HNRC Swietelsky

[ExRes]

I think this is the appropriate forum, Mods to move if not please

It seems that the two companies have signed an agreement to work together, HNRC have agreed to provide heavy maintenance facilities at Worksop for the SB Rail fleet of On Track Machines and cranes and to provide long term hire for a fleet of up to 26 locos

No doubt further information and actual confirmations will be along soon although I doubt HNRC will be too forthcoming over the loco provision


** This info is, as yet, unconfirmed so it should be made clear that I am unable to link to any specific sources at this time

 

[childwallblues]

I read about this on WNXX. My immediate thoughts were the loco provision. Work for all those 37s HNRC have been collecting?
SB stands for Swietelsky Babcock Rail which I was previously unaware of.

 

[devonlad]

i heard from 2 spotters at worksop that HNRC depot has been sold i wonder if it this they talking about

 

[ExRes]

i heard from 2 spotters at worksop that HNRC depot has been sold i wonder if it this they talking about

This was doing the rounds a while back and nothing black and white has ever come from it, the trouble is that Harry Needle has no time whatsoever for spotters so people tend to form their own opinions, usually negative, about him and his business, personally I wouldn't believe a word about him unless it was actually in print and from a reliable source

 

[DarloRich]

This was doing the rounds a while back and nothing black and white has ever come from it, the trouble is that Harry Needle has no time whatsoever for spotters so people tend to form their own opinions, usually negative, about him and his business, personally I wouldn't believe a word about him unless it was actually in print and from a reliable source

Exactly - I would not listen to any gossip.

 

[yorkie]

Reopened for @ExRes to provide an update

 

[ExRes]

Reopened for @ExRes to provide an update

Thanks @yorkie

Info courtesy of WNXX

Gov.UK records show that as of 8th January Harry Needle Railroad Company Ltd were taken over by Swietelsky Construction Company Ltd and as of 20th December 2024 both Harry Needle, director, and Christine Needle, secretary, had their appointments terminated and were replaced by CS Goldie, director, and AE Cox, finance director

Harry Needle remains as director of the following companies, HNRC Holdings Ltd, HN Rail Ltd and HN Rail Maintenance Ltd

No doubt much more detailed information is to follow

 

[driverd]

To which company do the class 37s that are leased belong?

 

[DarloRich]

Thanks @yorkie

Info courtesy of WNXX

Gov.UK records show that as of 8th January Harry Needle Railroad Company Ltd were taken over by Swietelsky Construction Company Ltd and as of 20th December 2024 both Harry Needle, director, and Christine Needle, secretary, had their appointments terminated and were replaced by CS Goldie, director, and AE Cox, finance director

Harry Needle remains as director of the following companies, HNRC Holdings Ltd, HN Rail Ltd and HN Rail Maintenance Ltd

No doubt much more detailed information is to follow

interesting - thanks for sharing.

 

[eastwestdivide]

Companies house record confirming the resignation info at

HARRY NEEDLE RAILROAD COMPANY LTD people - Find and update company information - GOV.UK

HARRY NEEDLE RAILROAD COMPANY LTD - Free company information from Companies House including registered office address, filing history, accounts, annual return, officers, charges, business activity

find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk

NEEDLE, Christine Anne
Correspondence address
Reedham House, 31 King Street West, Manchester, M3 2PJ
Role Resigned
Secretary
Appointed on
27 May 1999
Resigned on
20 December 2024


NEEDLE, Harry Christopher
Correspondence address
Reedham House, 31 King Street West, Manchester, M3 2PJ
Role Resigned
Director
Date of birth
May 1961
Appointed on
27 May 1999
Resigned on
20 December 2024

 

[Wyrleybart]

To which company do the class 37s that are leased belong?

From the quotes on WNXX it seems that Harry Needle has retained his "little Sulzers" but everything else including the depots at Barrow Hill and Worksop have transferred to the new company - presumably leased in the case of leases.

Be interesting to see where Harry decides to rebuild his 25s 27 and 33.

 

[D365]

There was speculation some months ago of, with Harry Needle looking at retirement, LSL looking to take over HNRC. It seems like this has fallen through.

 

[Black Lane]

37607 has been on test train duty with new Swietelsky branding.

 

[ExRes]

Reported today on WNXX, there is currently a schedule in for Wednesday as 1009 0Z22 Barrow Hill LIP to Loughborough Brush for 37422 to receive the full Swietelsky livery

 

[Rail Quest]

Reported today on WNXX, there is currently a schedule in for Wednesday as 1009 0Z22 Barrow Hill LIP to Loughborough Brush for 37422 to receive the full Swietelsky livery

Do we know if the official Swietelsky livery is just going to be the HNRC colours with the Swietelsky logo applied or will the base livery be different?

 

[DarloRich]

Do we know if the official Swietelsky livery is just going to be the HNRC colours with the Swietelsky logo applied or will the base livery be different?

would it not just be similar to the track machines ?

 

[ExRes]

would it not just be similar to the track machines ?

From what I've seen on the internet SB Rail/Babcock Rail machines seem to be blue and white, very much the same as Balfour Beatty, while Swietelsky are usually yellow with some pictures of orange locos, a la HNRC, on the european mainland, so not much new to look forward to unless they are going for a complete rebrand, 37422 has just arrived at Loughborough so it's just a matter of time .......

 

[XCTurbostar]

37422 is still in Ex-DRS blue

 

[Trainman40083]

37422 is still in Ex-DRS blue

Today it is in ex DRS blue, but not for much longer.

 

[trainlogger]

From what I've seen on the internet SB Rail/Babcock Rail machines seem to be blue and white, very much the same as Balfour Beatty, while Swietelsky are usually yellow with some pictures of orange locos, a la HNRC, on the european mainland, so not much new to look forward to unless they are going for a complete rebrand, 37422 has just arrived at Loughborough so it's just a matter of time .......

The white & blue (and orange) you mention was an adapted livery based on that of the machines' original owners - First Engineering - white, purple and green.

DR 73916 by Ben Williams

This photo shows DR 73916 at West Ealing - Plasser UK. It was taken by Ben Williams on 18 January 2001.

www.ontrackplant.com

DR73916 by ontrackplant.com

This photo shows DR73916 at Long Marston - Rail Live 2014. It was taken by ontrackplant.com on 19th June 2014.

www.ontrackplant.com

Since ~2015 Swietelsky/SBRail's livery for both new machines and repaints has been Yellow with blue and orange stripes.

DR75014 by ontrackplant.com

This photo shows DR75014 at Leagrave Tamper Siding. It was taken by ontrackplant.com on 15th October 2024.

www.ontrackplant.com

The most recent version is yellow with a blue roof, with a machine being repainted last year.

https://www.instagram.com/swietelskyuk_ltd/reel/DCodpxtu6Gp

My personal guess is this how the 37 will be painted - yellow with blue roof.

 

[12LDA28C]

It's been reported that several of HNRC's Class 47s which did not form part of the Swietelsky deal have been sold to various main line operators.

47703 has been sold to Nemesis Rail
47715 has been sold to Rail Engineering Solutions and will be returned to the main line
47843/847 have been sold to West Coast Railways.

 

[ExRes]

It's been reported that several of HNRC's Class 47s which did not form part of the Swietelsky deal have been sold to various main line operators.

47703 has been sold to Nemesis Rail
47715 has been sold to Rail Engineering Solutions and will be returned to the main line
47843/847 have been sold to West Coast Railways.

From what I can make of it 47715 seems to have an interesting future, Rail Engineering Solutions are said to be renovating the loco for use with potential updating of TPWS, GSM-R, OTDR and ETCS systems

 

[Class15]

From what I can make of it 47715 seems to have an interesting future, Rail Engineering Solutions are said to be renovating the loco for use with potential updating of TPWS, GSM-R, OTDR and ETCS systems

Rail Engineering Solutions - interesting acronym too!

 

[D365]

From what I can make of it 47715 seems to have an interesting future, Rail Engineering Solutions are said to be renovating the loco for use with potential updating of TPWS, GSM-R, OTDR and ETCS systems

I would be interested to know who is funding an ETCS ”first in class” fitment. Class 47 [and other contemporary ex-BR locomotives] were contracted to be fitted with Siemens ETCS as part of the East Coast programme, but most of the smaller classes were recently descoped by Network Rail.

 

[12LDA28C]

I would be interested to know who is funding an ETCS ”first in class” fitment. Class 47 [and other contemporary ex-BR locomotives] were contracted to be fitted with Siemens ETCS as part of the East Coast programme, but most of the smaller classes were recently descoped by Network Rail.

I'm not sure that 47715 will be 'first in class'. Various other operators' 47s have already been identified for ETCS fitment, funded by NR although I'm unaware that any such fitment has actually started yet. There's a good chance that a WCRC or LSL 47 will be fitted first since 47715 needs plenty of work to be main line compliant first, let along have ETCS fitted.

 

[D365]

I'm not sure that 47715 will be 'first in class'. Various other operators' 47s have already been identified for ETCS fitment, funded by NR although I'm unaware that any such fitment has actually started yet. There's a good chance that a WCRC or LSL 47 will be fitted first since 47715 needs plenty of work to be main line compliant first, let along have ETCS fitted.

As per my post, Class 47s are currently descoped from the NR ’Freight’ programme, without a design having been finalised. Network Rail’s £40m tender that was announced last year, for a second round of ’Heritage & Charter’ fitments to ~27 locomotives, has not yet been awarded to an OEM.

NR is currently paying huge sums to DBC and Freightliner for locomotives that have been taken out of traffic for ETCS fitment, and which remain out of traffic pending finalisation of paperwork. The benefit of providing a locomotive that isn’t committed in mainline traffic speaks for itself.

 

[12LDA28C]

As per my post, Class 47s are currently descoped from the NR ’Freight’ programme, without a design having been finalised. Network Rail’s £40m tender that was announced last year, for a second round of ’Heritage & Charter’ fitments to ~27 locomotives, has not yet been awarded to an OEM.

NR is currently paying huge sums to DBC and Freightliner for locomotives that have been taken out of traffic for ETCS fitment, and which remain out of traffic pending finalisation of paperwork. The benefit of providing a locomotive that isn’t committed in mainline traffic speaks for itself.

Well that seems about as illogical as you can get, bearing in mind the number of 47-operated charter trains that operate regularly. Millions have already been spent on a Deltic for example, which one might assess as being a rather lower priority for ETCS fitment.

 

[Rail Quest]

I'm not sure that 47715 will be 'first in class'. Various other operators' 47s have already been identified for ETCS fitment, funded by NR although I'm unaware that any such fitment has actually started yet. There's a good chance that a WCRC or LSL 47 will be fitted first since 47715 needs plenty of work to be main line compliant first, let along have ETCS fitted.

The company in question posted on LinkedIn around the time of the sale announcement that:

47715 will serve as a test bed for the latest On Train Data Recorder (OTDR), Train Protection Warning System (TPWS), GSM-R, and European Train Control System (ETCS). This project will allow us to trial and refine cutting-edge safety and operational technologies, ensuring they perform at their best in real-world conditions.

Source: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/rail...p&rcm=ACoAAES2JOIBdF9NRGoKnJsbPUxgTpld7WhLTzo

Them referring to it as a "test bed" suggests to me it would be first in class as I'm assuming they aren't referring to the loco being used as a test bed for general ETCS implementation, given the classes that already have it fitted.

On the topic of funding, I wonder if the conversion will be funded by Rail Engineering Solutions themselves. If they've got some big contracts locked in with players like NR and the operators who may be looking at fitting other 47s with the equipment, then it might be worth the investment.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Mar 2025 ==

I've just realised we're a bit OT now
New thread for 715 maybe?

 

[12LDA28C]

The company in question posted on LinkedIn around the time of the sale announcement that:

Source: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/rail...p&rcm=ACoAAES2JOIBdF9NRGoKnJsbPUxgTpld7WhLTzo

Them referring to it as a "test bed" suggests to me it would be first in class as I'm assuming they aren't referring to the loco being used as a test bed for general ETCS implementation, given the classes that already have it fitted.

Test bed could mean anything. Clearly the loco would not be first in class for having OTDR, GSM-R and TPWS fitted. Various main line registered heritage locos are currently being fitted with ETCS at NR’s expense.

 

[D365]

Test bed could mean anything. Clearly the loco would not be first in class for having OTDR, GSM-R and TPWS fitted. Various main line registered heritage locos are currently being fitted with ETCS at NR’s expense.

The heritage ETCS fitments (currently only Tornado and one or two Deltics) are not comparable as these are very much one-offs. By comparison, there was at one point nearly thirty Class 37s slated for ETCS fitment, which would have included the associated TPWS and OTDR/JRU upgrades.

When you consider that these locomotives are ~60 years old, and have been owned / operated / maintained / overhauled by numerous different parties, the need for a designated ”first in class” test bed becomes apparent, and is the first thing that I would recommend to any party that is serious about fitting ETCS to a fleet of locomotives or units. HNRC / Swietelsky has experience of this from the Cambrian 97s.