Hull - Leeds

[Andrew Nelson]

Is Hull to Leeds a valid Route Via Doncaster?

 

[yorkie]

Hull & Leeds Group are both Routeing Points.

http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/RSPDocuments/permitted_route_identifier.pdf

shows that journeys between Hull and Leeds Group are valid on map TP

http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/RSPDocuments/maps.pdf

Map TP says no, unfortunately.

If you want to go to Doncaster AND Leeds, you can buy to somewhere else (there are tickets that permit Hull -> Doncaster -> Leeds). Is that what you require? If so, before I advise, can you tell me the following:

- What time/day are you planning to depart Hull?
- What time/day are you planning to depart Doncaster (is it the same day as departing Hull)?
- Do you want a return? If so, do you wish to go direct from Leeds to Hull, or via Doncaster? What time/day are you planning to depart Leeds?
- Do you have a Railcard?

I don't need to know any dates, just the day of the week (weekday or weekend, and whether this is all on the same day or not).

 

[Andrew Nelson]

Hull & Leeds Group are both Routeing Points.

http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/RSPDocuments/permitted_route_identifier.pdf

shows that journeys between Hull and Leeds Group are valid on map TP

http://www.atoc.org/clientfiles/File/RSPDocuments/maps.pdf

Map TP says no, unfortunately.

If you want to go to Doncaster AND Leeds, you can buy to somewhere else (there are tickets that permit Hull -> Doncaster -> Leeds). Is that what you require? If so, before I advise, can you tell me the following:

- What time/day are you planning to depart Hull?
- What time/day are you planning to depart Doncaster (is it the same day as departing Hull)?
- Do you want a return? If so, do you wish to go direct from Leeds to Hull, or via Doncaster? What time/day are you planning to depart Leeds?
- Do you have a Railcard?

I don't need to know any dates, just the day of the week (weekday or weekend, and whether this is all on the same day or not).

I'm going to the Hull Model Rail show, Tomorrow.

Wanted to get the Hull Trains service at 16.23 to Donny, as a friend will be traveling all the way to Kings Cross on it. Then Home to Mirfield.

Only Railcard is the WY Metro OAP pass.

Ta.

 

[bradders1983]

If you get the stopper from Doncaster to Leeds, you only need a Hull-South Elmsall ticket, presuming it is valid via Doncaster!!

 

[Andrew Nelson]

If you get the stopper from Doncaster to Leeds, you only need a Hull-South Elmsall ticket, presuming it is valid via Doncaster!!

Asked conductor on Train this Morning, had no problems with First, Northern, ACX or GC....
£17.30 cdr not too shabby.

 

[Eric]

I did Hull to Bradford via Doncaster earlier on this year and I wasn't challenged.

 

[Andrew Nelson]

I did Hull to Bradford via Doncaster earlier on this year and I wasn't challenged.

I think, as the West Yorks to Hull service is so poor, the staff take the view that a Passenger (Customer) has to do, what a Passenger has to do....

 

[Deerfold]

is hull to leeds a valid route via doncaster?

Asked conductor on Train this Morning, had no problems with First, Northern, ACX or GC....
£17.30 cdr not too shabby.

Any particular reason you ask if you're going to ignore the answer? Especially as there's a direct train 35 minutes after the one you took direct to Leeds which would have got you there 30 minutes sooner.

 

[Andrew Nelson]

Any particular reason you ask if you're going to ignore the answer? Especially as there's a direct train 35 minutes after the one you took direct to Leeds which would have got you there 30 minutes sooner.

Well, if You can't be bothered reading the post, You have nothing to add.

Apart from the fact You are wrong anyway.

I went both ways via Doncaster in fact, as the first from Leeds to Hull isn't 'till after 10:30. Getting to Hull considerably later than Via Doncaster.

Coming back, I wanted to travel thro' Doncaster to be with a friend longer.....

As I did point out earlier.

 

[Deerfold]

Well, if You can't be bothered reading the post, You have nothing to add.

Apart from the fact You are wrong anyway.

I went both ways via Doncaster in fact, as the first from Leeds to Hull isn't 'till after 10:30. Getting to Hull considerably later than Via Doncaster.

Coming back, I wanted to travel thro' Doncaster to be with a friend longer.....

As I did point out earlier.

You ignored the advice that the ticket is not valid that way (though it seems the ticket staff did not know that).

I'm sorry I didn't know what time you'd travelled the other way - you hadn't mentioned it. Yes the first trip on a Sunday at 1024 is quite late.

I realise it's pleasant to travel with friends - I do it where I can, but if challenged over the route you were taking I doubt it'd be sen as a reason to go that way (whereas the ability to do the journey before any permitted journeys ran may persuade someone to waive the rules).

 

[Andrew Nelson]

You ignored the advice that the ticket is not valid that way (though it seems the ticket staff did not know that).

I'm sorry I didn't know what time you'd travelled the other way - you hadn't mentioned it. Yes the first trip on a Sunday at 1024 is quite late.

I realise it's pleasant to travel with friends - I do it where I can, but if challenged over the route you were taking I doubt it'd be sen as a reason to go that way (whereas the ability to do the journey before any permitted journeys ran may persuade someone to waive the rules).

Now You've read it, You can understand the situation then.

 

[Deerfold]

Now You've read it, You can understand the situation then.

I had read it before, and no I can't. I do understand you doing it on the way there, but how far do you stretch a journey just so you can travel with a friend? If they were going to London should you be allowed to travel that way before coming back? Sheffield? Or should you use the routes that are permitted?

 

[Andrew Nelson]

I had read it before, and no I can't. I do understand you doing it on the way there, but how far do you stretch a journey just so you can travel with a friend? If they were going to London should you be allowed to travel that way before coming back? Sheffield? Or should you use the routes that are permitted?

"You ignored the advice that the ticket is not valid that way (though it seems the ticket staff did not know that)."

Well, I think the opinion of the staff of four different TOCs probably outweighs any civilians anyday.

It was not stretched any further than logical, as there are no direct train from Leeds to Hull until 10.24, 1 min after the Train from Mirfield gets in. And IF one misses that, there isn't another on until 1pm, a pathetic service in anybodies book, for two regional centers. I did ask the first member of Staff, and was told that it would be no problem, as stated above. 5 separate Staff, all happy with the journey made. Even the Lady on ACX, who went into some depth about "Not Via Doncaster" Tickets for passengers to Sheffield.

I think I'll start a thread about that actually....

 

[Chapeltom]

Why ask if your going to tell everyone there wrong when they are correct? All they are doing is stating the facts and answering the question.

Hull to Leeds via Doncaster is ridiculous anyway.

 

[Max]

Hull to Leeds via Doncaster is ridiculous anyway.

I think ridiculous is a bit unfair. There are two-three trains per hour between Hull and Doncaster and two per hour between Doncaster and Leeds. Meanwhile, there is just one service per hour between Hull and Leeds 'direct'. The Hull-Leeds service is even worse on Sundays. I'm not particularly endorsing the routeing, but I can see the OP's point.

 

[bradders1983]

I think ridiculous is a bit unfair. There are two-three trains per hour between Hull and Doncaster and two per hour between Doncaster and Leeds. Meanwhile, there is just one service per hour between Hull and Leeds 'direct'. The Hull-Leeds service is even worse on Sundays. I'm not particularly endorsing the routeing, but I can see the OP's point.

There are three trains an hour between Leeds-Doncaster if you include the stopper.

 

[Chapeltom]

I didn't realise how bad the service actually was! 1tph between Leeds and Hull is pretty poor.

 

[bradders1983]

I didn't realise how bad the service actually was! 1tph between Leeds and Hull is pretty poor.

It's an extension of the 4tph TPE Manchester -Leeds service - think it goes to Liverpool Lime Street westbound.

 

[ainsworth74]

It's an extension of the 4tph TPE Manchester -Leeds service - think it goes to Liverpool Lime Street westbound.

A few of the Hull TPE services do but the vast majority terminate at Piccadilly. It's the Scarborough services that run through to Liverpool.

 

[bradders1983]

A few of the Hull TPE services do but the vast majority terminate at Piccadilly. It's the Scarborough services that run through to Liverpool.

I did say "think"

 

[ainsworth74]

I did say "think"

And now you "know"

 

[bradders1983]

And now you "know"

Life will never be the same.

 

[YorkshireRider]

I didn't realise how bad the service actually was! 1tph between Leeds and Hull is pretty poor.

Is it? Given York can be used as a changing point from the north and Doncaster from the south to get to Hull i think 1 tph is fine from Leeds. I believe this service is only a 2 car set as well, but i may be wrong on that.

 

[142094]

Is it? Given York can be used as a changing point from the north and Doncaster from the south to get to Hull i think 1 tph is fine from Leeds. I believe this service is only a 2 car set as well, but i may be wrong on that.

Normally a 170 between Leeds and Hull, sometimes they are doubled up in the peaks.

 

[Andrew Nelson]

Why ask if your going to tell everyone there wrong when they are correct? All they are doing is stating the facts and answering the question.

Hull to Leeds via Doncaster is ridiculous anyway.

So, five Members of Rail Staff are wrong too.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I didn't realise how bad the service actually was! 1tph between Leeds and Hull is pretty poor.

And one every 2 - 2 1/2 hours on Sunday. Maybe You should have checked first before calling it....

 

[Deerfold]

So, five Members of Rail Staff are wrong too.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Apparently so. This probably indicates that ATOC should really create some automated version of the guide which can be issued to rail staff to check routeings - in this case it's been in your favour, but it's not always that way round.

Did you get a train in from Mirfield first? I'm wondering if you could have got a 50p ticket to Wakefield and then a return from Hull from there? Can anyone confirm if the routeing from Wakefield allows via Doncaster? My reading of the Routeing guide suggests it is but I'm not expert.

 

[ainsworth74]

Is it? Given York can be used as a changing point from the north and Doncaster from the south to get to Hull i think 1 tph is fine from Leeds.

Journey planners don't give that as an option so I wouldn't have thought many people would think of using that particular route (and even if you specify via DON or YRK in a planner it it says no fares have been found). So I would say 1tph is a poor service.

I believe this service is only a 2 car set as well, but i may be wrong on that.

Yeah normally a 170 occasionally doubled up and sometimes a 185 turns up as well during the peak. I have actually been on a doubled up 185 on this service but it was quite late at night so probably just a positioning move.

 

[90019]

So, five Members of Rail Staff are wrong too.

Though I would assume that any staff that had disagreed with your point of view would have had an attitude problem in your opinion?

 

[brompton rail]

Apparently so. This probably indicates that ATOC should really create some automated version of the guide which can be issued to rail staff to check routeings - in this case it's been in your favour, but it's not always that way round.

Did you get a train in from Mirfield first? I'm wondering if you could have got a 50p ticket to Wakefield and then a return from Hull from there? Can anyone confirm if the routeing from Wakefield allows via Doncaster? My reading of the Routeing guide suggests it is but I'm not expert.

Wakefield to Scotland is valid either via Leeds and York or via Doncaster (and no doubt via Appleby too, though that specific route would be cheaper perhaps). Therefore Wakefield to Hull should be valid via Leeds and Selby, via Knottingley and Goole and via Doncaster.

Sorry, should have added that Wakefield to Hull IS VALID via the routes above - all the same fare.

 

[Deerfold]

Wakefield to Scotland is valid either via Leeds and York or via Doncaster (and no doubt via Appleby too, though that specific route would be cheaper perhaps). Therefore Wakefield to Hull should be valid via Leeds and Selby, via Knottingley and Goole and via Doncaster.

Sorry, should have added that Wakefield to Hull IS VALID via the routes above - all the same fare.

So the simple solution should uksweet wish to repeat her journey is to get a concessionary fare to Wakefield and a ticket between there and Hull - and it doesn't matter if she goes both ways via Wakefield or not. I realise she had no problems this time but I wouldn't like to guarantee that on the tickets she's using.

Does the fare come into it if you're going between routeing points? (I'm no expert on the routeing guide)