How to impress new MPs (not!)

[Snow1964]

Another MP that has no idea what he's talking about. Unless Labour plan to invest in double tracking or putting in more passing loops on the Pembroke Dock line, or adding another platform at Carmarthen for capacity, his wishes are pretty much impossible. If he wants direct London - Pembroke Dock services, then TFW will have to reduce their services. GWR don't call all stations, whereas TFW do. Will he be happy at some stations having fewer services so he can get a long green train to London?

I think you have misread it, says no direct trains so presumably started on a TfW train, but GWR connection ran via Gloucester

 

[Rover77]

It’s reliability at the moment, so many problems with the new trains

Only a fraction of TMs have been on the course to sign 805s yet. This is currently a major factor why they are often cancelled.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 10 Jul 2024 ==

How do you know that there wasn't a legitimate reason for the TM's absence?


Not in this case, the one that the Bangor and Wrexham MPs would have been catching is Voyager-operated.


I'd have thought that they'd be on the sleeper.

Krokodil is correct. Without going into private detail, there is a very good reason for the TMs absence, a reason that has his family and colleagues extremely worried.

 

[Krokodil]

Only a fraction of TMs have been on the course to sign 805s yet. This is currently a major factor why they are often cancelled.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 10 Jul 2024 ==

Quite a few failures en route too.

Krokodil is correct. Without going into private detail, there is a very good reason for the TMs absence, a reason that has his family and colleagues extremely worried.

But of course this is what spare cover exists for.

 

[Rover77]

Quite a few failures en route too.


But of course this is what spare cover exists for.

Exactly, unfortunately I can't remember last time I was spare.

 

[Caaardiff]

I think you have misread it, says no direct trains so presumably started on a TfW train, but GWR connection ran via Gloucester

The GWR would have been a direct train to London from presumably Carmarthen or Swansea but via Gloucester instead of the normal route via the tunnel. It sounded like he wanted a direct Pembrokeshire - London train.

 

[Snow1964]

Krokodil is correct. Without going into private detail, there is a very good reason for the TMs absence, a reason that has his family and colleagues extremely worried.

Although it appears none of his colleagues volunteered to cover for her/him to help out in time of worry and distress either.

But possibly a difficult situation when that particular train was likely to get high profile media commentary.

 

[Sly Old Fox]

Although it appears none of his colleagues volunteered to cover for her/him to help out in time of worry and distress either.

But possibly a difficult situation when that particular train was likely to get high profile media commentary.

That’s just not how the railway works. If someone goes sick, for whatever reason, there usually is nobody else to step in. There used to be but they’ve been lost in efficiency drivers. How many people are awake to volunteer at 4am when they don’t know what’s occurring?

 

[Dr Hoo]

That’s just not how the railway works. If someone goes sick, for whatever reason, there usually is nobody else to step in. There used to be but they’ve been lost in efficiency drivers. How many people are awake to volunteer at 4am when they don’t know what’s occurring?

So, to explore this a bit further, does anyone know where there was last an '0500(-ish)' spare (inter city) Train Manager turn at Holyhead? [I am presuming that the driver brings the ECS from elsewhere as suggested up thread.]

 

[Rover77]

Although it appears none of his colleagues volunteered to cover for her/him to help out in time of worry and distress either.

But possibly a difficult situation when that particular train was likely to get high profile media commentary.

Do you have a crystal ball? Can you forsee a medical emergency before it happens? People just want to complain and have an issue whatever the circumstances.

 

[WesternLancer]

Do you have a crystal ball? Can you forsee a medical emergency before it happens? People just want to complain and have an issue whatever the circumstances.

I’m sure Rachel Reeves will by open to the financial case to resource the crews and trains needed to solve these problems. Or have these mp’s missed the core message of recent weeks?

 

[Krokodil]

Although it appears none of his colleagues volunteered to cover for her/him to help out in time of worry and distress either.

You don't know how short-notice the sickness was. And this is not the USA, if someone goes off sick, it's the employer's reponsibility to cover the turn, not the sick employee's, so there's no need for colleagues to "help out" the sick employee. If the employer doesn't offer an attractive enough Rest Day Work rate to entice the employees in, and/or the employer has driven relations down such that the employees would enjoy their day off more than a day at work, then the employer will struggle to find volunteers.

So, to explore this a bit further, does anyone know where there was last an '0500(-ish)' spare (inter city) Train Manager turn at Holyhead? [I am presuming that the driver brings the ECS from elsewhere as suggested up thread.]

Wasn't the ECS train a Blackpool one? Holyhead has a stabling point.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 10 Jul 2024 ==

I’m sure Rachel Reeves will by open to the financial case to resource the crews and trains needed to solve these problems. Or have these mp’s missed the core message of recent weeks?

It doesn't necessarily need more money (cancelling trains costs more than paying a rest day enhancement anyway), simple things like management and ministers not going out of their way to piss off the staff will help. Remember the ex-boss at Avanti spouting his mouth off? Well that destroyed any remaining goodwill.

 

[Snow1964]

I’m sure Rachel Reeves will by open to the financial case to resource the crews and trains needed to solve these problems. Or have these mp’s missed the core message of recent weeks?

Quite interesting that Supreme Court today saying crew becoming ill during non-working time should not be classed as extraordinary

Rocio Concha from consumer group Which? described the Supreme Court's decision as "highly significant for travellers, confirming as we head into the busy summer period that staff illness is not an acceptable reason to deny paying compensation for significant delays or cancellations".

Case was British Airways, not rail operator, but shows priority should be funding sufficient staff, to avoid paying out more in compensation

Thousands could make claims after BA flight delay ruling

The ruling against British Airways has the potential to affect thousands of airline claims every year.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[En]

Quite interesting that Supreme Court today saying crew becoming ill during non-working time should not be classed as extraordinary


Case was British Airways, not rail operator, but shows priority should be funding sufficient staff, to avoid paying out more in compensation

Thousands could make claims after BA flight delay ruling

The ruling against British Airways has the potential to affect thousands of airline claims every year.

www.bbc.co.uk

As others have alluded to running your staffing 'lean' can be appealing in terms of staff budget , but relies on on favours / rest day working and all your ducks being in row when the pressure is on
from the depths of my mind I remember the figure of 5.5 FTE to cover 1* 24 hour a day 'slot' in a work force at 37.5 hour paid / 38.5 -40 hours 'in the building' ( i.e. 30 minutes per shift unpaid break) standard working week
where there are 168 hours in the week ... the differenence between the 4 and a bit FTE represented by 168 hours and the 5.5. figure to to account for leave, training, 'extractions for other duties ' ( e.g. meetings / investigations and the like) anda degree of short term sickness cover ( long term sickness ( months rather than weeks) and Maty leave to be covered by secondments / temporary posts if required )

 

[Dr Hoo]

Wasn't the ECS train a Blackpool one? Holyhead has a stabling point.

Thank you for that @Krokodil . My confusion in this quite broad thread.

So, to re-ask the essence of my earlier question, albeit slightly extended:

When was the last time that Holyhead had a full slate of spare turns for all essential staff to ensure that the first train to London almost always runs even if somebody unfortunately goes off sick? (I would presume that this means driver, train manager, (?) shunter, fitter, (?) station staff to open up/despatch; and, for that matter, a relief signaller/crossing keeper on Anglesea while we're at it.)

 

[poffle]

Quite interesting that Supreme Court today saying crew becoming ill during non-working time should not be classed as extraordinary


Case was British Airways, not rail operator, but shows priority should be funding sufficient staff, to avoid paying out more in compensation

Thousands could make claims after BA flight delay ruling

The ruling against British Airways has the potential to affect thousands of airline claims every year.

www.bbc.co.uk

I actually head a read of the judgement.

Although it was an EU-261 case the legal case in the Supreme Court was mostly about Brexit and whether it was the original EU law that applied or some if the versions modified by UK legislation as a result of Brexit. This stuff is all above my knowledge.

A key point was the event happened before Brexit and the legal action started before Brexit so I think the supreme court ruled that it was primarily the EU law that applied.

Since the case started the Court of Justice of the EU had ruled in a very similar case where the copilot died before the plane departed and the flight crew declared themselves unavailable to fly. In that cases the CJEU had ruled that staff not being available to operate the flight was not an exceptional circumstance.

UK Supreme Court also took the view that EU261 was designed to be a simple piece of legislation that could be enforced in a small claims court. The corts didn't need to get into all the reasons why a flight crew might not be available. If a flight is cancelled because a flight crew is not available that is a normal part of operating a business and the passengers are entitled to their EU261 rights.

 

[Krokodil]

When was the last time that Holyhead had a full slate of spare turns for all essential staff to ensure that the first train to London almost always runs even if somebody unfortunately goes off sick? (I would presume that this means driver, train manager, (?) shunter, fitter, (?) station staff to open up/despatch; and, for that matter, a relief signaller/crossing keeper on Anglesea while we're at it.)

No idea what spare cover in the Avanti messroom is like, but they can't even cover the service (even after it has been cut back in the LTP timetable) at the moment so probably little cover, particularly with drivers. In an integrated railway of course the staff would be pooled so TfW would be able to keep things going on Avanti's behalf (assuming similar arrangements as when FNW drivers drove trains for Virgin) as they are much better resourced.

Holyhead can operate without a fitter, even if it means that fueling or minor repairs can't be done. In a crisis the Llandudno Junction fitter will have to drive down.

In the event of there being no station staff at Holyhead, TfW services still run, with the guards being instructed to self-dispatch. I don't know what Avanti's rules are (I wouldn't fancy self-dispatching a 10-car Voyager from platform 2, though a five car Voyager from platform 1 should be fine). Avanti already self-dispatch at other stations in North Wales (some of which have curved platforms) when there are no station staff on duty.

I can't say that I recall a closed signal box on the coast. Possibly Ty Croes crossing (with the gates locked across the road, as they are at Llanfairpwll every night). Penmaenmawr can be switched out anyway. It's not like Hereford which went through a bad patch a year or two ago.

A look at Recent Train Times paints a picture. One Avanti working gets cancelled more often than it runs, with another almost as bad. Looking at the TfW services I can only see one instance of a train being cancelled due to a lack of a driver (1V90, 27/06), otherwise unit faults and infrastructure issues predominate. Some of those cancellations were late-running trains being turned back at Bangor, so the majority of passengers weren't affected anyway.

Search - Recent Train Times

 

[Rover77]

The Blackpool service being discussed was cancelled at extremely short notice. All staff in place, TM suddenly taken seriously ill resulting in an ambulance.
Spare cover is virtually non existent. Staff released for training the 805s on a daily basis and staff on block release to train others and assess.
We are woefully short staffed anyway and reliant on overtime. In a sftey critical role where fatigue is a major contributor to operational incidents this should not be the case.