How is bus rolling stock allocated?

[Discuss223]

How is bus rolling stock allocated - who decides which unit will work which diagram?

For example, does a driver clock on and decide what unit he will take out of the garage? Is it already allocated for him?

Is it a standard procedure that's universal amongst depots within the bus operating companies?

 

[PG]

Very unlikely to be down to the driver to decide which bus they want. Usually allocated to them when they report for duty by a controller, who has an overall picture of that days work and maintenance requirements. Otherwise you end up with unwanted situations where, e.g. the only available bus left in the depot is a decker but at some point during the day it is scheduled on a route with a low bridge!

 

[Simon75]

Drivers will receive a duty card for there shift, with thread explaining more about how it works

Duty Cards

Does anyone here have an example of a duty card/running board? I have seen that there are some variations between different operators cards e.g Arriva cards stay on the bus whilst Stagecoach cards stay with the driver.

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[WibbleWobble]

For larger operators, there's usually a specific run-out allocator who nominates each bus to a vehicle working, working overnight or a very early shift.

Vehicle types are usually determined by the scheduler, the allocator using some sort of document to cross-reference and allocate accordingly.

Factors like where the bus is parked in the depot, maintenance cycles etc also play a part in which specific bus goes where

 

[Mollman]

With some small operators a driver will always have the same bus unless it is off the road etc.

 

[JKP]

Local Authority contracts will also specify the minimum and occasionally maximum size of bus to be used on school and local bus services. There are often penalties applied if buses used do not meet contract specifications.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

My late father was a senior driver who acted as vehicle allocator. Process is relatively straightforward...

• Each vehicle has a day mapped out - there are various terms that are used such as "running boards" or "running time cards" but essentially, it tells you what a bus is supposed to do each day.
• The board will specify the type of vehicle to be used - that might be quite bland (e.g. Double decker) or very specific on the actual type, age etc depending on things like route branding, capacity, vehicle height, emissions, council requirements on vehicle age for tendered services etc
• Then the allocator will look to allocate vehicles against that criteria and where the vehicle is located (though often the vehicles are parked in readiness) so there isn't a need to do loads of shunting to get to a particular vehicle
• Sometimes, a non-standard vehicle may appear on a board such as
  • A vehicle goes out on a schools only board because it's required to be "kept local" after repair, or
  • A vehicle is kept only for schools/peak because it's a bit of a dog, or
  • A vehicle is ok to go out but needs a minor repair in the off peak, or
  • A vehicle was defective at 0400 but has been repaired by 0700
  • This is not an exhaustive list

Smaller firms may have a driver who has a regular bus but that doesn't happen in larger firms.

 

[43055]

Diamond East Midlands seems to be a bit of a mix in terms of allocations. The Double Decker's seem to be mostly allocated as one pool whereas the single decker's and mini buses can also be a pool but some routes/diagrams will get the same vehicle for example the 70/70A from Derby to Barrow on Trent use to be the same E200 every day and the Evora seems to regularly stick to the same diagram on the route 9 from Burton to the Airport.

 

[820KDV]

From my experience:

I would decide the bus workings as the first step between the plain timetable and the driver duties, although each route generally had its basic vehicle type. We had a fairly detailed bus working number code system which gave the vehicle type to those who needed to know. This not only accommodated the more obvious variations such a minibus, single deck, double deck etc, but the sub-category would give more detail. 100s were normal standard Transit minibuses (yes, this was a long time ago!) 150s were the newer, sloping front, Transits which had differing destinations on their blinds so did out of town work. In the 900 double deck series, lowest numbered ones were "general" double deck vehicles, but there was a separate batch of numbers for Park & Ride liveried deckers. Later, as we switched from low height to standard height double decks the one route which needed the few remaining low height buses took a completely different series, 800s, which hadn't been used before, just to make people ask "what's that?" until everyone got used to it, as it was felt that a sub-category in the usual 900 double deck series wasn't distinct enough. As a comparison, the first low floor buses took numbers in the usual single deck series as a mis-allocation there was less critical. And remember, allocation isn't just about the morning run out, its also about re-allocations during the day, by the Inspector who probably has the phone ringing off the hook and drivers not reporting for duty as well as finding a suitable bus to replace a breakdown.

Out station buses had the basic type number to start with, but then were in the x70s, and x80s to show they were out station.

Even then there were more hidden (but not deliberately so) requirements, such as where the Tacho fitted buses were used (of the double decks a coach seated one at an out-station where the driver looked after it as if it was is own, the other on a regular working which came back to base every 2-hours, so we always knew where it was, and similarly single deck bus workings which could be a coach if need be. Our Darts had different size fuel tanks, so until the depot had completed the retro-fit programme lower fleet numbers didn't go on Out Station workings as these could be away for almost two days before fuelling.

Then the allocator knew which buses were "favourites" and which were less popular, not really defects but perhaps with heavier steering, or which were a bit slow, or didn't climb hills as well as others - the feeling was that such buses would be "hidden away" at out stations as much as possible because those drivers only had one bus for each working, rather than a yard full, so wouldn't complain.

Then as mentioned above there is the whole list of "keep local" buses, buses needed for maintenance between the peaks, buses held back for private hire prep, which could include decorating if it was an open top for a wedding hire and so on.

Besides my numbering system I also gave the depot a list of "second choice" vehicles if they were suffering from availability issues with a particular type. It all generally worked, but inevitably things ended up in the wrong places during the day, albeit efforts were always made to get the correct types back to out-stations at the end of the day to give everyone the best chance of meeting the next day's runout. There will always be the oddity which pops up, where as long as it fits (height, length - one route could take 10.3m Nationals but not 11.3m versions) it goes.

Piecing it all together, keeping an eye on things day by day out of the office window, and working closely with the Bus Allocator, was all part of my job, and part of what made it so interesting

 

[Roger1973]

The detail varies between operators, but yes, schedulers will generally say what type of bus should run on what route and vehicle working - there may be contractual aspects (particularly in London) that keep particular types / batches of bus to a particular route. Some types of bus may or may not be allowed in particular low emissions zones, or there may be route branding aspects (Reading Buses is one example of this, where route 17 - for example - is purple buses and they aren't supposed to work on other routes, and there's enough 'generic livery' buses to cover for route branded buses being off the road for maintenance etc.)

And of course issues of capacity (bus working X may be allocated a high capacity double deck because of school movements) and what bus can physically work what routes due to height / width / weight restrictions. Different types of bus may have different mileage ranges, so some vehicle workings (like the ones that stay out in to the evening) may need to be diesel rather than hybrid or electric buses. Buses with all-over advertising liveries may also be kept on specific route/s as part of the deal.

On London Transport, it was traditionally the engineering side who would allocate specific buses to each bus working / running number - they would try to balance mileage out, and would know what buses they wanted back during the mid-day (as 'spread over' buses) or to be the first ones back at the end of the evening peak for maintenance etc. Although some drivers / crews would negotiate with the garage foreman to have a favourite bus, or occasionally to have something non-standard.

 

[Eyersey468]

When I worked at the outer depots at my employer the way allocations were generally done were whatever was at the front of the depot went out first

 

[mangad]

One of the factors in London is whether the vehicle has the correct destination blinds. At least for older vehicles still using non-digital displays.

 

[Discuss223]

Thank you to those who replied and who will reply in future. There are some very interesting notes to take away. So, it seems there is nothing to stop for example, the Skylink route being operated by another vehicle of similar capacity and dimensions operating on that route, unless the controller has the naus to recognise the request for branded buses to stick to their aforementioned routes. For example, an Indigo branded Eclipse could operate that route instead of a Skylink branded Eclipse and no problems would be flagged.

 

[DunsBus]

When Lothian (LRT as was) were buying their long Olympians in the 1980s there was an edict which went out after the first three batches had been delivered that stipulated the two standard-wheelbase Olympians 666 and 667, based at Central, were not to be allocated to services 7/11, 10 and 16 - the services run by the longer Olympians - because of their lower seating capacity and were to be treated as if they were Atlanteans and allocated accordingly.

Staying with Lothian, after the fitting of bandit screens to the Olympians and the newest Atlanteans in 1990, the older ones up to and including the T-reg batch were then used on boards on all-day services that would see them run in in the early evening or allocated to services which finished around 7pm. If an older Atlantean was allocated to an all-day board, it would be changed over for a bus fitted with a bandit screen in the early evening.

I also remember that SMT had an edict regarding the Lions based at Musselburgh, that they were not to be allocated to the 66 Wallyford to Balerno service due to concerns about the bridge clearance at Slateford station.

 

[43055]

Thank you to those who replied and who will reply in future. There are some very interesting notes to take away. So, it seems there is nothing to stop for example, the Skylink route being operated by another vehicle of similar capacity and dimensions operating on that route, unless the controller has the naus to recognise the request for branded buses to stick to their aforementioned routes. For example, an Indigo branded Eclipse could operate that route instead of a Skylink branded Eclipse and no problems would be flagged.

Trentbarton is a little different. The aim is for the branded bus to be on the correct route and then a spare normally mango branded vehicle will cover if the normal bus is unavailable. For my local route which is E200MMC's I typically find that the E200MMC's or Volvo's are the first choice of spares now with the Versa's and Solo's not appearing that often.

In the last year the route has had other route branded vehicles on as the Derby depot has struggled at times but normally is when nothing else is available and only for one or two trips. A few weeks bad a Harlequin branded Solo did a single round trip in the early evening after its normal day shift presumably as it is one of the first vehicles to get back to the depot in the evening.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Hopefully this thread is demonstrating to the uninitiated that there is more than one way to skin this particular cat but also that the the general approach has gradually changed at many operators over the years.

When I first became familiar with buses in Greater Manchester some 45 years ago the GMT fleet was largely operated as a homogenous whole. The single deck fleet was relatively small so was mostly confined to those routes that had a physical restriction, most likely a low bridge, on them. With the double decks each depot was pretty free to use them as they saw fit with no separation of Atlanteans from Fleetlines.. This was a pain from a spotting point of view as there was almost no way of knowing where to find all the various 2nd generation prototypes. Nor for that matter the relatively small batches of those vehicle types which didn't end up being ordered in large quantities (Titans, Dominators). Also dual door vehicles tended not to see much use outside of the weekday peaks by this time.

Fast forward a couple of decades and single deckers ruled the roost, with some route branding thrown in, so turnout had a different emphasis regarding providing suitable capacity on critical workings as well as maintaining branded operations.

And now the pendulum is swinging back towards double deckers but where route branding exists it hasn't revived the old "a bus is a bus is a bus" mentality.

As far as schedulers' input goes, yes there can be some useful co-ordination. Where routes have especially long hours of operation it's likely that the schedule will avoid vehicles having to work from 0400-0100, for example, by attaching the workings at the extreme ends of the day to appropriate starts/finishes. Similarly there may well be an agreed view as to which schools workings need to stand alone and which can be attached to other service work to create a scheduling efficiency friendly chunk of work.

All of this reflects my experience with larger operations. Small companies can be very different!

 

[Towers]

On a slightly related note, one thing which has always baffled me to some degree is the sheer volume of movements between fleets in some of the large groups, with what seems at times like an almost constant carousel of buses being shuffled to and fro. How is all of this worked out, do depots just arrange it between themselves or is there generally a centralised group process for it?

 

[tram21]

Thank you to those who replied and who will reply in future. There are some very interesting notes to take away. So, it seems there is nothing to stop for example, the Skylink route being operated by another vehicle of similar capacity and dimensions operating on that route, unless the controller has the naus to recognise the request for branded buses to stick to their aforementioned routes. For example, an Indigo branded Eclipse could operate that route instead of a Skylink branded Eclipse and no problems would be flagged.

Trentbarton is done differently, I'm not sure exactly how it's different but they don't work in the same way. I believe they are allocated on a route-by-route basis, unlike somewhere like Stagecoach where they are all in the same pool.

A wrongly-branded bus will only appear on the wrong route if its literally the last bus left in the depot.

 

[noddingdonkey]

Although some drivers / crews would negotiate with the garage foreman to have a favourite bus, or occasionally to have something non-standard.

Many years ago I recall overhearing a conversation between two Yorkshire Rider drivers at a changeover, the driver taking over told his colleague that he had been approached to do overtime and had been promised his choice of vehicle type (a Scania) for the late board.

 

[Roger1973]

One of the factors in London is whether the vehicle has the correct destination blinds. At least for older vehicles still using non-digital displays.

Yes, I'd forgotten about that.

It can be an issue at some of the larger garages, or where only some batches of buses have been given new blinds with a recently won / re-allocated route on. It can get complicated at the (relatively few) combinations of route where one or two buses work one route in the morning peak and another in the afternoon.

I'm aware that a few of the larger London Transport garages had multiple blind sets in the 1970s as a blind with all routes on would not have fitted on the rollers. I'm not sure if the buses were marked in some subtle way so that all concerned would know that RM 1234 couldn't be allocated to route X - would have been embarrassing if a bus had been taken out as a 'sub' (substitution on the road) and then they found it didn't have the right blinds for that route.

 

[YX73OUB]

Going back to trentbarton this is actually something I have done (vehicle allocation)

We look at the engineers request & VOR list first.

Next we try to allocate vehicles to come back to the depot first (for engineers' requests) and try to allocate around this.

The next thing that I always tried to accommodate was branding buses being out on 'late boards' or allocation of spares to capacity requirements (big buses on busier brands for example)

This can change very quickly in the mornings when drivers come back with problems and engineering require the bus and then operation step up commences.

Sometimes you're in a position to be able to swap unbranded with branded buses throughout the day & this gives you the luxury of spare buses that can go anywhere.

Saturdays are easier as PVR can be less & the pace of the runout is slower.

 

[Whisky Papa]

Over my years on both the scheduling and driving side, the only place that stood out from the rest was The Bee Line Buzz Company operation, certainly at its Stockport depot where I drove for a year just after it opened. The Sherpa and Dodge minibuses were all parked in a yard, and apart from one area reserved for vehicles requiring fitters' attention, drivers were given free reign to take any vehicle they chose - this replaced a brief system of allocating vehicles which proved unpopular as most drivers had a distinct preference to one type or the other (Dodge in my case). Either type could appear on any route. Initially there was somebody at the garage gate recording what vehicle went out on each duty, but I suspect this was replaced by a radio call to the depot to confirm.

Elsewhere, there has always been an inspector, garage hand or, in the old Greater Manchester Transport (GMT) days, a specific post known as a router allocating individual vehicles to the running boards. I can recall the routers' 'gallery' for want of a better word at the former Princess Road garage in Manchester - a narrow glass-fronted lean-to against an inside wall, with boards at the rear displaying all the running boards, the bus allocated and in which bay of the garage it was located, vital knowledge when the PVR was over 150! The router could thus work at the board without any possibility of interference from drivers. I think they hung a metal tag with the bus number on rather than writing it, but I'm not 100% sure? One issue I do recall being mentioned (actually at Stockport) was that the router was entitled to a tea-break during the final few minutes of the run-out, so if any vehicles were being made available at the last minute (having had a minor fault fixed perhaps) they could not be allocated until the router was back on station!

From the schedules point of view, by the early 1980s GMT had such a standardised fleet that there really was little differentiation to make between double-deckers, and the running boards used a single series for them. Princess Road still had a declining number of the 'Mancunian' Atlanteans and Fleetlines, and their use was getting more restricted to peak-hours, but this was decided by the router, not any edict from us in the Schedules Office. The requirement for low-height buses for the railway bridge at Carrington had finished (although I recall there was still a section of the router's board marked for them) and there were no single-deckers there except the handful of Seddon midibuses for their share of the Manchester Centreline.

Northenden garage had a few coaches for the 200 Airport Express that needed the running boards to be marked as such, and Stockport still had a handful of Leyland PD3s that obviously had to be allocated to crew-operated boards. Stockport also had a fair number of single-deckers, but virtually all Leyland Nationals so all s/d running boards were numbered in one series. The exception was a single ECW-bodied Leyland Leopard (fleet number 56) that if it had to be used always worked the same crew-operated school contract as it was not suitable for OPO.