How common are delays ?

[Jamiescott1]

Whilst waiting for a delayed train I was going through my gwr delay repay account and in the past 12 months I have been delayed 53 times of 15 minutes or more.
I am a regular traveller but is this level of delays normal across the network, am I very unlucky or is the line I take seen as a Non priority ?

 

[zwk500]

Whilst waiting for a delayed train I was going through my gwr delay repay account and in the past 12 months I have been delayed 53 times of 15 minutes or more.
I am a regular traveller but is this level of delays normal across the network, am I very unlucky or is the line I take seen as a Non priority ?

53 times a year is 1 per week, so probably on the higher side but not unusual for a 15+ minute delay.

 

[Jamiescott1]

53 times a year is 1 per week, so probably on the higher side but not unusual for a 15+ minute delay.

10 journeys a week so 10% of journeys delayed

 

[mikeb42]

You're getting off lightly with a mere 10% .

For a random example based purely on personal experience, try this for size:

https://www.ontimetrains.co.uk/journeys/BPW/PAD/17:29/18:44/GW;dayOfWeekRange=Weekdays;dateRange=16W

74 journeys (having subtracted all the planned cancellations due to strikes, forecast weather events, leopards mauling the point machines in the Swindon area again etc). 19 journeys qualified for delay repay - 26%. Nothing notably atypical about that either - abysmal punctuality is the default. Planning around a service like this entails relying on reliable unreliability. Goes Wrong Routinely.

That said, statistically speaking GWR is actually one of the less terrible operators... Depressing.

 

[ComUtoR]

Whilst waiting for a delayed train I was going through my gwr delay repay account and in the past 12 months I have been delayed 53 times of 15 minutes or more.

Disclosure: I have a professional interest in performance.

Why, if you are delayed on so many occasions do you insist on repeating the same journey over and over again or is this 53 different journeys spread randomly over the year? Are those 53 journeys on the same line/network/TOC/service ?

Cheers in advance

 

[Jamiescott1]

Disclosure: I have a professional interest in performance.

Why, if you are delayed on so many occasions do you insist on repeating the same journey over and over again or is this 53 different journeys spread randomly over the year? Are those 53 journeys on the same line/network/TOC/service ?

Cheers in advance

90% of them are the same route and same time train and the reason I take this time train is to get to work.
The toc is gwr

 

[Killingworth]

The busiest train out of Dore & Totley used to be TPEs 7.14 to Manchester.

Thamks to Covid numbers fell off a cliff. Over 100 used to travel but working from home has had a massive effect. TPE have effectively deterred the stalwarts who had filtered back. Their hourly services at 5.15, 6.15 and 8.15 are similarly bad.

Performance score 49%. Only 56% ran. 23% departed and arrived on time.

On Time Trains

Find out how often your train journey is on time, look up recent services eligible for delay repay claims and check your station rankings.

www.ontimetrains.co.uk

 

[iphone76]

I'm not sure which bit of the GWR network you use, but there have been a few issues on the Western route including a shortage of signallers at the Thames Valley Signalling Centre, various overhead line issues, trespass incidents and problems with axle counters which were introduced in December. Hopefully thing will improve as I know they are really working hard to try and reduce delays.

I'm going to regret saying this, but Greater Anglia have really improved their reliability on my line over the past few years. I'm sure it's a mix of the new trains and the fact they are still not running the full service so there is a bit of breathing space. I went through a phase where it seemed like every day there was some sort of issue which lead to delay repay.

 

[ComUtoR]

90% of them are the same route and same time train and the reason I take this time train is to get to work.
The toc is gwr

Again, asking for professional reasons. Why not get a different train ? or a different way to work ?

 

[306024]

I'm not sure which bit of the GWR network you use, but there have been a few issues on the Western route including a shortage of signallers at the Thames Valley Signalling Centre, various overhead line issues, trespass incidents and problems with axle counters which were introduced in December. Hopefully thing will improve as I know they are really working hard to try and reduce delays.

I'm going to regret saying this, but Greater Anglia have really improved their reliability on my line over the past few years. I'm sure it's a mix of the new trains and the fact they are still not running the full service so there is a bit of breathing space. I went through a phase where it seemed like every day there was some sort of issue which lead to delay repay.

Yes the GEML has its moments, usually they come in batches, but on the whole it is pretty reliable in my experience, with GA certainly one of the better operators. For sure no longer having to squeeze every last drop of capacity during the peaks is a big win for punctuality, as is the performance of the new trains, but NR have played their part. It would be interesting to see the trend for infrastructure failures over the past five years.

Contrast to Great Western where infrastructure reliability has delayed my last three trips over there. The difference between GW and GE reliability is one of the concerns for Crossrail, with the GW side needing to match the GE side.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

90% of them are the same route and same time train and the reason I take this time train is to get to work.
The toc is gwr

Again, asking for professional reasons. Why not get a different train ? or a different way to work ?

Might be a variety of reasons. If the service in question is a half hourly frequency, the earlier train might get you into work far too early, and the later one too late. Probably be better for @Jamiescott1 if their preferred train just ran on time more often.

 

[zwk500]

Again, asking for professional reasons. Why not get a different train ? or a different way to work ?

I agree with @Mcr Warrior, I'm not sure where you're going with your questions. The OP is not unreasonable to expect the advertised service to run on time. Its not on them to adapt their life around the train companies inability to get the trains on time.

 

[JamieL]

I use Avanti. It is rare that I am NOT delayed. A quick canter through emails suggests about 75% of my journeys have been delayed on the Euston to Glasgow Central route.

 

[ComUtoR]

Probably be better for @Jamiescott1 if their preferred train just ran on time more often.

For sure and trains should always run on time.

This one isn't. If it can't run on time for some reason or another because its path doesn't work should it be re-timed ? or should it be removed altogether ?

My TOC is about to have a huge timetable change with some routes being rationalised. Without understanding why passengers behave the way they do, how do we best serve them ? If a passengers is willing to take the same delayed train and simply claim delay repay and absorb the frustration then the TOC isn't incentivised to make changes. If there are services that are too infrequent then maybe there should be an increase in the service level or a different journey. I'm lucky because my local station has many different routes to London and I can use various interchanges when things go wrong or I'm looking for flexibility. So if a service can't run on time for any reason should more flexibility be built into the timetable ?

My morning commute is horrible. However, I choose to change my behaviour to stop myself getting caught in traffic. I leave a little earlier and get to work early without getting frustrated. I hear many commuters complaining that their train is always late or they always miss their connection. I think to myself; "why not get a different train"

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Nov 2022 ==

I agree with @Mcr Warrior, I'm not sure where you're going with your questions. The OP is not unreasonable to expect the advertised service to run on time. Its not on them to adapt their life around the train companies inability to get the trains on time.

Unless we understand passenger behaviour, we can't help them. The easiest way to understand something is to ask questions.

 

[43096]

Again, asking for professional reasons. Why not get a different train ? or a different way to work ?

That is such a railway response. Even though the railway is seemingly incapable of running that service reliably, somehow the response is to effectively blame the passenger. Only in an industry with such appalling customer service behaviours would “find a different way to work” be given as advice.

 

[Jamiescott1]

If I change my work hours and take different time trains. What's to say that the other timed trains won't be delayed (I don't have that info).

I dont think its too unreasonable to expect my trains to be on time more than 90% of the time

 

[Horizon22]

If I change my work hours and take different time trains. What's to say that the other timed trains won't be delayed (I don't have that info).

I dont think its too unreasonable to expect my trains to be on time more than 90% of the time

Check here to set up your journey time, from & to and you can see all performance for a set period - https://www.ontimetrains.co.uk/journeys

You can see GWR's performance here and download their monthly performance PDF - https://www.gwr.com/about-gwr/what-you-can-expect/performance. Over the last recorded period (4 weeks), 97% of trains arrived at each station on time or within 15 minutes. This is of course a snapshot figure and there can be huge range - the London-South Wales route only scored 91% for instance, whilst Thames Valley services were all +98%

The document above is of course an overall figure - there might be particular discrepancies at specific times of the day; traditionally peak times used to have the worst performing trains because capacity was at pretty much 100% so the smallest delay could have a knock on impact. Certain trains are pathed within an inch of their life to squeeze out any spare space to get people into work and so this knocks on. Even at peak times, some trains can have very good performance and others awful. It's not as bad as it was pre-Covid, but some issues still remain.

We'd really need to know your route to get more info.

 

[zwk500]

For sure and trains should always run on time.

This one isn't. If it can't run on time for some reason or another because its path doesn't work should it be re-timed ? or should it be removed altogether ?

My TOC is about to have a huge timetable change with some routes being rationalised. Without understanding why passengers behave the way they do, how do we best serve them ? If a passengers is willing to take the same delayed train and simply claim delay repay and absorb the frustration then the TOC isn't incentivised to make changes. If there are services that are too infrequent then maybe there should be an increase in the service level or a different journey. I'm lucky because my local station has many different routes to London and I can use various interchanges when things go wrong or I'm looking for flexibility. So if a service can't run on time for any reason should more flexibility be built into the timetable ?

My morning commute is horrible. However, I choose to change my behaviour to stop myself getting caught in traffic. I leave a little earlier and get to work early without getting frustrated. I hear many commuters complaining that their train is always late or they always miss their connection. I think to myself; "why not get a different train"

Unless we understand passenger behaviour, we can't help them. The easiest way to understand something is to ask questions.

All of this is fair enough, although with the BIB - is this then delay repay failing? Surely the point of being liable for compensation is to incentivise the TOC to improve performance?

 

[Jamiescott1]

Marlow to Paddington is the route.
Usually peak journeys involving changes at bourne end and maidenhead

 

[ComUtoR]

All of this is fair enough, although with the BIB - is this then delay repay failing? Surely the point of being liable for compensation is to incentivise the TOC to improve performance?

I don't believe delay repay works as an incentive for either party. The passenger is clearly annoyed but the compensation they receive just makes them feel better because they got compensated. The TOCs clearly don't care because the same train still gets delayed over and over again. What has paying out the passenger really achieved ? Sorry we were late, here's £20.. You see it on these forums that people are proud that they got X number of vouchers and seem to take delight in getting compensation out the TOCs.

The TOCs have a captive market. The passenger has very little choice but to travel. If the passengers still decide to travel on that same late train and are happy to accept that 10% of the time its going to be delayed the the TOC can sit there and do nothing.

What the TOCs really care about is the fines they get for the delays. Performance meetings etc are about who is getting charged for what delay. I've never heard anyone say anything about the delay repay payouts but the delay attribution fight tooth and nail to pass the delay to someone else as the costs to the TOC are huge.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Nov 2022 ==

If I change my work hours and take different time trains. What's to say that the other timed trains won't be delayed (I don't have that info).

Horizon has already provided help but that's exactly what the TOCs should be doing. They should be providing you with information about how you might be able to take a different route/service etc and provide information that can help you plan your time better.

I dont think its too unreasonable to expect my trains to be on time more than 90% of the time

I believe that 90% is a very low bar to set. My expectation is that my train should run on time, every time. Now the railway has moved over to 'right time' it will understand that passengers use trains between end to end points and we shouldn't be city centric.

 

[urbophile]

Again, asking for professional reasons. Why not get a different train ? or a different way to work ?

That's the same level of fatuity as the recorded announcements that say 'thank you for choosing to travel with X'. Within a city region it is often feasible to find another route, or a bus, for the same journey. Between towns and cities often the only sensible way to travel (if you can't/don't want to drive) is by train.If you factor in an average delay time to your journey it may very likely still work out quicker or more convenient than any other alternative.

 

[Horizon22]

Marlow to Paddington is the route.
Usually peak journeys involving changes at bourne end and maidenhead

Okay let's break this down. You've said peak, so I've aimed to get you into London before 9am and leaving after 5pm.

AM

• Marlow - Bourne End. No issues here
• Bourne End - Maidenhead. No issues either
• Maidenhead - Paddington. Now if you change onto the GWR 0802, then yes there are some issues: It hasn't run on-time (within 1 minute) ONCE in the last 12 weeks, but 87% of journeys have arrived within 15 minutes which would be the threshold for delay. This would correspond to once every 2 weeks you could claim Delay Repay. This train isn't a good runner. Why? Well its an extra peak train, so is probably a little bit "shoved" into the timetable. This may change in Dec '22 or May '23 and might be improved.

In the AM there's not a fantastic alternative, otherwise you'd get into London 30 mins later. I will say Maidenhead has probably got the worst deal out of TfL taking over the majority of services on the line, so you're a bit unlucky here unfortunately.

PM

• Presumed you're taking the 1720 off Paddington - Maidenhead and changing. Performance here is actually very good and whilst "on-time" is only 43% within 5 minutes is much higher at 91%
• No issues with the shuttle.

Overall, I think the reason you can claim delay is probably because of the 5 minute connection at Maidenhead - even if the Paddington-Maidenhead service is only a few minutes late, you won't make the connection which means a 30 min wait for the Marlow shuttle = Delay Repay. So an interesing case. Be interesting to know in which direction you tend to claim more, AM or PM?

 

[ComUtoR]

Within a city region it is often feasible to find another route, or a bus, for the same journey. Between towns and cities often the only sensible way to travel (if you can't/don't want to drive) is by train.If you factor in an average delay time to your journey it may very likely still work out quicker or more convenient than any other alternative.

I can't travel to many of my local towns by train. The journey is a complete drama because the railway was built with an in/out mentality. I count myself very luck with my transport options.

As I said, it's a captive market for a lot of people.

 

[Jim the Jim]

Horizon has already provided help but that's exactly what the TOCs should be doing. They should be providing you with information about how you might be able to take a different route/service etc and provide information that can help you plan your time better.

The great majority of trips between two stations of the sort a person might reasonably be expected to take as part of their commute to work do not have an alternative rail route available. Where multiple routes do exist, one is likely to take significantly longer than the other. What information do you expect a TOC to give other than "go by car instead"?

 

[Trainbike46]

The TOCs have a captive market.

I don't think this is true. While some elements of the market are captive, and it is important those captive journeys are served well, the TOCs need journeys from people who have alternatives (whether car, bus, coach or flight) to fill their trains, and perceived likelihood of delays do factor into choices people make

 

[ComUtoR]

Where multiple routes do exist, one is likely to take significantly longer than the other. What information do you expect a TOC to give other than "go by car instead"?

Where I live I have multiple route. My expectation from the TOC is to be able to provide a service that is reliable and on time but when it breaks I want them to be able to offer me an alternative route within reason. A lot of the time when entire lines go down they do not strengthen services on the alternative routes. Overcrowding during disruption is quite common. I also want there to be better consultation before a Timetable change so that the demands of the passengers can be met, rather than ignored.

 

[LAX54]

Yes the GEML has its moments, usually they come in batches, but on the whole it is pretty reliable in my experience, with GA certainly one of the better operators. For sure no longer having to squeeze every last drop of capacity during the peaks is a big win for punctuality, as is the performance of the new trains, but NR have played their part. It would be interesting to see the trend for infrastructure failures over the past five years.

Contrast to Great Western where infrastructure reliability has delayed my last three trips over there. The difference between GW and GE reliability is one of the concerns for Crossrail, with the GW side needing to match the GE side.

The trouble with squeezing every last drop of capacity in peak hours is a good idea, it may well be from passengers who demand more trains ! but you only need one train about 3 mins late, and the whole lot starts to tumble like a game of Jenga !
Just no room to recover, unless you start cancelling of terminating short.

 

[306024]

The trouble with squeezing every last drop of capacity in peak hours is a good idea, it may well be from passengers who demand more trains ! but you only need one train about 3 mins late, and the whole lot starts to tumble like a game of Jenga !
Just no room to recover, unless you start cancelling of terminating short.

Exactly, but that was what was needed in the past to provide sufficient capacity to avoid being called in by the DfT for breaching your numbers of standing passengers. Covid has at least helped reduce that, which along with the greater seating capacity now available, means fewer peak trains are required, which does allow some recovery.

 

[miklcct]

Trains are frequently delayed. However, it's not usual to have delays more than 15 minutes, and it's rare to have delays more than 30 minutes.

Most of my delays are in the region of 3-5 minutes, not enough for triggering compensation.

Under most circumstances, if there is a delay / cancellation of more than 15 minutes on a certain line, the best action is to use an alternative line, use another mode of transport of even abandon the journey.

I have taken 602 segments in the National Rail network on 156 different days this year, and I have had 11 Delay Repay claims.

 

[800001]

Again, asking for professional reasons. Why not get a different train ? or a different way to work ?

Why should the customer change there times or way they commute due to the railway failing to deliver a punctual service?