Historic Ford Buses/Coaches

[Strathclyder]

Been meaning to put this one together for a while now. No better time to do so than on this dull June morning I think lol

Much like Bedford's bus/coach offerings, Ford's range in the same market has long been a source of great fascination to me, despite them all having long since passed into history (at least locally) by the time I took a active interest in buses. To that end, this thread is dedicated to the blue shield's offerings while they were a active force in the UK market (exports are allowed too). While not the exclusive focus of this thread, the R-Series is my main area of interest here. Buses based on the Thames Trader truck chassis - the 5 Dartford Crossing cycle buses are what I have in mind in this respect - are of course also allowed.

With that said, I'll turn this thread over to the rest of you, but before I do, I'll pose this question that I've always wondered the answer to: Who was the last UK operator to have members of the R-Series in substantial numbers?

 

[GusB]

It was only a matter of time...

I hated the things. They were noisy and rattly, and due to the engine layout and the way the driver got in and out of the cab, the seat immediately behind the cab was usually tipped up to facilitate this. I wouldn't consider it to be a big issue now, but when I was a kid it was annoying as that's where I liked to sit! They were very much a "Marmite" type, but there were a few decent ones.

Regarding numbers, I think Alexander Northern is probably in with a shout as having one of the largest fleets. According to Buslistsontheweb.co.uk there were a total of 187 new, as well as a few earlier models that were acquired when other operators were bought out. The number series went up to NT204, while Midland went up to MT69 and Fife's only went up to FT17 (a few of which headed north).

Highland Omnibuses also had a sizeable fleet of Fords, with the last vehicle in that series being T174.

I know some National Bus Company subsidiaries had them, but I'm not as familiar; it would be interesting to hear the views of those south of the border.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

You also had the abomination that was the A series minibuses.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I know some National Bus Company subsidiaries had them, but I'm not as familiar; it would be interesting to hear the views of those south of the border.

The NBC had a couple of bites at the cherry.

Midland Red had a large number of Plaxton R192s in the early 1970s. These had a reasonable life despite the fact that they were for rural routes; service that began that, after the loss of their Black Country powerbase, to be reviewed and withdrawn. Some of these had an extended life as they were cut down to be midibuses.

Following on from that, they elected to get Ford R1014s for both bus and coach operations; I think it was because of delays in deliveries of other preferred types. That was definitely why Hants & Dorset and Alder Valley got some that received ECW bodies that looked like LHs. Southdown had a few with Duple coach bodies for local tours operations IIRC.

SWT got quite a few with Willowbrook bodies - they tended not to even reach their projected 7 year lives. SWT did like a lightweight (they also had Bedfords) so not a surprise when they received part of an NBC batch of Duple Dominant R1014 buses that arrived and were then distributed to different firms - Lincolnshire, City of Oxford, United Counties, Eastern National. Think the EN ones only last until 1981!

Fortunately, my local firm had the luxury of Bristol LHs!

 

[GusB]

With that said, I'll turn this thread over to the rest of you, but before I do, I'll pose this question that I've always wondered the answer to: Who was the last UK operator to have members of the R-Series in substantial numbers?

As far as Scottish Bus Group (SBG) companies are concerned, Highland seem to be the last. My 1989 fleetbook shows that there were still a dozen in service; in the 1991 edition they're gone completely.

I can't remember when our local Fords disappeared, but there were still a few kicking around in 1985. I've got some photos (somewhere) that were taken at Elgin depot that year and there were a couple, including a very shiny example that appeared to have had a fresh coat of paint. At the time the depot had a row of older buses that were missing various parts, obviously being used as spares donors before the remainder were carted off for scrap.

The last time I recall travelling on a Ford, it was on a hire in Glasgow in 1992. The other coaches were from Allander's smart black and orange fleet, but we were lumbered with the Ford; because of the livery it was carrying, I had assumed it was from the Loch Lomond fleet, but this might not be the case. If I remember rightly, it was fairly quick.

 

[Cesarcollie]

The NBC had a couple of bites at the cherry.

Midland Red had a large number of Plaxton R192s in the early 1970s. These had a reasonable life despite the fact that they were for rural routes; service that began that, after the loss of their Black Country powerbase, to be reviewed and withdrawn. Some of these had an extended life as they were cut down to be midibuses.

Following on from that, they elected to get Ford R1014s for both bus and coach operations; I think it was because of delays in deliveries of other preferred types. That was definitely why Hants & Dorset and Alder Valley got some that received ECW bodies that looked like LHs. Southdown had a few with Duple coach bodies for local tours operations IIRC.

SWT got quite a few with Willowbrook bodies - they tended not to even reach their projected 7 year lives. SWT did like a lightweight (they also had Bedfords) so not a surprise when they received part of an NBC batch of Duple Dominant R1014 buses that arrived and were then distributed to different firms - Lincolnshire, City of Oxford, United Counties, Eastern National. Think the EN ones only last until 1981!

Fortunately, my local firm had the luxury of Bristol LHs!

The NBC had thousands delivered in 1985/6 - In the form of Ford Transits….!!

 

[Merthyr Imp]

This may be the oldest Ford I've got a photo of - A Ford 570E dating from 1960 with Duple Midland bodywork. Seen with Peake of Pontypool in 1971.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The NBC had thousands delivered in 1985/6 - In the form of Ford Transits….!!

Ah yes but the OP wasn't allowing them. The breadvans were hated by most enthusiasts but they were "of their time". Quite fun bounding along on a country road on a Badgerline or Southern National one; the latter were very long lived!

 

[Cesarcollie]

Ah yes but the OP wasn't allowing them. The breadvans were hated by most enthusiasts but they were "of their time". Quite fun bounding along on a country road on a Badgerline or Southern National one; the latter were very long lived!

Indeed they exceeded the expectations of even their greatest fans - I think some lasted in service until around 1999. Although that may be something to do with the fact that Southern National’s ’profits’ (I use the term in its broadest sense) couldn’t fund any form of replacement. And they were ever so cheap to run, even at 13 years old!

 

[GusB]

I really don't want to be a party-pooper, but the opening post did specifically mention the R-series... If anyone wishes to discuss the Transit at length, feel free to do so in a separate thread. Thanks

 

[A0]

One place I remember which used alot of Ford R series was Jersey - when I visited i ln 1990 virtually all JMTs buses seemed to be Fords with either Duple or Willowbrook bodies IIRC.

Guernsey by comparison used a mix of Bedfords and Bristol LHs.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

One place I remember which used alot of Ford R series was Jersey - when I visited i ln 1990 virtually all JMTs buses seemed to be Fords with either Duple or Willowbrook bodies IIRC.

Guernsey by comparison used a mix of Bedfords and Bristol LHs.

Jersey was very much a Ford stronghold. The oddity being that JMT was owned by the same people who had Trimdon Motor Services who a) tended to go for heavyweight chassis for their work and b) then went for Bristol LHs (mainly) when dereg came and they expanded into other areas.

 

[Roger1973]

Brylaine Travel in Lincolnshire (depots then at Boston, Skegness and Coningsby) had quite a collection of Ford coaches of assorted parentage in the 1990s, many of their local bus routes (both interurban and Boston town services) used them - double deckers tended mostly to do workings involving school runs.

Example photo (not mine) here.

The newest / smartest tended to do the Skegness - Boston - London daily service - photo (again not mine, and not sure about the 2013 date) here.

There was at least one ex Scottish Bus Group Alexander Y type (once again not my photo) here. I think there was another with DP seating, although I got the impression that it was something of a favourite of the proprietors so it tended only to do the school run one of them was driving that day, and I can't find a photograph of it.

Not sure when the last was withdrawn - they did start getting in to National 2's when they got more readily available and of course eventually went low floor.

On a personal level, my first attempt to seek PSV training (or PCV - I think it had changed by then) in the mid 90s involved a place that had a Ford coach. For my assessment drive, the instructor said he'd get it out of the yard (it was a bit of an awkward exit on to a dual carriageway) and take it down the road a bit then I could have a go. He couldn't get the gears on a few occasions. I didn't do very well either, and I didn't go through with it with them...

 

[Strathclyder]

As far as Scottish Bus Group (SBG) companies are concerned, Highland seem to be the last. My 1989 fleetbook shows that there were still a dozen in service; in the 1991 edition they're gone completely.

Strathtay was also a fairly late operator of the marque within the SBG, as they had some ex-Midland Y Type-bodied R-Series specimens running in the back half of 1987. Not sure when they ousted Fords from their fleet, but I wouldn't be surprised if they also had all gone by 1991.

Ah yes but the OP wasn't allowing them. The breadvans were hated by most enthusiasts but they were "of their time". Quite fun bounding along on a country road on a Badgerline or Southern National one; the latter were very long lived!

I really don't want to be a party-pooper, but the opening post did specifically mention the R-series... If anyone wishes to discuss the Transit at length, feel free to do so in a separate thread. Thanks

I didn't specifically exclude other types Ford/Thames produced other than the R-Series in my OP, but I'll concede that the Transit in breadvan form is worthy of it's own thread (or a significant part of one on breadvans generally).

Midland Red had a large number of Plaxton R192s in the early 1970s. These had a reasonable life despite the fact that they were for rural routes; service that began that, after the loss of their Black Country powerbase, to be reviewed and withdrawn. Some of these had an extended life as they were cut down to be midibuses.

A similar thing was done with Alder Valley's last 3 ECW-bodied R1014s (TRD 723-725N; new August/September 1974, orginally numbered 723-725 and renumbered 797-799 post-lopping) in 1979 for use on route 18 (Marlow - Maidenhead), which ran over the weight-restricted Marlow Suspension Bridge (linked image copyright of Flickr's Mega Anorak). Believe the conversions were done by Midland Red, though I'm willing to be corrected there if need be.

Alder Valley: 799 (TRD725N) at Marlow Bottom terminus

1974 Ford R1014 ECW, built B45F, fleet no. 725 One of 3 cut down to B27F in 1979 for service over a weight-restricted bridge at Marlow, renumbered 799

www.flickr.com

(Alder Valley's TRD 725N laying over at Marlow Bottom Terminus in May 1979, not long after re-entering service as a midi-bus)

 

[Merthyr Imp]

Here's a Ford R226/Duple belonging to Gardiner's of Spennymoor. Seen probably in 1966 or 1967 when it was almost new at Huntingdon Street Bus Station in Nottingham.

 

[JonathanH]

projected 7 year lives

A similar thing was done with Alder Valley's last 3 ECW-bodied R1014s (TRD 723-725N; new August/September 1974, orginally numbered 723-725 and renumbered 797-799 post-lopping) in 1979 for use on route 18 (Marlow - Maidenhead), which ran over the weight-restricted Marlow Suspension Bridge (linked image copyright of Flickr's Mega Anorak). Believe the conversions were done by Midland Red, though I'm willing to be corrected there if need be.

It seems crazy that these vehicles were gone about two years later along with the rest of the non-standard Alder Valley vehicles leaving basically just Nationals, VRs and coaches.

Nationals older than this were still in service with Reading Buses after the 1992 acquisition.

Presumably the MAP stuff around 1980 and 1981 saw this sort of vehicle off although Alder Valley didn't get any later Nationals than S reg vehicles and there was a sizable fleet of late VRs.

 

[busesrusuk]

Here's one of the Eastern National buses at Harlow:

Eastern National 1000

Harlow Bus Station

www.flickr.com

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It seems crazy that these vehicles were gone about two years later along with the rest of the non-standard Alder Valley vehicles leaving basically just Nationals, VRs and coaches.

Nationals older than this were still in service with Reading Buses after the 1992 acquisition.

Presumably the MAP stuff around 1980 and 1981 saw this sort of vehicle off although Alder Valley didn't get any later Nationals than S reg vehicles and there was a sizable fleet of late VRs.

The MAP schemes of 1979-82 saw a cull of rural routes and also more deckers for schools so there were plenty of youthful casualties. Those were converted by Midland Red but apparently, were withdrawn within months. Good old NBC!

South Wales had a few of the 1976 R1014s that they converted to tow trucks in 1982/3 and this one (courtesy of Richard Haughey) lasted until First days. Can't imagine the fun of dragging in a dead VR with that

NCY 271R

Explore mr-bg's 67599 photos on Flickr!

www.flickr.com

 

[GusB]

South Wales had a few of the 1976 R1014s that they converted to tow trucks in 1982/3 and this one (courtesy of Richard Haughey) lasted until First days. Can't imagine the fun of dragging in a dead VR with that

I find that hard to imagine; in any towing situation it was usually the Ford that was in the rear!

 

[Merthyr Imp]

Ford R192/Willowbrook new in 1971 to Blue Line of Armthorpe:

 

[Swanny200]

As far as Scottish Bus Group (SBG) companies are concerned, Highland seem to be the last. My 1989 fleetbook shows that there were still a dozen in service; in the 1991 edition they're gone completely.

I can't remember when our local Fords disappeared, but there were still a few kicking around in 1985. I've got some photos (somewhere) that were taken at Elgin depot that year and there were a couple, including a very shiny example that appeared to have had a fresh coat of paint. At the time the depot had a row of older buses that were missing various parts, obviously being used as spares donors before the remainder were carted off for scrap.

The last time I recall travelling on a Ford, it was on a hire in Glasgow in 1992. The other coaches were from Allander's smart black and orange fleet, but we were lumbered with the Ford; because of the livery it was carrying, I had assumed it was from the Loch Lomond fleet, but this might not be the case. If I remember rightly, it was fairly quick.

I am sure Aberdeen having at least one Ford in the mid to late 80's

 

[GusB]

I am sure Aberdeen having at least one Ford in the mid to late 80's

They'd definitely all gone by 1989. I wonder if you're possibly thinking of the solitary Volvo B57 which had a similar front-engined layout; it lasted into Stagecoach days.

 

[Merthyr Imp]

A Ford R192/Marshall belonging to York Bros. of Northampton seen in Northampton in the early to mid-1970s.

 

[Swanny200]

They'd definitely all gone by 1989. I wonder if you're possibly thinking of the solitary Volvo B57 which had a similar front-engined layout; it lasted into Stagecoach days.

I have been on the B57 a few times when it was in Northern ownership, but I also remember being on at least one of the Fords, I want to say 1987, on a run to Stonehaven where I decided to get off at Newtonhill (when there was literally nothing there)

 

[Strathclyder]

South Wales had a few of the 1976 R1014s that they converted to tow trucks in 1982/3 and this one (courtesy of Richard Haughey) lasted until First days. Can't imagine the fun of dragging in a dead VR with that

NCY 271R

Explore mr-bg's 67599 photos on Flickr!

www.flickr.com

Am rather surprised that First ended up with a Ford at all, towing vehicle or not! Then again, given the oddities they inherited nationwide, I guess I shouldn't be too surprised.

The MAP schemes of 1979-82 saw a cull of rural routes and also more deckers for schools so there were plenty of youthful casualties. Those were converted by Midland Red but apparently, were withdrawn within months. Good old NBC!

The Alder Valley examples I cited above didn't even last a year post-lopping, presumably also casualities of the MAP schemes. That said, all 3 did have respectable lives post-NBC with several independent firms. One (TRD 723N) even managed to make it into preservation up in the North East of Scotland (with the Angus Transport Group), but it has sadly long since succumbed to scrapping. Here it is with Meffan of Kirremuir (copyright of Flickr's southlancs).

TRD723N

A 'chopped' Ford R1014 / ECW with Meffan of Kirremuir, originally new to Alder Valley.

www.flickr.com

 

[Merthyr Imp]

A Ford R192/Plaxton new in 1968 to Hanson of Huddersfield, seen at Huntingdon Street Bus Station, Nottingham maybe around a year or two later.

 

[DunsBus]

There was the interesting case of the Ford R1014/Plaxton Elite that was built for Hughes' dealer stock in the mid-seventies but didn't enter service until well over ten years later, when it and two Bedfords built around the same time for Hughes (and stored) were bought by Bob Smith Travel in Durham and entered service on E-prefix registrations, the Ford being registered E903DRG. I think the story was that the hidden stash of unsold stock was uncovered when Hughes' premises were being cleared after the owner died and the Bob Smith Bedfords and Ford declared new at first registration, hence the E-regs.

E903DRG must have been one of the last, if not the last Ford R-series to enter passenger service, two and a half years after Ford ceased PSV production.

 

[Merthyr Imp]

This is a Thames 36 (or Ford 676E) complete with a Thames badge on the front. This was Ford's first 36-foot chassis design and I believe was in production for less than two years before the R series was introduced.

The vehicle was new in 1965 to Larratt Pepper of Thurnscoe, but I'm not sure who it belonged to by the time of this photo in the very early 1970s. It is passing the bus station on Huntingdon Street, Nottingham.

 

[Stephen1001]

It's totally cheating since the first post specified UK, but as is often the case the absolute last place the R-series models could be found in service (unless anyone knows better!) is Malta in 2011. I was born in 1992 so never experienced them back here except in preservation, but managed three or four over two trips to the island that year.

 

[Roger1973]

There was the interesting case of the Ford R1014/Plaxton Elite that was built for Hughes' dealer stock in the mid-seventies but didn't enter service until well over ten years later, when it and two Bedfords built around the same time for Hughes (and stored) were bought by Bob Smith Travel in Durham and entered service on E-prefix registrations, the Ford being registered E903DRG. I think the story was that the hidden stash of unsold stock was uncovered when Hughes' premises were being cleared after the owner died and the Bob Smith Bedfords and Ford declared new at first registration, hence the E-regs.

E903DRG must have been one of the last, if not the last Ford R-series to enter passenger service, two and a half years after Ford ceased PSV production.

I had forgotten about that one, and yes, that pretty much matches my understanding of how a 1975 vehicle ended up with a 1987 registration (not sure if DVLA would do it like that now.)

It also ended up with Brylaine Travel in Lincolnshire.

Can find suggestions it went in to preservation in the north-east, this picture (not mine) appears to be at a Lincoln Museum event in November 2002, but a vehicle tax / MOT search does not look like good news, it says last tax expired in 2001 (which doesn't quite match it appearing in public in 2002, although there's another photo out there, probably at the same event, with it showing trade plates.)

There's a chance it could still be lurking somewhere, although probably ought to be shown as on SORN if it is (although I think that if a vehicle wasn't taxed when SORN started, then you don't need to declare SORN - I just can't quite remember when SORN started.)