How often do posts for guards become available?

[1e10]

How often do posts for guards become availablea. Is it an easy industry to get into?

Thanks

 

[455driver]

Not very often. No it isnt.

 

[Monty]

Not very often. No it isnt.

I see you are in one of your better moods this evening mate, rest day tomorrow?

To add to what 455driver has said, a large number of guards do tend to be recruited internally as the TOCs like candidates to have some experience on the railway (although this not a requirement). Speaking personally I have not seen my TOC advertise for guards externally for quite some time and I had some colleagues in my class at the training school who had waited well over a year from the moment of applying before being offered an actual start date. That said they do crop up every now and again, TPE and London Midland do come to mind when I think of recent examples.

In addition you would have to complete a set of rigorous assessments and interviews that I would definitely say is not easy. I used to think that being a guard was one of the more senior roles on the railway but it remains to be seen if people share my views.

 

[455driver]

I see you are in one of your better moods this evening mate, rest day tomorrow?

Nope, rest day today, just been emptying the fridge of the beers before they go out of date!

Thats my excuse and I am sticking to it.

Of course it all depends where you live, quite a few TOCs like to "promote" guards to drivers as they are a known quantity, which then requires them to recruit guards.

best advice is to get a job on the railways and then work on getting into the grade you want.

 

[TDK]

How often do posts for guards become availablea. Is it an easy industry to get into?

Thanks

More frequently than you would think. Getting a guards position is a lot easier than a trainee drivers role. Log on to you local toc's recruitment alerts, that is the best way of finding vacancies.

 

[Geargrinder]

In the last 6 months I have seen Northern, Transpennine Express, East Midlands Trains, East Coast, and London Midland all advertise for these roles. The jobs will come up. Depends where you live and/or what your circs are about relocating. Then, as said, you have to get through the recruiting process with lots of competition. Good luck.

 

[northwichcat]

One thing to note is they don't normally advertise posts for guards but for posts for conductors or train managers. On EMT non-mainline services a new conductor is initially known as a Trainee Senior Conductor. :roll:

TPE and Northern will probably both be recruiting ahead of the May 2014 timetable change.

There is a live FGW vacancy currently: https://firstgroup.hua.hrsmart.com/ats/js_job_details.php?reqid=8437

Of course any role that offers on the job training to get you properly qualified for the role is in high demand in the current economic climate.

 

[Geargrinder]

Deleted

 

[1e10]

Kind of stuck here.

I will be leaving education next year and am undecided on whether to pursue a job as a conductor or go to university and study something else.

Is there anything I could study at university that would help go towards a job as a guard?

 

[northwichcat]

Is there anything I could study at university that would help go towards a job as a guard?

If you want to do a degree maybe look at the Virgin Trains sponsored business degree:
http://www.mynewsdesk.com/uk/virgin...perience-travel-and-a-debt-free-degree-879252

Or a Transport degree e.g. http://www.hud.ac.uk/courses/full-time/undergraduate/transport-and-logistics-management-bsc-hons/ They mention a previous graduate of that course works for TPE.

 

[E&W Lucas]

Is there anything I could study at university that would help go towards a job as a guard?

Not much point in doing a degree, if that is your ambition. I know some 18 year olds, who have secured guard's jobs. You need to be confident, well mannered, smart, numerate, able to think on your feet, etc. All of the above should be a pre - requisite for entry to University, let alone anything else!

Customer facing experience would be of more use. There is no point in running up debts at Uni, if you don't need the degree to get where you want to be. If you can't get on the railway immediately, look elsewhere in the service sector. It's all about tranferable skills; the railway side, they expect to teach you. The ability to handle a stressed passenger, they don't.

 

[northwichcat]

Not much point in doing a degree, if that is your ambition. ... If you can't get on the railway immediately, look elsewhere in the service sector.

I agree about not needing a degree for a conductor's role but if they want to progress from a conductor's role to a management role would a relevant degree not be beneficial alongside the non-managerial rail experience?

Note that most other sectors will be taking on even less staff than the railways. The railways are increasing staff over the next couple of years with passenger numbers growing and more services being introduced to meet demand. Other sectors are seeing staff levels remaining constant.

 

[Sir_Clagalot]

When I started at NXEA (now Greater Anglia), I was the only one on the course from another TOC, with another who had worked alongside a TOC with a Passenger Transport group.

 

[Flamingo]

Consider getting a job on-station or in a catering role (non-safety critical) and apply for a guards job after some time in that role.

It gives a better understanding and preparation for the responsibility, it reassures the prospective employer that you have an interest in and understanding of the railway, and above all, most jobs get advertised internally, so you'll get first bite of the cherry, so to speak.

I know some guards who have degrees, most do not. If staying in the guards role, it makes no difference. Life experience seems to be what it's all about. Three years in the forces would probably be of more benefit, and viewed more favourably by prospective employers.

 

[1e10]

If you want to do a degree maybe look at the Virgin Trains sponsored business degree:
http://www.mynewsdesk.com/uk/virgin...perience-travel-and-a-debt-free-degree-879252

Or a Transport degree e.g. http://www.hud.ac.uk/courses/full-time/undergraduate/transport-and-logistics-management-bsc-hons/ They mention a previous graduate of that course works for TPE.

I had no idea that such a course existed. (Looking specifically at the course available at Huddersfield.) I will certainly be applying for that! It says only 36 places are available but it's certainly worth a shot.

Thank you for bringing this to my attention

Not much point in doing a degree, if that is your ambition. I know some 18 year olds, who have secured guard's jobs. You need to be confident, well mannered, smart, numerate, able to think on your feet, etc. All of the above should be a pre - requisite for entry to University, let alone anything else!

Customer facing experience would be of more use. There is no point in running up debts at Uni, if you don't need the degree to get where you want to be. If you can't get on the railway immediately, look elsewhere in the service sector. It's all about tranferable skills; the railway side, they expect to teach you. The ability to handle a stressed passenger, they don't.

Thank you for the advice.

People say that university is the best time of my life. My sixth form at the moment are really pushing it and really supporting us in getting places, we are now starting to complete our UCAS application. We're being told that we should be looking to go to university and do something even if we'e not looking for a job in it, obviously we go for something we do want to work in ideally. We' told that degrees can help get jobs in any sector regardless of whether the degree is of any relation to the subject at hand or not since it shows the ability to work hard and such. There's also the social aspect of uni life, I'm quite looking forward to it. I certainly wouldn't view it as a waste of money considering I don't need the degree for the job I want. It will be 3-4 years living in another city, seeing new places and meeting new people whilst learning new things along the way.

Thank you for all of the advice you've offered here

 

[CC 72100]

People say that university is the best time of my life. My sixth form at the moment are really pushing it and really supporting us in getting places, we are now starting to complete our UCAS application. We're being told that we should be looking to go to university and do something even if we'e not looking for a job in it, obviously we go for something we do want to work in ideally. We' told that degrees can help get jobs in any sector regardless of whether the degree is of any relation to the subject at hand or not since it shows the ability to work hard and such. There's also the social aspect of uni life, I'm quite looking forward to it. I certainly wouldn't view it as a waste of money considering I don't need the degree for the job I want. It will be 3-4 years living in another city, seeing new places and meeting new people whilst learning new things along the way.

Are you? I'm a little surprised by that - I thought the days of the old fees were the times to sell uni as 'the experience'. I'm quite surprised to see sixth form centres advocating this sort of approach with the high tuition fees. As the last year to get in under the old fees, all I'll say is that 3 years at uni could be a lot of time doing something that you may not like, may not serve a professional purpose, and may be very, very expensive.

Unfortunately my sixth form was obsessed with 'The only was is Uni' and seemed to offer very little support to those who chose a different option, akin to a 'very well then, have a look on some apprenticeship websites' approach in which you were left to your own devices. This didn't effect me personally as I've also known that for what I want to progress in I must go to uni but I couldn't help feeling sometimes that heads of sixth form were only concerned about making there previous year uni destinations presentation look impressive.

As for the value of a degree as a way to get jobs in any sector - I'm not so convinced on that myself as yet. I can't help feeling that for working on railways, experience of working in a shop (so involving customer service, responsibility, organisation etc.) would look more impressive than 3 years in a degree that has zilch to do with it. (I speak as someone who's probably never going to work in the railway industry, but based on my observations and experiences of both work and uni.)

 

[TheEdge]

Ignore everyone who has said don't bother applying for a guards job and try for other jobs on the railway first. I applied for one railway job from the outside, I'm now a guard. I joined last year as a uni leaver.

In my group, which was a big group, we had a big spread of backgrounds, 2 internals, 3 with railway experience elsewhere, 2 school leavers, 2 uni leavers and then a group of people who just went for the job!

It is possible to join from the outside, it isn't easy and you do need to be the right person for the job (in the eyes of your interviewers) but it is more possible than people here seem to like to make out.

Good luck.

 

[loplop]

I have a degree and recently got a job as a guard. When I did my degree the idea of working on the railway had never crossed my mind! I've worked part time jobs doing all sorts since I was 15 and continued working (in retail) through uni. I'd had a few jobs since uni and then for various reasons started looking at the railway.

I don't regret doing my degree, I loved (and still do) the subject and had a great time. Current students do pay a hefty whack in fees but try to think of it less as a debt and more as a graduate tax. However, I'd only advise doing a degree if you can do something you love and that is reasonably mainstream. You need to get a good degree in a 'normal' subject for a degree to have proper value to most employers.

I'd also strongly advise that you work through uni, if you go. You need to prove employment skills to any prospective employer.

As far as I can tell my degree didn't disadvantage me when I applied for the role (but nor did it give me any advantage).

 

[E&W Lucas]

People say that university is the best time of my life. My sixth form at the moment are really pushing it and really supporting us in getting places, we are now starting to complete our UCAS application. We're being told that we should be looking to go to university and do something even if we'e not looking for a job in it, obviously we go for something we do want to work in ideally. We' told that degrees can help get jobs in any sector regardless of whether the degree is of any relation to the subject at hand or not since it shows the ability to work hard and such. There's also the social aspect of uni life, I'm quite looking forward to it. I certainly wouldn't view it as a waste of money considering I don't need the degree for the job I want. It will be 3-4 years living in another city, seeing new places and meeting new people whilst learning new things along the way.

Thank you for all of the advice you've offered here

Most of the big transport companies offer graduate schemes; that is probably the ideal target for you, especially if you've set your sights higher in the longer term. Degrees certainly open doors, and for most general management roles, subject is unimportant. Worth checking prospective employers out now. UCAS points/ degree grade required, etc. Maybe not in this sector, but some very big graduate recruiters, are somewhat selective about which uni's they will recruit from too.

If you don't manage "plan A", go for direct entry as a guard or driver. Try and build up the transferable skills required, whilst at uni. PT jobs have their uses, and can open doors to you after graduation too.

Uni was fun; I wouldn't say the best time of my life, but I'm glad I had the experience. The difference 20 years ago, was that you didn't have to run up the amount of debt that you do now. I would be very wary of the University route now, unless I actually needed the degree.

 

[Jonfun]

Speaking as someone who's currently at University, I can honestly say, ignore everything your sixth form will tell you about it. If there's a subject you're interested in greatly, and you really want a degree for (eg) the career you want to go into, then it's a wise idea to go. But you do really need to want to study what you study in order to stay motivated - and as much as your sixth form will tell you that 'it isn't real money' with the 9k tuition fees etc, what they won't tell you will generally be the other hidden costs. You'll find that the maintainence grant will barely (if at all) cover the cost of accommodation, then even before you start factoring in living costs you'll find that universities like to charge for 'this and that'. And finding any job isn't easy - I've been doing customer facing roles since I turned 14, cash handling experience, etc, and I don't even get asked to come for interview. I had fairly significant savings before I came to university - now my bank balance is lucky if it doesn't have a minus in front of it, and I'm not even living in a big city where the cost of living would be higher!

Although I might seem negative, if getting a degree is what you want to do and you know something you'd be interested to study, then go for it. Unfortunately everyone is encouraged to go to uni these days, regardless of academic ability - which means that anyone and everyone will have a degree (even if it is from Anytown Metropolitan and in Hairdressing Management) and be looking for graduate jobs, which I find sort of depressing. But it's one of those things, and it really does need to take some thought.

On a side note, without a degree - yet - I've attended two 'assessment centre' type events and they really do focus on experience and suitability with reading, numbers, and communication skills rather than education.

Hope this helps.

Jon

 

[northwichcat]

I had no idea that such a course existed. (Looking specifically at the course available at Huddersfield.) I will certainly be applying for that! It says only 36 places are available but it's certainly worth a shot.

Places available on a university course is always an estimate for a number of reasons and could be increased or decreased.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Speaking as someone who's currently at University, I can honestly say, ignore everything your sixth form will tell you about it.

Sixth Form must have changed quite a bit since I was in it around 10 years ago, they used to encourage people to apply for university not put them off from doing it.

 

[455driver]

"They" want as many school leavers as possible in university because it keeps them off the unemployment register, got to keep them figures in check even if it is all a pack of lies.

If you want a job on the railways then get some life experience dealing with things relevant to the job you want to do, dealing with customers in some way is a very good start.

 

[northwichcat]

"They" want as many school leavers as possible in university because it keeps them off the unemployment register, got to keep them figures in check even if it is all a pack of lies.

Not just that but it looks better for the sixth form prospectus' to say 80% have gone on to study at university after studying there than 60% even if all the remainder get in to employment or go on to apprentice schemes.

 

[CC 72100]

Not just that but it looks better for the sixth form prospectus' to say 80% have gone on to study at university after studying there than 60% even if all the remainder get in to employment or go on to apprentice schemes.

Yes. The fact that the may go to a poor university studying an easy but not very relevant course is besides the point. What you're saying here is what I was referring to in my post last night.

 

[TDK]

Kind of stuck here.

I will be leaving education next year and am undecided on whether to pursue a job as a conductor or go to university and study something else.

Is there anything I could study at university that would help go towards a job as a guard?

If you eventually want a guards job why bother with uni?

 

[1e10]

If you eventually want a guards job why bother with uni?

I'm worried of going into a role such as one based on a station at the CS point or something similar hoping that it will lead onto a role as a guard and that never coming. If that doesn't happen then I'll be stuck without any plan B.