Internet pornography

[MidnightFlyer]

I'm a Gers fan as I'm also a Loyalist and have Proddy relations in Norther Ireland. I just don't follow the religion side really - though if I had to I would be Protestant.

 

[Anon Mouse]

I'm a Gers fan as I'm also a Loyalist and have Proddy relations in Norther Ireland. I just don't follow the religion side really - though if I had to I would be Protestant.

Well thats your heritage! When it comes to the Old Firm I prefer Rangers for the football, but (without wanting a row about it) Politically I am more on the Republican side. My Dad is an (English) Protestant and my Mum is a Catholic, so I guess if I was brought up in Glasgow or Belfast my life would have been hell!

Back onto the topic, I have grown to have a large dislike for Religion of all spectrums and I detest Christianity (but retain respect for those who wish to have those belifs) I just hate the Christian Right trying to control, convert and 'save' everyone. Sex is a perfectly natural and normal need and pornography can fill a gap (no pun intended) to allow people to preform at least a fraction of that need. Men get turned on more visually than Women, so its only natural that most visual porn is directed at Men. Some porn is disgusting and degrading, but what the prudish Christian Right fail to realise is that a certain type of person does like disgusting and degrading things done to themselves. They also seem to forget that sex is fun, joyful and wonderful and a thing that everybody needs. How can a natural need and function be a Sin?

hope this ramble makes sense!

 

[CarterUSM]

Well thats your heritage! When it comes to the Old Firm I prefer Rangers for the football, but (without wanting a row about it) Politically I am more on the Republican side. My Dad is an (English) Protestant and my Mum is a Catholic, so I guess if I was brought up in Glasgow or Belfast my life would have been hell!

Don't kid yourself! Glasgow really is a "pantomine" version of Belfast, though still reasonably dangerous, but I digress! As to porn, I can take it or leave it, but I do find it of interest and enjoyable too.

 

[Nick W]

I am a Christian, and i am glad that this thread (with a couple of minor blips) is keeping away from the "Knock the believers" fashion. Actually, Christianity does not have very much to say about pornography by itself, but emphasises the approach that we should treat others as we would like to be treated ourselves. If people make the material willingly, and are willing to share it (in full knowledge) there is really no problem from a Christian point of view. However, coercion of any kind, or sharing "private" videos is wrong however you look at it.
As a former Marriage Counsellor, I can confirm that pornography can cause severe troubles for both individuals and relationships, but that it can also help people, and be as trivial as having a cup of tea. And the same is true of alcohol, and, say, football! Where there is the potential for trouble, it can stir it up. What I believe society needs is not censorship, but a greater awareness of how to spot when people are having troubles, and a greater willingness to offer help and support.

I am an Christian to and am very interested in your viewpoint (and I guess this will serve to show forum members that us Christians are just as capable at coming up with and expressing our own views, agreements and disagreements). Any chance you can elaborate more on how it can help the relationship, please?

Personally my views stem from what Jesus is quoted as saying in Matthew 5

27 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’[e] 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

I don't think the literal meaning is intended, but I do believe this would exclude pornography.

 

[Anon Mouse]

ach well, off th Hell I go.....at least its nice and warm.

Its interesting, the Bible is all about forgiveness but in the same breath you are condemmed into Hell.

well, if you want to belive that stuff, then you are entitled to that and I respect you for that. The same way as I respect those who belive that a Haggis is a wee beastie with three legs and who belive in the Loch Ness Monster!

 

[yorksrob]

My thought's are that If God, (if he exists) made us all beautiful, then there wouldn't be any need for porn, because we'd all be too busy sleeping with everyone. Porn is a result of the imperfection of the human race. And that's God's fault ( if he exists.).

 

[Ivo]

Being autistic, I would take the literal meaning as granted, and thus think that the Bible indirectly promotes self-amputation! (Without meaning to offend the believers, that is ridiculous.) From the sounds of it, this would exclude it, but in all honesty I feel that it is unreasonable to exercise such a rule. It is within (hetero) male nature to allow one's eyes to casually drift towards a certain pair of female organs; is it not?

I would also agree with yorksrob's point. And as for going to "Hell", I have never looked at such material and never will, but based on the Bible quote above even I am on a one-way trip to Satan's Land.

 

[Anon Mouse]

Don't kid yourself! Glasgow really is a "pantomine" version of Belfast, though still reasonably dangerous, but I digress! As to porn, I can take it or leave it, but I do find it of interest and enjoyable too.

Hmmm my point came out a little wrong. I was not downplaying any effects of the troubles. I was refer to Football's link with Northern Ireland's politics and religious issuies.

Indeed some of whats on those X-rated sites are interesting and enjoyable!

 

[Nick W]

Its interesting, the Bible is all about forgiveness but in the same breath you are condemmed into Hell.

Very true, that's the point about being saved (from condemnation) as a result of forgiveness.

My thought's are that If God, (if he exists) made us all beautiful, then there wouldn't be any need for porn, because we'd all be too busy sleeping with everyone. Porn is a result of the imperfection of the human race. And that's God's fault ( if he exists.).

I agree with pretty much all of that. On the last sentence, is the maker of a car to blame if someone drives off a cliff through careless driving?

I think a couple of things need to be established. The internet did not invent porn, and before the internet there was a wide ranging and multi million pound pornographic industry. Pornography has also existed for as long as photography has existed. I'll address the points you've raised.

1 - addiction in terms of wasted time? How about drinking, gambling and shopping then.
2 - loss of self-esteem. Anything to back that up? I've been in two relationships, and around those and within those relationships pornography has not negatively affected my self-esteem.
3 - I've heard of mention of this before, but can still just as easily as before in life function in this manner.
4 - Child pornography and human trafficking, you may be confusing this with prostitution I fear as mainstream pornography comes from a heavily regulated and legally aware business. Sure you can find unscrupulous stuff, but most people are looking for a quick Google and a quick shufty!
5 - people in the porn industry make a concious decision to do that job, and it can be very well paid.
6 - STIs and lack of sexual health are far more associated with the general population. These people are very careful in preparation, as opposed to a careless drunken one-night stands.
7 - many performers are known for their specialist area, something they do unique to them, or in their own way. I don't think anybody forces them to do it, otherwise everyone would do things like scat, violence and bondage, which is not the case. There are many female performers who will only perform with other women and not even have any sexual intercourse filmed.
8 - tenuous, I know families fall out over jobs in the church. Shall we shut down and regulate them?
9 - The way the sexes are viewed is affected far more by the gaggles of orange slappers coated in Max Factor, drinking to excess and acting with debauchery across the country most nights of the week. I don't think anybody looks down on women because of something they've seen a woman do in a porn film.

1. True
2. http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~db=all~content=a903395140
3. Probably best to speak to Oswyntail as he will have dealt with such cases
4. The point is, there is at least some human trafficking within the porn industry and it's a lot easier to obtain child porn where there's a healthy adult porn industry. It's a lot harder to regulate just the bad stuff then to totally illegalise it.
5. People make conscious decisions not to wear seatbelts and to take harmful drugs. I agree a line has to be drawn somewhere but would move porn to the other side of the line.
6. True, but STIs still emerge.
7. There will be at least a few people who wouldn't be considered for most jobs so have to stay in the industry, but aren't considered good enough to have any bargaining power who are coerced into such things.
8. Fair enough
9. True, but isn't this sort of behaviour perpetuated by media?

 

[Oswyntail]

.... Any chance you can elaborate more on how it can help the relationship, please?
....

Well. In my experience, most, if not all, relationship problems come down to lack of communication. With sex, many can be too shy to say what they feel, or want, and can be so unsure of themselves that they feel they cannot object when a partner suggests something they do not like. Rather than having to say "I would like you to do this", it is sometimes easier, watching a porn film together to say "That looks nice", and less confrontational to say "Well I wouldn't like it!". But it should be a joint act - no one should be coerced into watching porn if they don't want.
As for the quote from Matthew, I have always understood the first part to be along the lines of "The law deals in black/white absolutes, but we all have flaws even if they are unseen, so let's have some general understanding before we start condemning each other". And the following passage is so at odds with Jesus' usual teaching that (IMHO) it has to be ironic.
Oh, and Happy Easter

 

[SS4]

To be fair I think religion is more dangerous than porn. I'm a staunch atheist, but have morals as anyone else, yet I find atheism to talk more morals etc than the biggest selling fiction book of all time - AKA the Bible.

Agreed. It comes to something when, after we say we're atheist, we have to define that we're not immoral which is testament to religion hijacking it. Don't get me wrong it's done some good but it's time has passed now

 

[Ivo]

I may be wrong, but I think that it was predicted in about 1850 that by the year 2000 religion would be a thing of the past... Does that sound right to anyone?

Anyway, see as Oswyntail put it, I'll echo it... Happy Easter

Or, for non-Christians such as myself, Happy Chocolate Egg Day everyone I can't have mine for another week though because everyone in my house is having them at once and one person is away until Saturday...

 

[Eng274]

30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away.

I'd say that was a solid no to pornography then..

 

[Ivo]

What would happen if someone's right hand was broken/sprained and twitched anyway? Or if the left hand committed the "offence"?

 

[yorksrob]

I agree with pretty much all of that. On the last sentence, is the maker of a car to blame if someone drives off a cliff through careless driving?

Maybe not. But if the car maker builds a car with dodgy steering, they are to blame (to an extent) if the driver keeps swerving all over the road .

 

[Nick W]

Oooh didn't realise it was Easter when I posted. Happy Easter to you all!

it was predicted in about 1850 that by the year 2000 religion would be a thing of the past

Sounds very right - at the same time they were convinced that many parts of the bible were historically inaccurate and even some churches were writing off the parts of the bible they didn't like. Since then they've dug up more and more evidence which collaborates with the bible, to the point at which the book of Acts is considered 100% reliable source for the parts describing the background of different nations at the time. Christianity is certainly growing - there were a good 200-300 people at the service today at a church that's founded 2 new churches in 2 decades.

Maybe not. But if the car maker builds a car with dodgy steering, they are to blame (to an extent) if the driver keeps swerving all over the road .

True, but we Christians believe that the world was created perfect until the fall, which was the fault of humans.

Well. In my experience, most, if not all, relationship problems come down to lack of communication. With sex, many can be too shy to say what they feel, or want, and can be so unsure of themselves that they feel they cannot object when a partner suggests something they do not like.

I would say a relationship like that has serious problems from the start.

As for the quote from Matthew, I have always understood the first part to be along the lines of "The law deals in black/white absolutes, but we all have flaws even if they are unseen, so let's have some general understanding before we start condemning each other". And the following passage is so at odds with Jesus' usual teaching that (IMHO) it has to be ironic.

Luke 13
22 Then Jesus went through the towns and villages, teaching as he made his way to Jerusalem. 23 Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”
He said to them, 24 “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’

“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’

I'll totally agree with you about the lack of condemnation despite the fact that we're all flawed.

Romans 8
1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
...
12 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

 

[SouthEastern-465]

Porn certainly helps my relationship.

a) It helps relive the size of my testicles when my missus isn't in the mood
b) She knows I watch it (although probably not as much as I do)

Basically our relationship is great, if you fancy a shag and the missus doesn't, there's no need to row, just watch some porn and rub one out.

Problem solved, let's try not to be too moralistic here, it skews the argument completely. The day I stop watching porn will be the day die because that would mean I don't find women sexy anymore

Theres some VERY honest advice!

 

[HST Power]

Incredibly honest! Speaking the truth, I like that!

 

[Rugd1022]

Strikes me that half the world is busy making / watching / enjoying porn, while the other half is just as busy avoiding it / hoping it will go away / in denial that it even exists and that a lot of people get enjoyment out of it, on lots of different levels....

 

[Dennis]

One of the good things about internet porn is that every imaginable fetish is catered for somewhere; it's an all inclusive show nowadays. Having said that, there is an awful lot of really ropey porn out their.

So what sites would anyone recommend?

 

[90019]

One of the good things about internet porn is that every imaginable fetish is catered for somewhere; it's an all inclusive show nowadays. Having said that, there is an awful lot of really ropey porn out their.

So what sites would anyone recommend?

I'd post links to some more obscure stuff, but I think I'd get in trouble


I think porn is like most things; it's best in moderation.

 

[starrymarkb]

I'd post links to some more obscure stuff, but I think I'd get in trouble

Rule 34?

 

[ainsworth74]

Rule 34?

NO exceptions!

 

[90019]

Rule 34?

Hell yeah!

 

[Anon Mouse]

One of the good things about internet porn is that every imaginable fetish is catered for somewhere; it's an all inclusive show nowadays. Having said that, there is an awful lot of really ropey porn out their.

So what sites would anyone recommend?

quite a few, but maybe not best to share on a public forum, dont want to courrupt the younuns on here! lol
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Porn certainly helps my relationship.

a) It helps relive the size of my testicles when my missus isn't in the mood
b) She knows I watch it (although probably not as much as I do)

Basically our relationship is great, if you fancy a shag and the missus doesn't, there's no need to row, just watch some porn and rub one out.

Problem solved, let's try not to be too moralistic here, it skews the argument completely. The day I stop watching porn will be the day die because that would mean I don't find women sexy anymore

Once you get married you find yourself looking at porn more when the sex tap is turned off!

 

[j0hn0]

Once you get married you find yourself looking at porn more when the sex tap is turned off!

Well, I'm 34 and it's been drip feeding only since about 27!

 

[Minilad]

In my opinion organised religion has caused more division, death and destruction than porn could ever do so lets ban religion on the internet. or maybe give it the .GOD domain then at least sensible rational people who don't live their lives by a fictional book can easily avoid it.

 

[SS4]

In my opinion organised religion has caused more division, death and destruction than porn could ever do so lets ban religion on the internet. or maybe give it the .GOD domain then at least sensible rational people who don't live their lives by a fictional book can easily avoid it.

Loath as I am to admit it a blanket ban would be hypocritical. I'd give it a special domain and make all religious text 15 or 18 on the grounds of violence. I wonder how many other children's books glorify stoning the unbeliever?

 

[Oswyntail]

In my opinion organised religion has caused more division, death and destruction than porn could ever do so lets ban religion on the internet. or maybe give it the .GOD domain then at least sensible rational people who don't live their lives by a fictional book can easily avoid it.

Loath as I am to admit it a blanket ban would be hypocritical. I'd give it a special domain and make all religious text 15 or 18 on the grounds of violence. I wonder how many other children's books glorify stoning the unbeliever?

Which is why the material should be freely available! If you actually read the major religious texts, you will see that the main thing they all have in common is that they advocate peaceful lives and treating others as you would wish to be treated yourself. Yes, there are violent bits, but they tend to be in the historical rather than religious sections. Do not blame the religious thought for the excesses of the interpreters. And, as for "sensible rational people", well a) it is quite sensible and rational to believe in peace and tolerance and b) if you dig deep enough, even people like Hawkins, Cox and Dawkins have to accept a leap of faith at the basis of their thoughts - they would just rather not call it "faith"

 

[Anon Mouse]

THey advocate peacefull life but breed hatred into the belivers. Religious texts preach that war is bad, but then most wars are releated to religion. The problem is that a large amount of belivers think that only their belif is true, correct and just and try and force their views onto others often using violence.

Christianity is supposed to be about peace, love and understanding but througout the years missionaries have been sent to force their religion onto others, different sects of the Christian Church don't agree with each other and fight with each other.

A great man once said "Religion is the Opiuim of the Masses"