How often are quiet coaches actually quiet?

[Warrior2852]

I'm fully aware Thameslink doesn't have quiet coaches (though the declassified first class can sometimes usefully act as a de facto one) but I was once on a not particularly busy 8 coach 700 where there were a group of youths yelling obscenities at each other across near enough the entire length of the train.

 

[350401]

I’m on an Avanti West Coast service to London right now and there is a staff member sat in the quiet coach and loudly playing Tik Tok Videos from his phone on speaker. If TOC staff have this attitude, what hope is there for enforcement?

 

[Parjon]

What about You Tube for those who think that walking up and down a train filming everywhere they go including the toilets and narrating as they go for the interests of the two subscribers to their channel.

Disconcerting, but that to me hints more at a learning difficulty.

Unless they are an effluencer. In which case they should be banned from using the internet entirely.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Mar 2023 ==

I’m on an Avanti West Coast service to London right now and there is a staff member sat in the quiet coach and loudly playing Tik Tok Videos from his phone on speaker. If TOC staff have this attitude, what hope is there for enforcement?

Speak up. I do, always.

 

[350401]

I’ve noticed on the Avanti refurbished trains there are few, if any, quiet coach signs. They need bringing back, unless as I suspect, Avanti are planning to abolish the quiet coach. Surely, with 8 standard class coaches, one proper quiet coach isn’t too much to ask.

 

[Furryanimal]

A friend and myself were once told by a GWR train manager to stop talking as we were in the Quiet Coach.
And she was wasn't very pleasant in the way that she said it!
As far as she was concerned quiet meant absolute silence.
We weren't the only ones talking but she seemed to have a particular beef with us.
Never happened before or since.

 

[CardiffKid]

Something else that makes a quiet coach somewhat unquiet is if the train is in the wrong formation/reversed.

If the quiet carriage is positioned in the middle of the platform/where passengers congregate on the platform then there’s no chance.

 

[gabrielhj07]

Indeed the de-facto quiet coach is often (especially at terminals) the furthest from the station entrance.

 

[Warrior2852]

Indeed the de-facto quiet coach is often (especially at terminals) the furthest from the station entrance.

This, although I sometimes find that on longer trains the  second furthest away on terminal platforms is emptier because of the other people who have also had the same idea of going to the furthest away.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

I’m not in the quiet coach, but I was nevertheless disappointed when a pair of ‘youths’ boarded 1P34 just now at Evesham and set about burping loudly for all the carriage to enjoy.

That's Evesham for you, sadly. I tend to take quiet coach noise between Evesham and Worcester as just as one of those things, but yes, it's more annoying when they're on from Evesham to Oxford or London...

 

[Runningaround]

A friend and myself were once told by a GWR train manager to stop talking as we were in the Quiet Coach.
And she was wasn't very pleasant in the way that she said it!
As far as she was concerned quiet meant absolute silence.
We weren't the only ones talking but she seemed to have a particular beef with us.
Never happened before or since.

Did you bring up the endless security announcements as not observing the rule?

 

[TUC]

My wife, who is blind, has sometimes found herself placed in the quiet coach by staff assisting here, even though she has made no request to do so, and if anything would want to make calls etc. like anyone else.

 

[BenS123]

Just had my worst experience yet in a quiet coach on a SWR 450. I boarded at Southampton Central with a few friends, and some (presumably?) football fans were sat in the quiet coach. They were shouting, drinking loads of beer and vaping. They then started shouting at a passenger who had not aggravated them at all from what I could see and the passenger eventually had to move to the rear first class area to get away from them, but some of them followed him into the first class area. The guard at this point then got involved and she told them to behave, at which point one of the fans began to physically harass the guard, and one of them even tried to push her out of the carriage.

All of this in a clearly labelled quiet coach...

On arrival at Bournemouth, I did expect to see a few BTP officers from Bournemouth's BTP Station on the platform in response but alas there were none. We did get the last laugh though as one of them got badly stuck in the ticket gate at Bournemouth when trying to jump over

I would like to say that the above does not represent the behaviour of all football fans. However, there are definitely some badly behaved ones out there, as shown above.

 

[Krokodil]

On arrival at Bournemouth, I did expect to see a few BTP officers from Bournemouth's BTP Station on the platform in response but alas there were none.

Did you contact them?

 

[BenS123]

Did you contact them?

I sadly didn't feel confident contacting them as many of them walked past every minute or so and they were already threatening passengers and the like, and they would have seen either a message to 61016 on my screen or me pointing my phone screen purposely away from them. I hoped, wrongly in hindsight, that the guard would have made contact with them.

 

[Class800]

Increasingly not. The idea either needs to be dropped entirely or there need to be clear "house rules" displayed on what means quiet and these need to be proactively enforced by staff.

Agree. I asked LNER why they haven't blocked child reservations on quiet coach and they waffled that quiet coach is not a legally enforceable concept so they can't do so - I'm sure they could have it adults only by policy if they wanted to.

 

[Krokodil]

I sadly didn't feel confident contacting them as many of them walked past every minute or so and they were already threatening passengers and the like, and they would have seen either a message to 61016 on my screen or me pointing my phone screen purposely away from them. I hoped, wrongly in hindsight, that the guard would have made contact with them.

It could be that the guard did, but there were no officers available on a Sunday. Weekend coverage often seems sporadic.

I wasn't there of course, but I wouldn't have thought that they'd be up to reading text messages upside down in their state. In your shoes I would have sent the text, the whole system is designed to be discreet.

 

[Grecian 1998]

Just had my worst experience yet in a quiet coach on a SWR 450. I boarded at Southampton Central with a few friends, and some (presumably?) football fans were sat in the quiet coach. They were shouting, drinking loads of beer and vaping. They then started shouting at a passenger who had not aggravated them at all from what I could see and the passenger eventually had to move to the rear first class area to get away from them, but some of them followed him into the first class area. The guard at this point then got involved and she told them to behave, at which point one of the fans began to physically harass the guard, and one of them even tried to push her out of the carriage.

All of this in a clearly labelled quiet coach...

On arrival at Bournemouth, I did expect to see a few BTP officers from Bournemouth's BTP Station on the platform in response but alas there were none. We did get the last laugh though as one of them got badly stuck in the ticket gate at Bournemouth when trying to jump over

I would like to say that the above does not represent the behaviour of all football fans. However, there are definitely some badly behaved ones out there, as shown above.

Very unlikely to have been football fans - there aren't any men's games today save for England v Ukraine, which they would have been heading away from if going to Bournemouth at that time of the day, and Forest Green Rovers (of Nailsworth, which has no station) v Sheffield Wednesday.

I'm assuming they probably weren't going to one of the Women's Superleague games...

 

[Bletchleyite]

Agree. I asked LNER why they haven't blocked child reservations on quiet coach and they waffled that quiet coach is not a legally enforceable concept so they can't do so - I'm sure they could have it adults only by policy if they wanted to.

Children can sit quietly reading a book, and autistic children may prefer a quiet environment, so I see no reason to ban children from it. What does need proactively enforcing, though, is playing audio out loud.

I would favour changing the relevant Byelaw to remove the requirement for annoyance to be caused, i.e. make playing any device out loud a strict liability offence. That would make it easier to enforce.

 

[Krokodil]

I'm happy with the "annoyance caused" bit to remain. "Any other person" includes me - the guard, so switch it off if you want to stay on my train.

 

[Andy Pacer]

I actually find the so called quiet coaches more stressful due to getting annoyed by other travellers not sticking to the rules.

 

[dk1]

I actually find the so called quiet coaches more stressful due to getting annoyed by other travellers not sticking to the rules.

Very true. I'd just do away with the darn concept. More trouble than it's worth.

 

[Peter0124]

Very true. I'd just do away with the darn concept. More trouble than it's worth.

I wouldn't get rid of it, it needs enforced more strictly by staff though.

 

[dk1]

I wouldn't get rid of it, it needs enforced more strictly by staff though.

That's just not going to happen. Soon as they are out of sight it'll start again.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Mar 2023 ==

Unfortunately we are surrounded by the inconsiderate and self entitled.

 

[Andy Pacer]

I do think they're a great idea but its the modern world that doesn't seem to help it work.

On Saturday I was on some c2c trains which have quiet zones, and they were just like all of the other coaches in the train.

 

[Peter0124]

I do think they're a great idea but its the modern world that doesn't seem to help it work.

On Saturday I was on some c2c trains which have quiet zones, and they were just like all of the other coaches in the train.

I do question why c2c even have them considering they're a local suburban TOC. It only makes sense to have quiet coaches on long distance trains/express trains.

 

[Andy Pacer]

I do question why c2c even have them considering they're a local suburban TOC. It only makes sense to have quiet coaches on long distance trains/express trains.

A very valid point. Perhaps they're trying to offer something that they're unable to realistically deliver on

 

[43066]

Exactly. This kind of thing is a “social contract” type concept, which relies on people proactively considering those around them. We all know that no longer happens, and people increasingly exist in their own little worlds. The situation has become exponentially worse since Covid, of course.

(I meant to quote @dk1 ‘s post #143 there).

 

[Bletchleyite]

Exactly. This kind of thing is a “social contract” type concept, which relies on people proactively considering those around them. We all know that no longer happens, and people increasingly exist in their own little worlds. The situation has become exponentially worse since Covid, of course.

(I meant to quote @dk1 ‘s post #143 there).

If only people DID exist in their own little worlds.

It's as if people have forgotten there is such thing as a pair of headphones.

 

[Peter0124]

The fact that we may be becoming less considerate and empathetic as a species does sadden me.

 

[Warrior2852]

Honestly the quietest standard class coach on the network might be the declassified Thameslink First Class at the back of the train, as it's not meant to be a quiet coach but often ends up quieter through I suspect people not realising its declassified and they can sit there.