Hythe to Ipswich - off route?

[Jib2244]

Morning all.

Just had a question regarding travel this morning.

I have a monthly season ticket from hythe (Essex) to Ipswich, sometimes if I am late and miss the 08:47 from Hythe to Ipswich I will make my way to Colchester town and catch the 09:00 to Colchester where I can get the 09:18 to Norwich.

I’ve never had an issue using this route when I have had my tickets checked, however a member of staff checked my ticket and made the point that boarding from Colchester Town to Ipswich is off route.

I pointed out that you can get trains from hythe to Colchester town and vice versa, but he still insisted that it was off route.

It didn’t go further than that, but I was curious as to whether he was technically correct or if I was right in my thinking?

Thanks for any feedback given.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@Jib2244. Welcome to the forum. Doesn't sound right. Trains on the branch line originating from Walton-on-the-Naze or Clacton-on-Sea routinely call at Hythe (Essex), then Colchester Town, then Colchester. Which means that a season ticket from Hythe (Essex) to/from Ipswich should normally be valid for boarding or alighting at all intermediate stations, which includes Manningtree as well.

 

[Jib2244]

@Jib2244. Welcome to the forum. Doesn't sound right. Trains on the branch line originating from Walton-on-the-Naze or Clacton-on-Sea routinely call at Hythe (Essex), then Colchester Town, then Colchester. Which means that a season ticket from Hythe (Essex) to/from Ipswich should normally be valid for boarding or alighting at all intermediate stations, which includes Manningtree as well.

Morning and thank you.

Yes they do so I was struggling to understand the staffs logic that me boarding at Colchester Town was ‘off route’, I would understand if I boarded at Witham for example, but not at a station where trains regularly stop at.

 

[CyrusWuff]

@Jib2244. Welcome to the forum. Doesn't sound right. Trains on the branch line originating from Walton-on-the-Naze or Clacton-on-Sea routinely call at Hythe (Essex), then Colchester Town, then Colchester. Which means that a season ticket from Hythe (Essex) to/from Ipswich should normally be valid for boarding or alighting at all intermediate stations, which includes Manningtree as well.

Fully agree, and Fujitsu Journey Planner and NRE both show Hythe - Ipswich via Colchester Town as being valid on a through ticket.

 

[Watershed]

Season tickets allow you to make unlimited journeys between the two listed stations. They also allow you to start or finish your journey at any intermediate station along your route.

There's a complicated set of rules, known as the Routeing Guide, which determines what counts as a valid route, beyond the most obvious options (the shortest route, or a direct train). But we don't even need to consider those rules as Colchester Town is obviously on the route from Hythe to Ipswich. There is a line that allows trains to avoid reversing at Colchester Town, but it's rarely used and doesn't change the fact that Colchester Town is on the normal route.

Therefore, you were entitled to start your journey at Colchester Town and the member of staff was completely wrong. Unfortunately the training given to frontline rail staff to help them understand ticketing rules is often minimal, as train companies don't see it as something that justifies spending much time on. This is despite the fact that they're supposed to be enforcing those rules!

 

[greaterangrier]

It is valid because it is within 3 miles of the shortest route from Hythe to Ipswich:
- Going via Colchester Town is within 3 miles of the shortest route (as is Mistley)

It is also valid because:
- The local journey from Hythe to Colchester (the routeing point) is on a through train

It is also valid because
- The local journey from Hythe to Colchester is within 3 miles of the shortest route from Hythe to Colchester

There is a line that allows trains to avoid reversing at Colchester Town, but it's rarely used and doesn't change the fact that Colchester Town is on the normal route.

The shortest route over which scheduled passenger services operate (which I assume you are referencing) doesn't come into effect here, as the line from Hythe to Colchester direct is very well used (approx 60% of daily services go this way)

 

[yorkie]

.... a member of staff checked my ticket and made the point that boarding from Colchester Town to Ipswich is off route.

Completely wrong. I understand people making mistakes, however...

I pointed out that you can get trains from hythe to Colchester town and vice versa, but he still insisted that it was off route.

...at this point, given they insisted they were right, when they were clearly wrong, I'd be writing in to ask the company to provide appropriate training to the individual concerned.

Please let us know how you get on; if you do not get a good response, you are welcome to send me a message with your GA reference number and I will ask someone to escalate the matter.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

- Going via Colchester Town is within 3 miles of the shortest route (as is Mistley)

How practical is it travelling via Mistley?

 

[yorkie]

How practical is it travelling via Mistley?

Let's not complicate matters in this thread, but whether it is "practical" to travel "via" somewhere is largely irrelevant on a Season ticket. Please bear in mind that once you have calculated the permitted routes, then any journeys can be made that follow any part of those permitted routes. There is no requirement to be able to 'complete' a route or create a full itinerary for the whole journey or anything like that.

But there is no excuse for anyone getting confused over Hythe to Ipswich via Colchester Town; it's so obviously valid, that I would have to seriously question the common sense of anyone who tries to suggest that isn't be valid. Mistley I could understand confusion, but this is very simple.