Head Codes

[Andy873]

In my book about my old branch line there is a photo of a Fairburn 2-6-4 tank engine pulling empty coaching stock (ECS) on its way to Bolton.

The ECS looks like empty passenger carriages.

My question is why the engine does not show the head code 3J46 listed in my WTT? I can't attach the photo because of copyright.

Why would you not show a head code in 1964?

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[30907]

Steam locos didn't regularly carry 4-character headcodes, any more than early diesels did. I assume it has the correct lamp code?
Apart from the WR, which repurposed its reporting number system to carry the last 3 characters, I've only seen numbers pasted onto boards, typically for specials, and that's a system that existed before 4-character headcodes.

 

[John Webb]

Steam engines did not display the WTT headcodes as they had no way of doing so, unlike the incoming diesels, many of which were fitted with a means of displaying such individual headcodes. Instead the engine would have carried lamps on the buffer-beam centre and left (as seen from in front) indicating the more general class C (=3) train. You might want to try and get copies of the General Appendix to Working Timetables and Books of Rules and Regulations; I have copies from 1960 and 1972 (both known as BR Publication 29944). The 1960 version has no reference to the use of the individual train identifiers, the 1972 version requires engines and trains to display the individual identifier and only to use headlamps or discs where the loco or unit couldn't display them. (Obviously by 1972 there were no steam locos left on BR!)

It probably won't affect you much in your particular area of interest, but the Southern Railway/BR(S) used headlamps and discs more as routing codes than as identifying the individual train as per the WTT. I think the GWR/BR(W) stuck printed paper numbers on a disc to indicate the train individually particularly on "Summer Saturdays" when many extra trains and relief trains were run - this was before the 4-digit headcodes were developed, of course.

 

[Magdalia]

I've only seen numbers pasted onto boards, typically for specials, and that's a system that existed before 4-character headcodes.

Those boards, which could be fixed to lamp brackets, were also used on summer Saturday holiday trains. In both cases I think they were mainly for train identification on locosheds and in carriage sidings, rather than for signalmen along the route. I have also seen pictures of steam locos with reporting numbers chalked on the smokebox door.

From the OP's known interest, I think the trains carrying headcodes on his local line would mainly be the trains going to and from Blackpool.

 

[30907]

Those boards, which could be fixed to lamp brackets, were also used on summer Saturday holiday trains. In both cases I think they were mainly for train identification on locosheds and in carriage sidings, rather than for signalmen along the route. I have also seen pictures of steam locos with reporting numbers chalked on the smokebox door.

From the OP's known interest, I think the trains carrying headcodes on his local line would mainly be the trains going to and from Blackpool.

...and indeed my photo search online picked up one such at Great Harwood itself (my home as well for some years more recently), plus examples of earlier reporting systems.

 

[Andy873]

Steam locos didn't regularly carry 4-character headcodes

Thanks, I must have got that fact wrong.

Those boards, which could be fixed to lamp brackets

Wondered how they could be fixed to steam engines that were never designed to carry them.

particularly on "Summer Saturdays" when many extra trains and relief trains were run - this

...and indeed my photo search online picked up one such at Great Harwood itsel

That's what confused me, the ones I have seen (with head codes on) have been summer excursion / specials going to Blackpool (mainly) and some to Southport.

I still find it amazing that not only does my WTT list this train (the ECS one) but also my book about the line has an actual photo of it.

Were the four characters slid onto the board? I understand how BR created the codes for each train / route etc / class of train.

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[30907]

Wondered how they could be fixed to steam engines that were never designed to carry them.

The wooden boards presumably had a metal fixing on the back - just like lamps and headboard for specials/expresses.

That's what confused me, the ones I have seen (with head codes on) have been summer excursion / specials going to Blackpool (mainly) and some to Southport.

Were the four characters slid onto the board?

The ones I've seen evidence of (mainly SR) look to have been printed on paper, so pasted on.
The WR version did use a frame with the numbers fitted in, presumably rather like the ex-SR EMU headcodes.

 

[6Gman]

The wooden boards presumably had a metal fixing on the back - just like lamps and headboard for specials/expresses.

The ones I've seen evidence of (mainly SR) look to have been printed on paper, so pasted on.
The WR version did use a frame with the numbers fitted in, presumably rather like the ex-SR EMU headcodes.

Definitely pasted on. And, yes, the WR had frames that the numbers could be slotted into.

And when either were unavailable chalk on the smokebox door did the trick!

 

[Andy873]

I decided to look again at some photos mainly taken by the late great Geoffrey Robinson who took many of the branch line (Gt. Harwood loop line).

And I found a great photo - it shows a black 5 hauling an excursion train.

On the front of the engine it has pasted on a board 3T46, however someone had chalked on the smokebox door 1P56!

Here is a link to the photo (you can click on it to enlarge it):

Last Days of the North East Lancs Loop line - LMS Black 5 - 44949 - SteamingNorth.com ... (Click on a picture to open that album and then on a picture to enlarge it...........Pictures copyright of Author

www.steamingnorth.com

For those interested, it's just leaving Great Harwood station (you can see the foot bridge connecting the two platforms). The lamp room is on the right (next to the train), and the signal box is Gt. Harwood West (there were two at GH).

The engine itself was at the time based at nearby Rose Grove MPD.

Not sure what the destination area "T" was? it's not listed in my London Midland Region 1963/64 WTT.

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[zwk500]

Not sure what the destination area "T" was? it's not listed in my London Midland Region 1963/64 WTT.

T was for a long time, and still is occasional used today, to indicate a special train that stays entirely within the LM region

 

[30907]

I decided to look again at some photos mainly taken by the late great Geoffrey Robinson who took many of the branch line (Gt. Harwood loop line).

And I found a great photo - it shows a black 5 hauling an excursion train.

On the front of the engine it has pasted on a board 3T46, however someone had chalked on the smokebox door 1P56!

Here is a link to the photo (you can click on it to enlarge it):

Last Days of the North East Lancs Loop line - LMS Black 5 - 44949 - SteamingNorth.com ... (Click on a picture to open that album and then on a picture to enlarge it...........Pictures copyright of Author

www.steamingnorth.com

Intriguingly, there is another photo in that album with 1T46 pasted on the board, taken that same week.

 

[Andy873]

Intriguingly, there is another photo in that album with 1T46 pasted on the board, taken that same week.

That's a great spot, I looked at that photo but didn't make any connection.

Last Days of the North East Lancs Loop line - ghr042 - SteamingNorth.com ... (Click on a picture to open that album and then on a picture to enlarge it...........Pictures copyright of Author

www.steamingnorth.com

Both are on their way to Southport - I wonder if the "3" came from "empty coaching stock train" i.e. at some point taking the empty carriages somewhere prior to the journey?

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[zwk500]

Both are on their way to Southport - I wonder if the "3" came from "empty coaching stock train" i.e. at some point taking the empty carriages somewhere prior to the journey?

This would make sense - it's still common practice today that ECS moves share the main portion of their related passenger working.

 

[Gloster]

T was often used for trip workings. Although this was normally goods traffic, it is possible that trains for other types of traffic could be regarded as trips, particularly in the early days of the new headcode system.

 

[6Gman]

T was for a long time, and still is occasional used today, to indicate a special train that stays entirely within the LM region

We tended to use L for specials within the LM.

I just wonder if there was a Divisional / Line element to it?

L on the Western Lines (i.e. the old LNWR), T on the ex-L&Y?

 

[Andy873]

Thanks everyone.

I just wonder if there was a Divisional / Line element to it?

Looks that way...

When I got my second only WTT (which was my first ever passenger one) I opened up the 1963 WTT query post - I needed help to understand it!

Part of that discussion touched on how even in 1963 staff at BR were still using old pre-grouping terms / names. One was Preston E.L.

Now I thought at first it might have been because (perhaps) there was another place called Preston on the LM region - no, it turns out Preston station was essentially two stations in one. The major part was built by the old North Union railway, to the right were the old platform(s) for the East Lancs (L&Y) railway - hence the EL.

So it is possible.

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[etr221]

According to the BR LMR 'Guide to the four position train identification system' (c1961) (from http://www.barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html ), a second character of T was used for excursion and special passenger trains local to the LMR, or for trip freight trains.

 

[jfollows]

According to the BR LMR 'Guide to the four position train identification system' (c1961) (from http://www.barrowmoremrg.co.uk/Prototype.html ), a second character of T was used for excursion and special passenger trains local to the LMR, or for trip freight trains.

Interesting.
Many/most special Pendolino workings Manchester-London (and, presumably, other routes) are today 1Txx, for example additional early Sunday morning workings because of the London Marathon or similar events, so they're still today complying with this rule.

 

[Andy873]

Interesting

Yes, very interesting and an excellent site.

According to the BR LMR 'Guide to the four position train identification system' (c1961)

That does give some answers there:

T & Z were for the LM region excursion / specials.
X had been determined in another topic as inter regional, but until now I hadn't seen it in a book.

It looks like these codes were a kind of generic labelling i.e. they could go to / come from anywhere.

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[Taunton]

Ian Allan in the 1960s published several versions of British Railways Headcodes, which was a notably complete explanation of all the different headcode systems (and there were a lot) in use. There seem to be a number of secondhand ones for sale by the usual suspects :

Section 017: ABC British Railways Headcodes 1961-68 - Richard Cunningham

The British Railways Headcode ABCs were a very sporadic series, only five editions being produced between 1961 and 1968. All the scans were reviewed and updated in August 2020. I hope collectors will enjoy the dramatic improvement in quality.

daverowland.smugmug.com

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Interesting.
Many/most special Pendolino workings Manchester-London (and, presumably, other routes) are today 1Txx, for example additional early Sunday morning workings because of the London Marathon or similar events, so they're still today complying with this rule.

And only today the RAIB report on the Carmont derailment in 2020 gives the headcode of the train as 1T08.

 

[zwk500]

That does give some answers there:

T & Z were for the LM region excursion / specials.
X had been determined in another topic as inter regional, but until now I hadn't seen it in a book.

It looks like these codes were a kind of generic labelling i.e. they could go to / come from anywhere.

Thanks,
Andy.

It probably wasn't the same in the 1960s, but today Z is supposed to be for specials that run across regions or for unplanned moves (it has also been used for planned diversions within a region at times). X is for Exceptional Loads (very heavy or very big), and is a reminder to Signallers that special restrictions apply.

 

[SargeNpton]

It probably wasn't the same in the 1960s, but today Z is supposed to be for specials that run across regions or for unplanned moves (it has also been used for planned diversions within a region at times). X is for Exceptional Loads (very heavy or very big), and is a reminder to Signallers that special restrictions apply.

Z is sometimes used during engineering works, where a through train has been replaced for part of the journey by a bus. For instance, if 1A66 runs from A to D but on a particular date is replaced by bus between B and C, the A to B train will still be 1A66 but the C-D train may be 1Z66.

 

[6Gman]

It probably wasn't the same in the 1960s, but today Z is supposed to be for specials that run across regions or for unplanned moves (it has also been used for planned diversions within a region at times). X is for Exceptional Loads (very heavy or very big), and is a reminder to Signallers that special restrictions apply.

That's a bit rude for the Royal Train!

 

[Pigeon]

That's a bit rude for the Royal Train!

Would have been accurate for the latter part of the 19th century though...

 

[Gloster]

Would have been accurate for the latter part of the 19th century though...

And the first decade of the last century when Tum Tum would have been aboard.

 

[Magdalia]

It probably wasn't the same in the 1960s, but today Z is supposed to be for specials that run across regions or for unplanned moves (it has also been used for planned diversions within a region at times). X is for Exceptional Loads (very heavy or very big), and is a reminder to Signallers that special restrictions apply.

You are right, it was not the same in the early 1960s, when 4 character headcodes were introduced.

The default code for inter-regional specials was X, though there were exceptions. In particular inter-regional specials only involving ER, NER and ScR were F. ER and NER both used Z for specials entirely within region.

I'm not sure when inter-regional specials switched from X to Z. At that point ER and NER could no longer use Z
for specials entirely within region, and adopted G instead.

Any specials from the ER to Blackpool or Southport via Great Harwood would have been X headcodes.

 

[jfollows]

Interesting.
Many/most special Pendolino workings Manchester-London (and, presumably, other routes) are today 1Txx, for example additional early Sunday morning workings because of the London Marathon or similar events, so they're still today complying with this rule.

Today we have 1T40 08:35 Piccadilly-Euston, https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C34376/2022-03-17/detailed#allox_id=0: calling at Stockport, Wilmslow, Crewe, Stafford (24 minute stop), Lichfield, Tamworth, Nuneaton and Rugby. Operated by 390125. Returns as 1T42 13:10 Euston-Piccadilly with similar stops except not Stockport.
I hazard this is a special working for staff purposes such as training or testing.

 

[30907]

Today we have 1T40 08:35 Piccadilly-Euston, https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C34376/2022-03-17/detailed#allox_id=0: calling at Stockport, Wilmslow, Crewe, Stafford (24 minute stop), Lichfield, Tamworth, Nuneaton and Rugby. Operated by 390125. Returns as 1T42 13:10 Euston-Piccadilly with similar stops except not Stockport.
I hazard this is a special working for staff purposes such as training or testing.

Surprising to use class 1 for that.

 

[SargeNpton]

Surprising to use class 1 for that.

Is it not the case that route learners and test trains take the class of the train they are emulating? I've seen loads of class 1/2 trains doing the same in the schedules over the years.