High Speed 1 ticketing?

[SprinterMan]

I am trying to book a train from Bury St Edmunds (BSE) to Chatam (CTM). TheTrainLine.com says that a standard off-peak return ticket is valid Southeastern High speed services fom St. Pancras to Chatam. Is this true? because frankly, I have my doubts. It has given me no option of an alternative route. Is a standard off-peak ticket valid on HS1 services?
Thanks in adavance

 

[Failed Unit]

I am trying to book a train from Bury St Edmunds (BSE) to Chatam (CTM). TheTrainLine.com says that a standard off-peak return ticket is valid Southeastern High speed services fom St. Pancras to Chatam. Is this true? because frankly, I have my doubts. It has given me no option of an alternative route. Is a standard off-peak ticket valid on HS1 services?
Thanks in adavance

Probably is. Many routes north of the Thames allow free travel on the rip off line as it is the most direct route. Then you have Potters bar to ashford allowed on the rip off line but ashford to Potters bar isn't.

 

[John @ home]

Bury St Edmunds (BSE) to Chatham (CTM). ... Is a standard off-peak ticket valid on HS1 services?

Yes, the walk-on fares, including Off=Peak single/return, are route + Any Permitted and are valid on HS1 (a Permitted Route is 'LONDON' and a Permitted Route for London - Chatham is on map HS).

 

[Deerfold]

Be aware that thetrainline.com is one of the most expensive ways to buy tickes as they charge fees for postage or collection and for using cards - most of the operator web sites don't.

 

[paul1609]

Probably is. Many routes north of the Thames allow free travel on the rip off line as it is the most direct route. Then you have Potters bar to ashford allowed on the rip off line but ashford to Potters bar isn't.

According to Southern Webtis tickets in both directions are valid any permitted and so valid on HS1?

 

[ushawk]

I looked at a return from Eastbourne to Chafford Hundred and it shown that i could use HS1 for a couple of journeys (to connect with the limited c2c train at Stratford).

 

[Failed Unit]

According to Southern Webtis tickets in both directions are valid any permitted and so valid on HS1?

My last two journeys I was charged £28.50 to go south valid on rip-off1. Going the other way £28 not valid on rip-off1. This was back in September. My understanding to why is to stop people going north from buying the Potters bar ticket and saving money going to London.

 

[John @ home]

you have Potters bar to ashford allowed on the rip off line but ashford to Potters bar isn't.

I don't agree. Potters Bar to Ashford International fares are:

route + NOT VALID ON HS1
FDS 33.60
FDR 66.00
SDS 22.00
SDR 29.00
SVR 28.00 5M
CDR 23.00 C4

route + Any Permitted
FDS 34.10
FDR 67.20
SDS 22.40
SDR 33.00
SVR 28.50 4Q
CDR 24.70 C4

Ashford International to Potters Bar fares are:

route + NOT VALID ON HS1
FDS 33.60
FDR 66.00
SDS 22.00
SDR 35.00
SVR 28.00 4J
CDR 23.00 C4

route + Any Permitted
FDS 34.10
FDR 91.20!!
SDS 30.40
SDR 35.60
SVR 32.50 4A
CDR 29.80 C4

I suspect the £91.20 fare is an error.

 

[Failed Unit]

Just checked a photocopy of the tickets it was in fact Canterbury and not Ashford so you are getting more for less. The Potters bar to Canterbury says any permitted on it. The canterbury to Potters bar says not rip-off route. Btw I would be annoyed if I bought and first class ticket.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Reading johns post again I was sort of right. Potters Bar to Ashford any permitted is £28.50. Going the other way it is £32.50. I was charged the £28.00 classic. My dispute was SouthEastern would not excess the ticket the just charged me the high speed tax.

 

[philjo]

Definitely something wrong with that FDR fare but I can't think why anyone would purchase any first class fare for this journey even if the price is corrected.

At peak periods, the majority of services calling at Potters Bar are 313s (std class only!) Off-peak you would get 14 minutes in 1st in a 365 (or 317).

 

[yorkie]

There are many high speed / Intercity trains in this country and can be used on tickets marked 'Any Permitted' ( or any other routeing that does not forbid their use).

There is nothing special about South Eastern's high speed trains whatsoever (they don't even have first class or a buffet!) and they are not timetabled to go any faster than other high speed trains on various other operators.

Unfortunately ATOC have decided to use their definition of "simple" by making the system more complicated.

In the case of some routes around the country, there are tickets that are cheaper if you avoid the high speed routes (e.g. York to Middlesbrough route NOT Darlington, Leeds to Carlisle route Appleby etc) but the tickets that are valid on the high speed routes are marked Any Permitted.

ATOC decided this was too simple for the South Eastern route and decided that the Any Permitted tickets for some flows (generally flows that do not go beyond London) would be abolished and replaced with "Plus High Speed" or "Not HS1" however there are still Any Permitted tickets for longer journeys, and they are of course valid via any permitted route so there is no problem using them on HS1.

ATOC could have kept things genuinely simple (rather than their laughable ideas of simple) by continuing to use the term Any Permitted.

ATOC have confused people, and this isn't the first time and it won't be the last. They seem to delight in doing that. Even some South Eastern guards are confused (which is inexcusable!)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I looked at a return from Eastbourne to Chafford Hundred and it shown that i could use HS1 for a couple of journeys (to connect with the limited c2c train at Stratford).

A ticket from Eastbourne to Chafford Hundred is valid for a journey via all the permitted routes between Eastbourne & London, then all the permitted routes between London & Chafford Hundred. If you use HS1 there are various options including taking NXEA from Stratford to Romford then using the train to Upminster, or you can go via West Ham (which is perhaps the most sensible route) or even via Gospel Oak (which is a bit bonkers, but valid).

If you are returning another day, you will find it cheaper to split the ticket at Upminster. (Chafford Hundred is £10.70 more than Upminster for an SVR!)