Information for GTR Southern passengers during strike (no DOO discussion)

[infobleep]

Blanket declassification for the strike day was publicised on the website and tweeted, so many folk would have been aware of this prior to the guard making an announcement.

Rightly, I suspect the RPIs have been told/advised to tread lightly whilst there remain a significant number of cancellations on the network, and hence many crowded trains.

Today is the ninth consecutive working day that the 19.23 Brighton - Newhaven Harbour has been cancelled, along with it's associated early evening diagram.

How do you get round it?

Although I knew first class was declassified, I did check to make sure just in case. The first class on the 440s are better but again no plug sockets.

Yet new GTR stock has sockets at every seat or pair of seats

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[physics34]

What did you expect, any semblance of quality and consistency? Southern are far from interested in such.

it saddens me. Once again there is no real thought for the passengers. I hope whoever takes over this franchise eventually, will improve areas like this... however, i do understand the flexibility of the fleet also being used on metro works.

Was in SWT first class the other day (a 444) and although its not spectacular, at least there are higher levels of comfort.

 

[Bishopstone]

How do you get round it?

I use my car a lot more, and the train a lot less.

 

[Deepgreen]

it saddens me. Once again there is no real thought for the passengers. I hope whoever takes over this franchise eventually, will improve areas like this... however, i do understand the flexibility of the fleet also being used on metro works.

Was in SWT first class the other day (a 444) and although its not spectacular, at least there are higher levels of comfort.

Me too. No strategic thinking, no passenger focus and no apparent accountability.

 

[infobleep]

I use my car a lot more, and the train a lot less.

That's a shame but not surpsing if GTR cannot provide enough staff for a reliable service.

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[GodAtum]

it saddens me. Once again there is no real thought for the passengers. I hope whoever takes over this franchise eventually, will improve areas like this... however, i do understand the flexibility of the fleet also being used on metro works.

Was in SWT first class the other day (a 444) and although its not spectacular, at least there are higher levels of comfort.

I know. I purposely get a class 444 or 159, they are so comfy!

 

[Deepgreen]

On the issue of Southern's continuing misleading assertion that "conductor sickness" is the cause of so many cancellations at the moment, I have written to them to complain about their "spin", when it is mainly Southern's refusal that striking staff can be allowed to work on rest days that is the cause. This "explanation" has also been taken up by National Rail as the cause. Surely passengers must see through this long-running "sickness" cover story?

 

[ungreat]

On the issue of Southern's continuing misleading assertion that "conductor sickness" is the cause of so many cancellations at the moment, I have written to them to complain about their "spin", when it is mainly Southern's refusal that striking staff can be allowed to work on rest days that is the cause. This "explanation" has also been taken up by National Rail as the cause. Surely passengers must see through this long-running "sickness" cover story?

Nope...they just assume "strike"
A high proportion of passengers are quite simply self obsessed imbeciles who see any disruption as a personal attack on their own so important lives. The truth rarely gets considered. If you think im being harsh or judgemental just look at Twitter....

 

[sarahj]

removed as link wrong

 

[sarahj]

Some see through the lies

 

[dgl]

Some see through the lies

Ha Ha!

 

[jimbo99]

Nope...they just assume "strike"
A high proportion of passengers are quite simply self obsessed imbeciles who see any disruption as a personal attack on their own so important lives. The truth rarely gets considered. If you think im being harsh or judgemental just look at Twitter....

Correct, they assume "strike". Most them do jobs where they have little say over management decisions. Their remedy, if they are unhappy with their pay/conditions is to get another job. No doubt some of them regard striking railway people as "self-obsessed".

As for personal attack, at best passengers regard themselves as the "collateral damage" in a dispute between railway management and railway workers. At worst, they do take the attack personally. A strike is only called because of the disruption it will have on the service that passengers depend on.

As for the "truth", the only truth they care about is "is my training running on time". Whether it's cancelled because of conductor sickness, lack of driver, strike is really an internal issue. I'm sure most of the time they don't really believe the story anyway. I certainly don't.

"imbeciles"? I'm sure many passengers do feel a sense of contempt from the railway industry that this word betrays. It's a pity for the very many decent railway workers out there (who probably get little recognition for their efforts) who want to see people having a nice ride home. But whether it's daft information, cancelled trains, or the behaviour of poorly managed staff who convert what might be a pleasurable experience into a distress purchase, I'm sure that for every railway worker that regards passengers (sorry customers) as "imbeciles", there are hundreds of passengers who regard British railways in general and GTR in particular as managed and run by "imbeciles".

 

[alastair]

Nope...they just assume "strike"
A high proportion of passengers are quite simply self obsessed imbeciles who see any disruption as a personal attack on their own so important lives. The truth rarely gets considered. If you think im being harsh or judgemental just look at Twitter....

Sorry but thats a ridiculous statement....a small proportion,maybe, but a high proportion,I don't think so. And why the sneering at people's "so important lives"? If someones heading for an interview,or a medical appointment,or to catch a flight, well then it is pretty "important" to them that their train runs on time.

If you post this kind of stuff,arent you just lowering yourself to the same level of the small minority who do post c**p on Twitter?

 

[Chrisgr31]

If you look at a Southerns twitter feed where they have posted apologies for the impact of the strike and shortage of conductors you'll often find that they will get a torrent of comments blaming Southern for the strike.

 

[jimbo99]

As a passenger, I "blame" GTR/Southern entirely. My business is with them and they provide me with a ticket to travel. I hold them responsible for providing me with a reliable train service and expect them to provide me with timely and accurate information about difficulties in providing that service.

That's not to say I support (or otherwise) the strike - that's a different issue. I don't think my fellowing travelling public will make such subtle distinctions. As per my earlier post - many will blame the strikers because its their actions that appear to have the impact.

 

[GodAtum]

As a passenger, I "blame" GTR/Southern entirely. My business is with them and they provide me with a ticket to travel. I hold them responsible for providing me with a reliable train service and expect them to provide me with timely and accurate information about difficulties in providing that service.

That's not to say I support (or otherwise) the strike - that's a different issue. I don't think my fellowing travelling public will make such subtle distinctions. As per my earlier post - many will blame the strikers because its their actions that appear to have the impact.

Exactly ... as a passenger myself I cannot comment because obliviously it's a conflict of interest. For example, I would support a strike of Northen staff as I never use their services.

 

[XDM]

A mother & child,or a pensioner with an important hospital appointment, waiting on a platform in freezing weather or pouring rain for a train that has been cancelled because the guard has not turned up will support the rail company wanting to be rid of unecessary guards. Specially so when told that almost half the company's trains have run safely without a guard for many years,that the underground,overground have no guards & many trains in Western Europe are driver only. The argument for a guard seems lost.

 

[yorkie]

Reminder:

Just to confirm this thread is for discussions of and reporting on the impact to passengers of the strike action that is now planned. Discussion of DOO, the dispute itself or any other related matters is off-topic and will be deleted as such.

Anyone wishing to discuss those issues must use the existing thread for that topic which can be found here.

 

[infobleep]

Some see through the lies

Surely a shortage of conductors is true because they haven't employed enough of them! That is the way I would read it, if I hadn't seen a poster or PDF talking about staff sickness.

I do wonder if they will give out free vouchers to passengers as London Midland did when they had a driver shortage that lead to train cancellations. I don't know if the number of London Midland cancellations was worse. For this comparison I'm excluding strike days.

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[Bishopstone]

I woke early this morning (04.45), at which time the cancellation of the 19.23 Brighton - Newhaven Harbour, and the associated diagram, had already been input to the Southern website. In other words, well before any 'late turn' staff were due to book on, they knew there would be no resource for this circuit.

This is the eleventh consecutive working day this diagram has been cancelled. In my view, it's time for an emergency timetable to be introduced - updated week by week - to reflect the reality of the situation and give people some certainty as to what will, and won't, run. Delay Repay to be calculated against the original timetable.

It is apparent that the same group of services are being picked for the axe on a routine basis. The 23.17 Victoria - Worthing is another example. There is some logic in consistency, but better to formalise this with a realistic weekly assessment.

Ticket acceptance on B&H Buses route 12 (Brighton - Eastbourne via Newhaven and Seaford) is being advertised today, where previously both parties had steadfastly refused to agree this measure.

 

[infobleep]

I woke early this morning (04.45), at which time the cancellation of the 19.23 Brighton - Newhaven Harbour, and the associated diagram, had already been input to the Southern website. In other words, well before any 'late turn' staff were due to book on, they knew there would be no resource for this circuit.

This is the eleventh consecutive working day this diagram has been cancelled. In my view, it's time for an emergency timetable to be introduced - updated week by week - to reflect the reality of the situation and give people some certainty as to what will, and won't, run. Delay Repay to be calculated against the original timetable.

It is apparent that the same group of services are being picked for the axe on a routine basis. The 23.17 Victoria - Worthing is another example. There is some logic in consistency, but better to formalise this with a realistic weekly assessment.

Ticket acceptance on B&H Buses route 12 (Brighton - Eastbourne via Newhaven and Seaford) is being advertised today, where previously both parties had steadfastly refused to agree this measure.

Wonder how the managed to agree it. Did they compromise at all? I know GTR don't like comparamising? Perhaps GTR bullied them into accepting them!

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[sarahj]

Wonder how the managed to agree it. Sis they compromise at all? I know GTR don't like comparamising? Perhaps GTR bullied them into accepting them!

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They are owned by the same parent company. Go-Ahead. The biggie is when they persuade Stagecoach and the 700 coaster service to accept tickets.

 

[infobleep]

They are owned by the same parent company. Go-Ahead. The biggie is when they persuade Stagecoach and the 700 coaster service to accept tickets.

I know but it's taken some weeks to agree with within the same company so could there have been resistance from people within the bus side?

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[Robertj21a]

I know but it's taken some weeks to agree with within the same company so could there have been resistance from people within the bus side?

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Probably only because the 12 is already a very busy service, without adding some train passengers.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Quick question on this. I'm likely to be going to Littlehampton at some point on Thursday from London, either at the crack of dawn or at lunchtime-ish. Is this plan likely to be thwarted or disrupted? Of particular note is that I will wish to bring a bicycle on the return (off peak) journey.

 

[sarahj]

More disrupted. You might not get your first choice train, but you will get there, in the end.

 

[Bishopstone]

As anticipated, a number of the regular cancellations have been formalised as 'until further notice' today, per the News tab on the Southern homepage.

These include the 19.23 Brighton - Newhaven Harbour/Marine 'parliamentary', and 23.17 Victoria - Worthing, neither of which have run for fifteen consecutive days.

It seems these trains have not been removed from the timetable, hence - where appropriate - it is possible to claim Delay Repay against their non-running.

 

[ar10642]

Surely a shortage of conductors is true because they haven't employed enough of them! That is the way I would read it, if I hadn't seen a poster or PDF talking about staff sickness.

I do wonder if they will give out free vouchers to passengers as London Midland did when they had a driver shortage that lead to train cancellations. I don't know if the number of London Midland cancellations was worse. For this comparison I'm excluding strike days.

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I would also add that if that's the case, why were cancellations on this scale not happening before this dispute started?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

More disrupted. You might not get your first choice train, but you will get there, in the end.

That's not really good enough though, is it? People shouldn't have to get places an hour early to cover for this dispute.

 

[infobleep]

I would also add that if that's the case, why were cancellations on this scale not happening before this dispute started?

Perhaps before the dispute if anyone was ill another conductor would step in as overtime. Maybe this isn't happening now. As I don't work for GTR I cannot be certain.

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[Chrisgr31]

Perhaps before the dispute if anyone was ill another conductor would step in as overtime. Maybe this isn't happening now. As I don't work for GTR I cannot be certain.

Although as I understand it a conductor who has participated in the strike cannot stand in.