-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Help train driver assessment
- Thread starter Bangs_18
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
daddy_badger
Member
Hi there's a. Wealth of information on here regarding the DTG and CBI have a look at the threads below this one in relation to assessments or do a search the forum.
My advice would be to prepare for the interview more than the reactions test! The reactions test is fairly trivial, and some basic preparation will be enough to pass it. The interview (CBI) is a whole different ball game, and it is your performance in this that will make or break your chances. The interview will put you under quite intense pressure - it's designed to. So you really need to be fully prepared, alert and able to respond to this pressure.
Plenty of information on these forums - just use the search and look for "structured interview" "CBI" "criteria based interview" and so on.
Look harder!!
There's a million questions on here seriously.
You need to think of good examples where you have been involved in situations such as.....
An Emergency
An angry customer/person
A time you rectified a fault
A pressurised situation
Think of plenty of situations that you can use.
Make notes and remember the more situations and examples you can think of the better chance you will have of not sat infront of the panel going "umm errr well err"
Good luck.
Yep, they give you a question paper with around 5 questions that you need to answer in writing. You have about 25 minutes to answer all questions.
The paper is then collected from you and you're sent out for a small break. The assesor will then read your answers and call you in for the interview. He/She will then question you on each of your answers asking you to explain exactly what it is YOU did and how you felt, what factors did you take into account when making those decisions, what could you have done differently etc. My SI went on for 70 minutes, and the time does not fly trust me. You are put under alot of pressure and asked the same questions worded differently to try and catch you out. It is important to be honest and remain consistant avoiding contradicting yourself. Some of the answers will overlap so it is very easy to get frustrated as you may feel you are repeating yourself over and over again at times.
When the assesor told me my 25 minutes had started I did not think to look at my watch so was clueless throughout as to how long I had left to complete the paper. I would recommend making a mental note of your start time so you can manage your answer time better than I did.
That is the whole point of the SI to see how you perform under pressure and whether you can remain calm and constructive.
dude, look above. the tests ARE the easy part in my opinion. the interviews felt really draining and i like to think i can think on my feet. good luck.
hi so far i am looking into
have i been in an emergency situation?
have i worked under rules and regs?
have i worked alone for long periods of time?
working with tight deadlines?
relying info onto a group of people?
dealt with a difficult problem?
dealt with an angry person?
rectified a problem?
i felt the drivers interview went good for me, but if i recall they did not probe me.
have i been in an emergency situation?
have i worked under rules and regs?
have i worked alone for long periods of time?
working with tight deadlines?
relying info onto a group of people?
dealt with a difficult problem?
dealt with an angry person?
rectified a problem?
i felt the drivers interview went good for me, but if i recall they did not probe me.
You found them in the end then.
yes i think i can relate to all of those questions, just a case of nailing it!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I have been told now that they may ask why I want to be a driver? And about the company, I have already sat the drivers interview. Could someone clarify please.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I have been told now that they may ask why I want to be a driver? And about the company, I have already sat the drivers interview. Could someone clarify please.
daddy_badger
Member
Who have you applied to?
Even if you've sat the Managers interview already. The person carrying out the structured interview could theoretically ask you anything they want.
You need to stop stressing, if you are competent enough to drive trains you'll pass regardless of whether you prepare in advance or not.
Beveridges
Established Member
That is assuming the tests are not flawed. Which they are. As I have said enough times.
The fact is, they are a barrier to some people who are otherwise perfectly capable of doing the job. That barrier can be broken by extensive preperation and seeking advice from previous candidates.
In their current state they are flawed - official documents even state this. However, I'm not so sure the proposed new tests aren't flawed too. After all, given enough practice you can train a monkey to do basic tasks, and unless they come up with a test which can't be practiced (which, looking at them they haven't) most people will be able to "train" themselves to pass the new tests. Just like they are doing for the current tests.
How do you k ow that they are a barrier? Has anyone who failed them gone onto become a successful train driver?
And the drop out rate on the training course isn't that high, although some do drop out, the vast majority by a long way get through it so they can't be that flawed!
As I have said in another thread, you don't need to be stressing about these tests. If you have to stress this much about them then sorry but you probably aren't cut out for the job. Most people who pass them and pass the interviews and start on the job do so with basic preparation as none of them are that taxing, just relax, concentrate, read the instructions and do your best.
They aren't a barrier to suitable candidates at all, and if they are then that isn't a problem. As long as they don't let the wrong people through, which they don't.
Just because a report says it, doesn't make it fact! And it still doesn't mean they as unsuitable or make cheating on them acceptable. They aren't a barrier to people getting a job.
Agreed. I've sat them and flew through. if anything the paper parts are too easy.
I did the Dots Test, Rules Trainability, Mechanical Comprehension and Dial test after working a 10 hour evening shift finishing 1am, no sleep and then driving to the test centre first thing. Managed a very good pass on Dots, 100% on Memory and Dials test, Pass on Mechanical Comprehension (they wouldn't give me a proper score).
I did the reactions and Structured interview after traveling 4 hours to get to the test centre and got a very good pass on reactions and passed the Structured Interview. All I practiced and read were the examples the TOC sent me.
I read the bit about it being difficult for Ethnic Minorities. Seeing as the training is done in English, the Rule Book is only printed and available in English, all Safety Critical Communication is done in English and all Notices and Reports are completed using English I fail to see what changes they want to make unless they are going to start offering literature in different formats and multi-lingual Signallers.
Well the report is based on research, not guesswork. For example, the report states that the GBT is not valid as a measure of vigilance, yet this test was originally intended to be so! Which begs the question what other parts of the assessment process are not fit for the purpose they were originally intended!
Suffice to say, the tests in their current form are certainly flawed - by the very fact that it is possible to learn, practice and become competent enough to pass all parts of the test just by using basic common sense and the Internet!
However, we are all entitled to our opinions and I'm not going to get involved in lengthy arguments. Especially as I didn't do the research or write the report!
Last edited:
I think you're missing the point A-driver is trying to make though I can see what you mean.
I believe you're saying they're flawed because they don't successfully test what they're supposed to, which is an understandable point.
However, the suggestion they're not flawed comes from the fact that whether they're the right or wrong tests, unsuitable candidates are not getting through them (whether or not all the suitable candidates are).
Quite simply TOCs are swamped with driver applications. There isn't a problem with the tests ruling out too many people as it isnt like too few people get through to fill the positions. I know its un fair on some and easy for me to say as someone who has the job already but it is true.
And even from those who do pass, many more get weeded out at the interview as, whilst that used to be no more than a formality, it is now taken very seriously by TOCs who are becoming more and more choosey on who they employ than they used to be. So even making the tests easier wouldn't lift any barriers to getting the job.
As I say, I know it dosnt seen fair to those who have failed the tests but they arnt responsible for a shortage of suitable candidates which is leading to too few drivers on the railways. As long as they arnt letting the wrong people through (which they don't seem to be and no evidence suggests that they do) then they are working.
As I have already said, I don't see the need to get so worked up in preparation of the tests. It certainly won't help, if you have the skills the tests are looking for then you will pass with little or no preparation apart from a good nights sleep and a professional attitude on the day. If you don't then no amount of practice will get you through both the tests and interviews.
Its only a job, there are others out there and whilst train driving is a good job, and whilst its easy for me to say, its certainly not worth getting so wound up about! Just give it your best shot, be natural and confident and let the tests amd interviews do what they do.
And even from those who do pass, many more get weeded out at the interview as, whilst that used to be no more than a formality, it is now taken very seriously by TOCs who are becoming more and more choosey on who they employ than they used to be. So even making the tests easier wouldn't lift any barriers to getting the job.
As I say, I know it dosnt seen fair to those who have failed the tests but they arnt responsible for a shortage of suitable candidates which is leading to too few drivers on the railways. As long as they arnt letting the wrong people through (which they don't seem to be and no evidence suggests that they do) then they are working.
As I have already said, I don't see the need to get so worked up in preparation of the tests. It certainly won't help, if you have the skills the tests are looking for then you will pass with little or no preparation apart from a good nights sleep and a professional attitude on the day. If you don't then no amount of practice will get you through both the tests and interviews.
Its only a job, there are others out there and whilst train driving is a good job, and whilst its easy for me to say, its certainly not worth getting so wound up about! Just give it your best shot, be natural and confident and let the tests amd interviews do what they do.
Beveridges
Established Member
Yes. There are successful long-term Drivers at my place who got in before the tests came out. They have since gone and sat them for one reason or anther and failed.
I would imagine it is exactly the same situation at other places, in other types of driving roles, at other locations.
The tests rule people out who would otherwise be good for the job.
They also let people go through who are later unsuccessful in their driving career. The amount of ex-drivers who are now Despatchers, Conductors, Gateline or in the Booking Office proves this. Some of which failed during training, others after passing out. My TOC are not one for taking people off the job for just one incident.
The tests don't do the job they're supposed to do. Thats before over-practicing even enters the equation. As for a suggestion of something better? I can't think of one, but having a "Structured Interview" that counts as "two fails and your out" is rediculous.
Last edited:
Not going to get dragged into an argument but can you provide some specifics for your argument? You say many drivers have left the grade as they were unsuitable-many dries have incidents over a number of years meaning they can't return to driving, some have to leave for medical reasons, others can drive for many years withi a clean record then have an incident severe enough to end their driving career.
It doesn't mean the tests are letting the wrong people through-and even if your point is valid it's a very small minority which are getting through. In my 3 depots which I have been based to date I have only known 2 drivers sacked or moved to other depots for reasons like you mention. No one who joined around the same time as me or since has dropped out or been taken out of the driving seat permenantly. Just because you have a spad or other operating incident it doesn't make you unfit for the job.
TOCDriver
Member
- Joined
- 24 Jan 2013
- Messages
- 609
I'll back up A-driver here. I have never know a driver sacked or moved for the reasons mentioned above in my 20 years experience
Beveridges
Established Member
When I worked on platforms, one of them went despatching trains after failing his driver training and getting booted off the course. He said he found the psychometric tests very easy. There were 3 on the gateline taken off driving and another 3 in the booking office as well, some of them due to multiple incidents, others I'm not sure because I never got round to finding out why they were there. Not saying these were unsuitable but the example written at the top of my post is certainly someone who was unsuitable who got through the tests. He never even practiced as well!
To be fair there are always exceptions to these things though. If I was going to get petty I could find 200 drivers who passed the tests and are suited to the job and have never had an incident to contradict the 1 driver you have given as an example here.
I'm not saying everyone who passes will be a great driver-of course they won't but no system will ever be 100%-that's the thing with human beings, there will always be exceptions.
As I say, just because you know a few who passed the tests and then didn't get on with the job it dosnt make the selection process unsuitable. How many pass other tests for jobs like the police, medical school, pilot training, fire service etc etc and then drop out?
- Status