Help please! London to St Helens

[samstyles]

Hello everyone, I hope someone can help me.

I have to be in London on Thursday and Friday of this week. I have a return ticket from Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston (Off Peak Return with 16-25 railcard). I am due to get the 1640 train back on Friday, scheduled back in to Piccadilly at 1849, (I think). Problem is - I need to get to St Helens rugby league ground for kick off at 2000. I don't have a car, so I'm going to struggle to get from Manchester to St Helens in an hour...

Potentially I could get the 1901 from Piccadilly arriving in St Helens at 1927 (if everything runs on time and even then it's cutting it fine).

I was wondering if anyone knows whether I can use my return ticket from Euston to Piccadilly to travel from Euston to Warrington Bank Quay - in this case I could get a lift from Warrington and everyone's a winner! In theory at least going from London to Manchester via Warrington is not that crazy of an idea... anyone know if my ticket would be valid? Would the ticket inspectors be sympathetic or really mean?!

Any help appreciated,

Cheers,

Sam

 

[dan_atki]

Finishing your journey in Warrington is fine on your ticket, subject to the condition you travel on Virgin Trains or leave Euston at or after 1845. Then again I doubt London Midland was really an option!

Map combination GM+MA of the National Routeing Guide permits travel from London to Warrington then onto Manchester.

Hope this helps!

 

[samstyles]

Thanks for the fast response. I've had a look at the guide and I think I understand what it's saying:

GM + MA is a valid route from London Stations to Manchester Stations.

MA includes London to Warrington
GM includes Warrington to Manchester

Therefore the route is acceptable. Have I interpreted this correctly?

Also, can you just clarify that having to travel on Virgin Trains, or after 1845 is because I have an Off-peak ticket with a 16-25 railcard? I would be ok to get the 1633 - 1835 or the 1657 - 1849 Virgin trains services to Warrington?

 

[clagmonster]

As the ticket is priced by Virgin, and is YP railcard discounted, it is valid on any Virgin train out of Euston. If you use any other operator, you are restricted to trains departing Euston before 15:01 or after 18:44.
If you wish to travel to St Helens, you could purchase an over-distance excess to St Helens for £0.00. You need to take your ticket and railcard to a staffed ticket office to do that. You will then, I think, be able to travel on any permitted route from Euston-St Helens, not just those via Manchester.

 

[yorkie]

Also, can you just clarify that having to travel on Virgin Trains, or after 1845 is because I have an Off-peak ticket with a 16-25 railcard? I would be ok to get the 1633 - 1835 or the 1657 - 1849 Virgin trains services to Warrington?

Virgin advertise - but not very well - that Off Peak tickets are valid on any Virgin train at any time if a Railcard is held, regardless of any restrictions on the ticket. However restrictions still apply when travelling with any other operator.

This 'easement' is not well publicised at all. I can only find passing references to it on their website, I cannot find any details on the National Rail website or the Virgin website. The only place I have known it advertised by Virgin is on announcements by Train Managers.

As the ticket is priced by Virgin.

The "where Virgin price the ticket" part is not enforceable as that condition is not advertised and it is impossible for any customer to determine whether Virgin set the ticket for themselves, and I've never heard of it being enforced.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

It's mentioned in section 6 of the Virgin Trains Ticket & Fares leaflet (02 January 2010 until further notice version).

Railcard holders - did you know?
If you hold a valid 16-25, Senior, Family & Friends, HM Forces or Disabled Railcard and have used it to purchase your Off-Peak ticket, you can actually travel at Peak times on most Virgin Trains services (restrictions on certain services may apply).

Doesn't mention what the exceptions are.:roll:

 

[dan_atki]

Doesn't mention what the exceptions are.:roll:

I assume that is the 'where Virgin Trains price the flow' condition in public terms!

 

[yorkie]

I assume that is the 'where Virgin Trains price the flow' condition in public terms!

But it says there may be restrictions for certain 'services'. That's quite different.

 

[dan_atki]

But it says there may be restrictions for certain 'services'. That's quite different.

Indeed, either it means as it reads and the 'may' is just in there as a wheeze if they want to bar it on some services at any time in the future, or it means as I said but phrased in a silly way as you have shown.

Maybe 'flow' was deemed too technical, 'tickets' too confusing as they stated 'Off Peak', and 'tickets for journeys between certain stations' was too long winded!