Is a 4hr EUS-GLC just around the corner?

[jamesontheroad]

Caught the 1630 Euston - Glasgow Central Pendolino last night, and boy did it flyyyyyy.... we arrived in Glasgow Central at 2033, 7 minutes early, having left Preston about a minute late.

Since this seems (in my experience, seeing it arrive into GLC) to happen on a fairly regular basis, is it possible that this fastest journey time of 4h 10m is a kind of preparation for a scheduled 4h run in a timetable change some time soon? With a clear headway and maybe just a few tweaks it seems so close as to be achievable. Are there any remaining WCML works or planned pathing / capacity improvements that might help VT hit the symbolic journey time of four hours?

 

[87031]

im sure with virgins obsession with slashing journey times it will happen...would be interested to see how many times a week that 1630 actually arrives on time though. they would certainly have to make Carlisle much quicker to pass through to get it under 4hrs....more money for Virgin to spend i think they have spent enough for now i think theres other areas of the network that could do with some funding instead of this....ie more rolling stock on busy routes like Trans Pennine Express.

 

[bengolding]

I've used the 16:30 from Euston-Preston a few times and on at least 2 occasions, it arrived 5 mins ahead of schedule at 18:25. The Preston-Glasgow bit seems quite unpredictable and I think you got it on a rare day to arrive so early. This follows a TPE from Manchester Airport-Glasgow, so if that is running late then the 16:30 is also delayed.

Whilst MKC, Rugby and much of the Trent Valley is fast (rather slow at Stafford), there are still bottlenecks where the train slows considerably, such as through Crewe and Carlisle. If these were improved, then it would certainly be possible to do a timetabled (sub)4 hr run just as GNER used to do a 3h59m Edinburgh-London.

The other thing to note is that patronage on my experience is rather low. People have rightly commented that adding at least a Carlisle stop would generate more revenue. I always travel First, and count barely a handful in First on departing Preston. Was it busy yesterday? The Friday factor may have helped.

 

[EltonRoad]

In my (humble) opinion there is too much emphasis on shorter journey times. Really, so what if 5 minutes is shaved off the journey time?

It would benefit far more people if a few more trains stopped at Rugby and Crewe, rather than the current obsession with hourly non-stop from Euston to Warrington.

If you read Barry Doe in the latest RAIL, this is one of the many ludicrous decisions that was made by one person at the DfT, not by Virgin. That, along with no off-peak trains stopping at Nuneaton, and three trains an hour to Manchester and one to Liverpool. I've never travelled on the Manchester services, but does it need three an hour? I bet they cart around fresh air most of the time.

I would add, though, that's it's good to have say one prestige train a day that runs limited stop.

 

[Greenback]

In my (humble) opinion there is too much emphasis on shorter journey times. Really, so what if 5 minutes is shaved off the journey time?

It would benefit far more people if a few more trains stopped at Rugby and Crewe, rather than the current obsession with hourly non-stop from Euston to Warrington.

If you read Barry Doe in the latest RAIL, this is one of the many ludicrous decisions that was made by one person at the DfT, not by Virgin. That, along with no off-peak trains stopping at Nuneaton, and three trains an hour to Manchester and one to Liverpool. I've never travelled on the Manchester services, but does it need three an hour? I bet they cart around fresh air most of the time.

I would add, though, that's it's good to have say one prestige train a day that runs limited stop.

On the 1234 from Manchester Piccadilly on Tuesday, I was the only person in coach H on departure from Manchest. Four more got on at Stockport, Macclesfiedl and Stoke, which means there was 500% more custom from the intermediate stations!

 

[Lampshade]

On the 1234 from Manchester Piccadilly on Tuesday, I was the only person in coach H on departure from Manchest. Four more got on at Stockport, Macclesfiedl and Stoke, which means there was 500% more custom from the intermediate stations!

VHF was not a good idea, all it ended up with is three trains per hour with hardly any people on them. I travelled from Piccadilly to Stoke the other week and the total number of people on the train could have easily fit on a 323 or a 3 car 158.

 

[Greenback]

Sadly, I don;t think the geography of the UK is suited to high speed lines. If the SCML can be so empty now with three trains to Manchester, and the airline competition destroyed, how can 4tph be justified?

 

[jamesontheroad]

The other thing to note is that patronage on my experience is rather low. People have rightly commented that adding at least a Carlisle stop would generate more revenue. I always travel First, and count barely a handful in First on departing Preston. Was it busy yesterday? The Friday factor may have helped.

It was indeed very busy. Prior to departure from EUS the train manager clearly and repeatedly announced that passengers without a reservation could try their luck in coach E, the only completely free carriage for the whole journey, or go to the appropriate platforms for the 1633 or 165? departure. He also clearly stated that no first class carriage would be declassified for the journey, due to the high number of first class reservations (although whether everyone showed up is another matter).

In standard it was busy, but what was noticeable was the number of people talking to each other or people on their phones and mentioning how fast the train was. At the end of the week, a lot of occasional or infrequent travellers seemed to be have rediscovered the train as an attractive way of getting home.

I would add, though, that's it's good to have say one prestige train a day that runs limited stop.

Precisely. Even if it's just a morning up (to London) and an afternoon/evening down (from London) it is a real selling point, and a major headline grabber for people who might otherwise fly. I reckon everyone who travelled EUS - GLC with me yesterday will have left with a positive impression too, which the WCML has missed for a long time.

VHF was not a good idea, all it ended up with is three trains per hour with hardly any people on them.

This is true. VHF is a great idea, allowing you to just turn up and go, but only if you have a full price flexible ticket. More and more people travel on train-specific advance tickets, and so miss out on the very advantage that VHF offers.

 

[Chafford1]

Once Stafford is sorted out a 4 hour schedule should be easily achievable.

 

[The Planner]

Stafford wont get much done to it, the bypass is a white elephant and the same results can be gained elsewhere for half the cost.

 

[gingerheid]

The other thing to note is that patronage on my experience is rather low.

I would prefer to travel by train when I go to Scotland, but it's just too expensive. I normally end up flying instead Just occasionally I find a decent priced ticket up the East Coast.

More stops would be good too though. The price of fewer stops is inevitably more changes, which are most people's biggest turn off.

They have killed flights from London to the North West though, so they must be getting something right!

 

[jopsuk]

They wouldn't want more stops on the 16:30- it has the stopping pattern it has as a marketing gimmick.