Intercity 125 Acceleration (50-90 MPH)

[smiffy9373]

Tried it this afternoon. 50-90 in 1m50s. That's the time from 50 to 90. Not starting to accelerate from 50.

 

[DasLunatic]

Tried it this afternoon. 50-90 in 1m50s. That's the time from 50 to 90. Not starting to accelerate from 50.

How many coaches did you have? My 50-90 took just shy of two minutes with eight MkIIIs and EMT powercars.

But I digress. Basically, the only way the two could be comparable is if you filled your car's boot with lead, which will weigh your car down. Bear in mind that's just with the powercars.

 

[Murph]

But I digress. Basically, the only way the two could be comparable is if you filled your car's boot with lead, which will weigh your car down. Bear in mind that's just with the powercars.

Even equipping the M5 with a trailer and pushing the combined weight up to the 8.25 tonnes allowed with an old B+E license (giving approx 60 bhp per tonne). it would still have a pretty good chance of beating a IC125 set in theoretical 0–50 and 50–90 races (and braking the 8.25 tonne combo from 90 would likely be entertaining even with fancy M-car brakes, assuming you actually made it to 90 without the trailer introducing you to the landscape).

 

[notadriver]

Once the speed is high enough that the v-squared component of kinetic energy dominates, the power to weight ratio is almost everything, if the power can actually be delivered (it can't be delivered past a certain speed in the case of the car). The acceleration is strictly limited by the rate of energy gain divided by the mass (i.e. the power to weight ratio). The Civic simply isn't geared to deliver its peak power at speeds above 100 mph.

This makes no sense to me. Power is what is needed to attain high speeds in a car and at the Civics geared top speed the engine will be spinning at an RPM giving full engine output.

Power from the engine in a car does not reduce past a certain speed. Drag is what becomes the limiting factor.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[cjmillsnun]

Well I did say a small family car with an engine output of roughly 80 bhp. Your car has 140 bhp - hardly the same.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have a fiesta diesel. It is not fast by any stretch of the imagination however in acceleration terms 50-90 it would leave most stock for dust including a javelin. The main reason being far superior traction
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

There is no way a 125 would ever gain or pass an M5, the M5 is a 200+mph car and believe me accelerates hard right up to that speed.

*electronically limited to 155mph

 

[smiffy9373]

How many coaches did you have? My 50-90 took just shy of two minutes with eight MkIIIs and EMT powercars.

But I digress. Basically, the only way the two could be comparable is if you filled your car's boot with lead, which will weigh your car down. Bear in mind that's just with the powercars.

Had 2+8. Perhaps I'll have another go when we get our 2+4s. That should be much more fun!

 

[fowler9]

Sounds a bit far fetched to me. I can't imagine a train out accelerating a high powered modern performance car in any speed range unless we are talking some new Maglev. I'm not saying that as a motorist, I can't drive and am not a car fan.

I did however once by a motoring magazine as it featured a race between an RAF Tornado and a Ferrari F40 down a runway. The Tornado won although of course the Ferrari was in front at first. I don't think it would have been the same with a train.

As another aside my ex's dad had a Saab 95 which was apparently one of the fastest accelerating cars at motorway speeds above 50 and I still don't think a HST would catch it, not even if everyone was sat down and strapped in which they would have to be.

 

[notadriver]

I have a fiesta diesel. It is not fast by any stretch of the imagination however in acceleration terms 50-90 it would leave most stock for dust including a javelin. The main reason being far superior

Is it the 1.4 with 70 bhp ? The quoted top speed of this vehicle is 100 mph.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[robbeech]

Attach the M5 to some rails and add the necessary weight on the back to it to keep the ratio the same as the HST. THEN, the hst will do a better job.

The whole thread is rather silly isn't it.

As for sprinter vans, i had a remapped 316 once. That happened when you pressed the go pedal.

 

[fowler9]

Attach the M5 to some rails and add the necessary weight on the back to it to keep the ratio the same as the HST. THEN, the hst will do a better job.

The whole thread is rather silly isn't it.

As for sprinter vans, i had a remapped 316 once. That happened when you pressed the go pedal.

It is a bit nuts, I would like to see some HST drag racing though. Ha ha.

 

[Darandio]

This thread is bizarre.

Going flat out, 0 to 125 mph for an unmodified F10 is about 14s and 50 to 90 mph is about 4s.

I'd have thought that an HST driver who happened to be an F10 owner would know that it's not even close.

Which points more to the fact that the OP drives neither.

 

[Footplate1]

I have a fiesta diesel. It is not fast by any stretch of the imagination however in acceleration terms 50-90 it would leave most stock for dust including a javelin. The main reason being far superior traction
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


*electronically limited to 155mph

My M5 is delimited and I recently clocked 207mph on the autobahn.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

This thread is bizarre.

Going flat out, 0 to 125 mph for an unmodified F10 is about 14s and 50 to 90 mph is about 4s.

I'd have thought that an HST driver who happened to be an F10 owner would know that it's not even close.

Interesting though isn't it?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Even equipping the M5 with a trailer and pushing the combined weight up to the 8.25 tonnes allowed with an old B+E license (giving approx 60 bhp per tonne). it would still have a pretty good chance of beating a IC125 set in theoretical 0–50 and 50–90 races (and braking the 8.25 tonne combo from 90 would likely be entertaining even with fancy M-car brakes, assuming you actually made it to 90 without the trailer introducing you to the landscape).

That's something I would like to see! Thank you for your calculated answers!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Which points more to the fact that the OP drives neither.

I drive both on a daily basis, you jealous?

 

[Darandio]

I drive both on a daily basis, you jealous?

Not at all, i've no desire for either.

However, do you really expect me to believe you? Given that your first post was to give this advice to someone potentially wanting to become a driver?

Do you long to feel the "boost rush" of a 142 class accelerating away from a station?

Do you have a desire to do some footplate?

Do you have a desire to feel the power and torque of a 150 class as it hits full turbo boost?

20+ years of 'footplate' experience and drove 'Intercity 125's' in BR days?

Pull the other one.

 

[Johncleesefan]

Not at all, i've no desire for either.

However, do you really expect me to believe you? Given that your first post was to give this advice to someone potentially wanting to become a driver?



20+ years of 'footplate' experience and drove 'Intercity 125's' in BR days?

Pull the other one.

Hmm I have to concur, whatwith the strange threads you have been starting. Footplate feels like a fishy fella

 

[Footplate1]

Not at all, i've no desire for either.

However, do you really expect me to believe you? Given that your first post was to give this advice to someone potentially wanting to become a driver?



20+ years of 'footplate' experience and drove 'Intercity 125's' in BR days?

Pull the other one.

Have you never thought the advice was given tongue in cheek? :roll:

I did drive 125's back in the BR days and still drive them today.

 

[Cowley]

The whole thread is rather silly isn't it.

As for sprinter vans, i had a remapped 316 once. That happened when you pressed the go pedal.

Nice. Hoping to get a 316 next time and remap it too.

Re HSTs, what is all this talk of boost/full boost? Is this referring to the turbos or is this some other thing like some magic James Bond type button which you only press when things get desperate?

 

[cjmillsnun]

Is it the 1.4 with 70 bhp ? The quoted top speed of this vehicle is 100 mph.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No it's the 1.6

 

[carriageline]

Merh, I'll hop in my *slightly tuned* RS6 and watch you both from the rear view mirror!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Footplate1]

Merh, I'll hop in my *slightly tuned* RS6 and watch you both from the rear view mirror!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Unless it's a tuned C7 RS6 (2013-) it wouldn't stand a chance even with 700bhp. See the video below;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJFKKB1b5Ss

Most F10 M5's have close to 600bhp out of the factory the standard figures by BMW are very conservative. The RS6 has huge transmission loss and just generally isn't as fast, I drove the C7 RS6 before buying the M5 and you can't compare the two.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Nice. Hoping to get a 316 next time and remap it too.

Re HSTs, what is all this talk of boost/full boost? Is this referring to the turbos or is this some other thing like some magic James Bond type button which you only press when things get desperate?

Yes referring to the turbo boost pressure and the HST certainly has that sudden boost pressure to surge forward.

 

[Philip Phlopp]

Yes referring to the turbo boost pressure and the HST certainly has that sudden boost pressure to surge forward.

It's school holiday time, isn't it.

The diesel engine in the HST you allegedly drive isn't actually connected to the wheels of your train. The engine speed, turbo boost pressure and 'surge' means absolutely nothing, in fact I'm sure the MTU engines used sequential turbocharging and the Paxman VP185 units have two stage turbocharging, so there's not a massive spike in output but a wider torque band across the rev range (though I don't have anything to do with diesel engines now).

The great big diesel engine drives an alternator, this generates electricity which is sent via fairly sophisticated control electronics to the traction motors, to gain any sort of surge, the control electronics would need to increase the power sent to the traction motors significantly.

30 years of HST use and the only surge I've ever felt is the rear power car pushing and snatching when the pair of powercars aren't setup just correctly.

 

[Cowley]

Yes referring to the turbo boost pressure and the HST certainly has that sudden boost pressure to surge forward.

Which company do you drive HSTs for? Are they MTU or VP185 ones?

 

[Footplate1]

Which company do you drive HSTs for? Are they MTU or VP185 ones?

Crosscountry and they are MTU.

 

[notadriver]

Crosscountry and they are MTU.

Which part of the line can between Bristol and Exeter is cleared for 125 mph ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[cjmillsnun]

Crosscountry and they are MTU.

Funny, but over here you mention

I've been doing footplate for over 20 years I was driving the high speed intercity 125 trains back in the British rail days.

Notice the past tense.

On the same thread in this post you said

It can be annoying and repetitive at times especially on a warm day driving round Leeds in a 142!

which would tend to imply you work for Northern.

So do you work for XC or Northern?

 

[Footplate1]

Funny, but over here you mention



Notice the past tense.

On the same thread in this post you said

It was past tense as I was talking about the BR days :roll:

which would tend to imply you work for Northern.

So do you work for XC or Northern?

I worked for Northern for 4 years and now work for XC. Stopping at the same
Stations over 90 times per day isn't my cup of tea, I prefer the intercity runs.

 

[Cowley]

I've got a feeling that the only things you're in charge of are a skateboard and a packet of Top trumps.

 

[Mark62]

HST is around 8 minutes to 125mph. IEP should be somewhere around 5 minutes.

And yet according to estimated journey times from London to Bristol TM when the line in fully electrified, journey times will be slower in 2018/2019 than they were 1990 and before.
Estimated journey times will be 90 minutes for the new 'faster't trains. This is slower than the HST timetables many years ago.
Why is this?
If I remember correctly the hst did it in 41 minutes from Paddington to Swindon.
There was a regular service that did it easily in 45 minutes. I'll need to dig out my old timetables to get the precise timings
On has to ask. Why are the new faster trains unable to match the timings of diesel trains running 30 years ago?

 

[Philip Phlopp]

And yet according to estimated journey times from London to Bristol TM when the line in fully electrified, journey times will be slower in 2018/2019 than they were 1990 and before.
Estimated journey times will be 90 minutes for the new 'faster't trains. This is slower than the HST timetables many years ago.
Why is this?
If I remember correctly the hst did it in 41 minutes from Paddington to Swindon.
There was a regular service that did it easily in 45 minutes. I'll need to dig out my old timetables to get the precise timings
On has to ask. Why are the new faster trains unable to match the timings of diesel trains running 30 years ago?

London Paddington to Swindon is timed for 58 to 59½ minutes currently on HST125 timings.

London Paddington to Bristol with stops at Reading, Didcot, Swindon, Chippenham and Bath Spa is around 104 minutes with an HST, IEP can cut that to 75-76 minutes.

This is all discussed in considerable length on the IEP thread.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Where the 'performance' of the HST's (or any train for that matter) impresses my is on long inclines. The steepest gradients which HSTs encounter on a daily basis will be the Devon banks, but these don't present the opportunity to accelerate to as high a speed as possible over a long and sustained climb. I reckon the most impressive climb is that out of Inverness, which (with a few breaks) is 22 miles at 1 in 60 and 1 in 70.

On one of the first journeys with the then new MTU engines, I was a passenger who was in no doubt that I'd never been rushed up to Slochd Summit as quickly nor been shoved round the curve over Culloden Viaduct at such speed before! And I never have, since.

Ironically, one of the power cars on that exceptional journey kept cutting out over the remainder of that journey, and was swapped out at Waverley Stn.

 

[notadriver]

The MTU engines are definitely giving the sets more go than Valentas - I suppose they need to given that HST sets on the ECML are 2+9 formations now ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk