Headbolt Lane progress updates

[Bletchleyite]

As I said before, what's done is done.

Let's hope that next time the self appointed expert name selecters spend more than five minutes on the task rather than choosing one which, at best, is just barely adequate.

I think it was effectively picked back in the 70s!

Suffixing it (Kirkby) on the PIS will be fine.

 

[childwallblues]

I think it was effectively picked back in the 70s!

Suffixing it (Kirkby) on the PIS will be fine.

As I said before, what's done is done.

Let's hope that next time the self appointed expert name selecters spend more than five minutes on the task rather than choosing one which, at best, is just barely adequate.

Should be left as it is. We taxpayers in Liverpool City Region do not want more of our money spent on altering the signage/PIS.

 

[Djgr]

I think it was effectively picked back in the 70s!

Suffixing it (Kirkby) on the PIS will be fine.

They obviously had grand plans for Headbolt Lane fifty years ago.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Another Merseyrail station with no area name is that of Rice Lane, which was originally called Preston Road when it was opened on 20th November 1848 and was not renamed until 14th May 1984.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Another Merseyrail station with no area name is that of Rice Lane, which was originally called Preston Road when it was opened on 20th November 1848 and was not renamed until 14th May 1984.

There are loads of them. But how many are termini for trains from further away?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

There are loads of them. But how many are termini for trains from further away?

Are you saying that at these stations further away, where prospective passengers board their trains, that there is no station schedules on departing trains information either prior to entering the departure platforms or on the station platforms?

 

[Djgr]

There are loads of them. But how many are termini for trains from further away?

Ones that come to mind: Green Lane, Conway Park, Manor Road, Hall Road


(without getting into the debate of whether it is James Street or Liverpool James Street and whether Hamilton Square is a square or an area)

Other recentish renamings (not just shortenings) Mersey Road and Aigburth, Allerton/Garston, Marsh Lane and Strand Road,

 

[Baxenden Bank]

The name is a bit confusing for passengers coming from other Merseyside stations, but worse for passengers on the Northern service which originates in far away towns like Rochdale or Todmorden or Blackburn. I don't think Headbolt Lane is a suitable name for the destination of services starting elsewhere on the network. It really gives no clue as to where the train is going. It might be different on Merseyside if you've been paying attention to recent public transport announcements but that's as good as it gets.

Headbolt Lane is as meaningful as Rainford or Kirkby to someone boarding at Blackburn. They've probably never heard of all three. They do want to know if the train is for Manchester and which way (Bolton or Todmorden).

 

[HUY2ROB]

The name is the one proposed in the 1970s Merseyrail plan. Baltic wasn't proposed back then (not surprising as it wasn't really a destination, rather a bit of a run down dump) so they had to come up with a name.

Here's the 1970s map:


Photo: 1970s Merseyrail proposal map from an Echo article, with headline under it "hovercraft could rocket Mersey into space age".

I wonder where the proposed Longview station between Huyton and Prescot would have been? It would have been well named as the area with that name is a mile and half away. I suppose it would have been where the line crosses Longview Drive and "Longview Drive" would be no good as a station name.

 

[Djgr]

I wonder where the proposed Longview station between Huyton and Prescot would have been? It would have been well named as the area with that name is a mile and half away. I suppose it would have been where the line crosses Longview Drive and "Longview Drive" would be no good as a station name.

Did Whiston station (opened 1990) replace this idea?

 

[Bevan Price]

I wonder where the proposed Longview station between Huyton and Prescot would have been? It would have been well named as the area with that name is a mile and half away. I suppose it would have been where the line crosses Longview Drive and "Longview Drive" would be no good as a station name.

Longview Drive would have been the most accurate name. But given the site geometry, and the way housing areas have developed, it might have been easier to reopen Huyton Quarry station.

 

[8A Rail]

Did Whiston station (opened 1990) replace this idea?

A simple answer is no. The distance between them (as well as been on two different lines) is around two miles! Whiston had substantial residential properties already were the station was eventually sited (that is before any further properties were built including my own home, Whiston is my local station, about 5 minutes away).

The proposed 'Longview' station, Huyton (#) was to be located on the bridge that crossed the Prescot line and again there was / still very substantial residential housing estates around there. Reopening Huyton Quarry Station would of been a good alternative to that proposed station as the distance between them is about 400/500 metres.

(#) Alernative names could of been easily 'Mosscroft' or 'Pluckington' (Farm) as they are the two housing estates off Longview Drive.

 

[cakefiend]

Does anyone have the mileage for the Merseyrail extension to Headbolt Lane?

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Does anyone have the mileage for the Merseyrail extension to Headbolt Lane?

The NR sectional appendix lists the buffer stops at Headbolt Lane as 28m56ch and Kirkby at 29m41ch which comes to the same 0m65ch. I'm assuming you did the same calculation.

Post #548 (above) says 0m 65 chains, which equals 0.8125 miles

 

[urbophile]

I went there yesterday for the first time (a bit miffed that Geoff Marshall beat me to it). Smooth and punctual trip on a 777; station looking spruce and businesslike in the sunshine; plenty of staff in attendance (many of them appeared to be temporary - for the location - security personnel but they were much more helpful than threatening). Good to see the ticket office open and used. However the landscaping and approach routes are still not ready. The main car park is still under construction; the only way into the site is by the main roadway from Headbolt Lane and the footpaths (particularly the crucial one south from the station to St Kevin's Drive/ Northwood) are still locked off. I took a diversion over the nearby footbridge but it does add a few minutes and not a walk I would want to do on a rainy night. Anyway hopefully it won't be long before that is remedied.

Architecturally it is a bit bland but it does look like an appropriate building for its purpose, and much better than the utilitarian brick boxes that 1970s Merseyrail threw up, like the original Kirkby station.

 

[cakefiend]

Post #548 (above) says 0m 65 chains, which equals 0.8125 miles

with respect, my question was post 673

 

[pokemonsuper9]

with respect, my question was post 673

Indeed, I don't expect people to read through a whole thread, I just quote the post number if it's in the same thread.

 

[childwallblues]

I too visited Headbolt Lane today this being my first round trip from Sandhills. Last weeks trip was from Wigan Wallgate changing for Sandhills. I was very impressed with the layout and the station building. A large bicycle shed is provided but no takers at the time of my visit. A fair customers alighting/departing the train.
I noted a number 20 bus which runs between Liverpool City Centre and Tower Hill estate using the interchange but I do not know which other bus routes use it.

 

[pokemonsuper9]

I noted a number 20 bus which runs between Liverpool City Centre and Tower Hill estate using the interchange but I do not know which other bus routes use it.

Timetable data shows 14A, 14C and 217 (stop A) with 20 being stop B.
There seems to be a decent number of busses that go right past (many being school busses but that makes sense)

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Indeed, I don't expect people to read through a whole thread, I just quote the post number if it's in the same thread.

That may come across to some as condescending, as it’s less hassle to just answer the question normally

 

[Dr Hoo]

I get that the service pattern is actually fairly straightforward (if a little quirky) but was surprised that the only summary departure screen seems to be outside, exposed to the elements.

The only 'electronic display' in the booking hall appears to be an advertising panel.

Have the designers been influenced by the recent Euston changes, I wonder?

 

[domcoop7]

A simple answer is no. The distance between them (as well as been on two different lines) is around two miles! Whiston had substantial residential properties already were the station was eventually sited (that is before any further properties were built including my own home, Whiston is my local station, about 5 minutes away).

The proposed 'Longview' station, Huyton (#) was to be located on the bridge that crossed the Prescot line and again there was / still very substantial residential housing estates around there. Reopening Huyton Quarry Station would of been a good alternative to that proposed station as the distance between them is about 400/500 metres.

(#) Alernative names could of been easily 'Mosscroft' or 'Pluckington' (Farm) as they are the two housing estates off Longview Drive.

Off topic, but I used to live on Manorwood, very handy station when I lived there. But it's actually not ideally sited as apart from people living within walking distance, it's a huge detour from the main roads to get to. Would have been better on one or other of the bridges at Dragon Lane or Cumber Lane - interestingly there were plans back in the 1970s to build housing on the Forestry Commission site the other side of Cumber Lane, although until 1992 (I think) the boundary line between St Helens and Knowsley councils ran on an irregular path down that site.

At least they didn't call Whiston Station "Pennywood Drive" or "Langbar"!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

.... - interestingly there were plans back in the 1970s to build housing on the Forestry Commission site the other side of Cumber Lane, although until 1992 (I think) the boundary line between St Helens and Knowsley councils ran on an irregular path down that site.

Would those plans have met with much opposition from the Forestry Commision and other similarly associated bodies during the discussion stages?

 

[8A Rail]

Off topic, but I used to live on Manorwood, very handy station when I lived there. But it's actually not ideally sited as apart from people living within walking distance, it's a huge detour from the main roads to get to. Would have been better on one or other of the bridges at Dragon Lane or Cumber Lane - interestingly there were plans back in the 1970s to build housing on the Forestry Commission site the other side of Cumber Lane, although until 1992 (I think) the boundary line between St Helens and Knowsley councils ran on an irregular path down that site.

At least they didn't call Whiston Station "Pennywood Drive" or "Langbar"!

Would those plans have met with much opposition from the Forestry Commision and other similarly associated bodies during the discussion stages?

Yes, unfortunately it is off topic being not related to Headbolt Lane. First it is not much of detour from the main roads around that area to Whiston Station. As far as the siting of the station, to be honest it was really the only location without clogging up the road system around both Dragon Lane and Cumber Lane for numerous reasons especially at the former. Having a station located at Cumber Lane, is taking the station away from were people live and also taking it much closer to Rainhill Station too. I have lived in the area now for 22 years and never once thought the station should of been elsewhere. other than were it is presently located. I am not sure if you are now familiar with the area these days but currently traffic in and around Whiston Village (Dragon Lane / Greene Lane / Windy Arbor Road) is becoming a nightmare and will get worse with the impending 'new' housing estates being built. Access to Tarbuck Island (M62/M57) is already a mobile car park and going to get worst. The present site of Whiston Station has room for expansion for more park and ride. However, since Covid, the car park has never been full all because of the frequency of the present service (hourly), it needs to revert back to every half hour, if that happens far more people would use the train, there is no doubt about that.

(Now to the land held by the Forestry Commission by Cumber Lane. First that land is within the boundary of St Helens Council and locally known as Whiston Woods and one of the few places were people can get exercise etc as is is almost countryside there although Rainhill is at the top of the hill so to speak. Over recent times Knowsley MBC are attempting purchase that land from the Forestry Commission as well as seeking planning permission from St Helens Council to build / locate cemetery on it rather the extend the existing nearby Foxes Bank Lane Cemetery which has additional land for expansion but the KMB Council prefer to not too as well selling land nearby to fund house building instead. As you may imagine there is local opposition against this proposal along with the money to be spent including purchase which is over £2 million as basically destroying the woods as well as taking away a useful facility. I won't say anymore because it is off topic but just you need to know the basics).

 

[jamesst]

I get that the service pattern is actually fairly straightforward (if a little quirky) but was surprised that the only summary departure screen seems to be outside, exposed to the elements.

The only 'electronic display' in the booking hall appears to be an advertising panel.

Have the designers been influenced by the recent Euston changes, I wonder?


View attachment 145427View attachment 145428View attachment 145428View attachment 145427

The panels are being installed around the Merseyrail network and should be displaying train information when they go live.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I did notice that the PIS arrangement is sub-optimal, with no normal display in the booking hall area and the platform ones quite a long way along. There needs to be a display the same as the one outside by the doors onto the platforms. If there's not the money for an extra one, move the one outside into the booking office.

Interesting that the signage sticks with Rail Alphabet rather than RA2.

 

[Skie]

The panels are being installed around the Merseyrail network and should be displaying train information when they go live.

Yeah, have spotted them popping up all over!

 

[urbophile]

Interesting that the signage sticks with Rail Alphabet rather than RA2.

That's Mersyrail standard for station names I think, although a range of inconsistent typefaces seems to be used for other things especially the name Merseyail itself. Oh for a Scouse Frank Pick!

 

[mcnw35282]

I get that the service pattern is actually fairly straightforward (if a little quirky) but was surprised that the only summary departure screen seems to be outside, exposed to the elements.

The only 'electronic display' in the booking hall appears to be an advertising panel.

Have the designers been influenced by the recent Euston changes, I wonder?


View attachment 145427View attachment 145428View attachment 145428View attachment 145427

There's a 2nd summary departure screen on the walkway between the Merseyrail and Northern platforms

 

[Bletchleyite]

There's a 2nd summary departure screen on the walkway between the Merseyrail and Northern platforms

Perhaps move that one, then. There isn't one in the occasional user's path towards the platforms to answer the question "oh, there's two Merseyrails, which one is going first?" which is almost certain to be the main use case for them except when things have gone very wrong.