Personally I can think of plenty of medium distance journeys where the frequency is good enough to just turn up and go. All I want is whatever a cheap day return is called this week.

2 example journeys made this year ' Romford to Stowmarket and Shipley to York

 

[YorksLad12]

As it stands, you can have two different accounts with TOCs (and others) depending on how you get your tickets. I have long felt that this is wrong. An example would be that the LNER app doesn't recognise or know about journeys where I ask for paper tickets, and vice versa. Similarly, my West Yorkshire MCard smartcard doesn't know about anything I load in via the app.

If we can't get merged accounts within the same TOC/LTA, having "one app to rule them all" (I wrote a blog about such an idea, years ago) is going to be a tough ask, nice though it would be to have.

 

[Nick Ashwell]

I agree there should be only one official National Rail one rather than the wasteful duplication of each TOC contracting its own. However the APIs should remain so if commercial sites like Trainsplit or the various corporate systems with their own unique selling point want to exist they can.

This.

As long as the APIs exist so can third party sellers, and in theory they can come up with their own pricing structures seperate to National Rail if desired.

The API seems rather highly featured (I've never checked but as an integration dev I'm jealous from the surface).

I believe all TOCs should use a central system, and the previous mention of an airline database makes sense, but do all airlines actually feed a single database or is there an aggregator? I would suggest that National Rail' s purchase system should contain all tickets, although I'm not sure how viable that is without extending the API to likely give more than a 200 vs 201 response as most do.

 

[yorkie]

All ticket sales are fed into LENNON, which is a rail industry system maintained by Rail Settlement Plan (RSP), which is a division of the Association of Operating Companies (ATOC; also known as RDG).

I believe all TOCs should use a central system, and the previous mention of an airline database makes sense, but do all airlines actually feed a single database or is there an aggregator? I would suggest that National Rail' s purchase system should contain all tickets, although I'm not sure how viable that is without extending the API to likely give more than a 200 vs 201 response as most do.

I'm not quite sure what is being suggested here?

At present people can choose who to book with.

I don't care if TOCs are forced to abandon their own sites and just use one National Rail system instead, but any suggestion of getting rid of third party sites should be resisted; any such attempt is an attempt to make people pay more money for their journeys. Remember TOCs often charge a premium for longer journeys (usually a very hefty premium in the case of XC) and they are not going to willingly tell us if it's cheaper to split. Only third party split ticketing retailers will do that.

 

[david1212]

While in theory yes in practice DfT/GBR/NR should run two fundamentally different platforms so if issues with one the other ought to be available. Both would be available from each operator website. Scheduled upgrades would always be at different times. The only shared part would be the fares, routing and seat booking database. Copies of the first two databases would be held so no issue if the masters were not accessible. If the latter database was not accessible walk-on fares would still be available just not seat booking or advance tickets.

Currently there is a significant market for third party commercial split-fare systems that reasonably charge a fee. Presuming fares are reformed to be far more consistent there would be at best significantly less demand for these sites. ( Discussion about both if fare reform will actually happen and the actual resulting fares is of course covered by other threads ).

 

[Hadders]

Isn’t the largest retailer a 3rd party site (Trainline)?

 

[Western 52]

Travelling in Israel last month we used Rav Kav cards, which are a bit like an Oyster card, but covering the whole country. Valid on trains trams and buses they are convenient and easy for passengers. I guess though that the highly fragmented nature of transport in the UK would make this a non starter here, and of course could make third party ticket sites redundant....

 

[Hadders]

Travelling in Israel last month we used Rav Kav cards, which are a bit like an Oyster card, but covering the whole country. Valid on trains trams and buses they are convenient and easy for passengers. I guess though that the highly fragmented nature of transport in the UK would make this a non starter here, and of course could make third party ticket sites redundant....

A nationwide PAYG system isn’t possible given the size of the network. We have discussed this several times in the past so I won’t go off topic by discussing it again here.

 

[JonathanH]

Travelling in Israel last month we used Rav Kav cards, which are a bit like an Oyster card, but covering the whole country. Valid on trains trams and buses they are convenient and easy for passengers. I guess though that the highly fragmented nature of transport in the UK would make this a non starter here, and of course could make third party ticket sites redundant....

Britain's land area is over ten times that of Israel. The concept of a nationwide touch in touch out system for the entire country doesn't work. Regional touch in touch out systems do and are likely to be implemented but boundaries have to be drawn somehow.

 

[Egg Centric]

To add to the pile on - even ignoring the domestic advantages of multiple retailers, there are still those who use travel agents to plan their holiday and "sort everything out". Those travel agents need the ability to sort out tickets for their (generally both demanding and ignorant) customers. I don't think it'd be great for the UK to have our own Intourist for all of them to deal with...