Hatfield gets new retail outlet, hides help point!

[jon0844]

The other day, I noticed what looks like a huge 'container' dumped on platform 1 at Hatfield. It seems FCC has leased out a bit of the covered part of the platform to a company trading as 'Chuggs', no doubt to put the existing shop (on the other side of the gateline) out of business.

Now, I don't know what the rules are on the help points and the necessary things for getting the 'pass mark'/safer station or whatever accreditation FCC claims to have for its stations, but on London Underground stations every help point is brightly marked/lit and has a CCTV camera pointed directly at it.

It seems that at Hatfield this can't be an issue, as not only is the help point now hidden, it's no longer covered by the camera pointed towards it. There's also now a void area where people can stand completely hidden to people entering the station.

Can Hatfield still be considered a safe station with this 'box' dumped there? It's a ridiculous situation, even if the only thing that concerns passengers is having lost a huge area to stand under cover.

Now if FCC says it will relocate the cameras, or the help point, why are they allowed to do this afterwards? There a security risk right now. I don't think I'm being overly melodramatic in saying that either (the thoughts of reading this in the Daily Mail did almost put me off saying it) because Hatfield has a pretty bad reputation at the best of times.

(view from help point)

(And why does it say 'one for the road' ?!)

 

[Aictos]

Now, I don't know what the rules are on the help points and the necessary things for getting the 'pass mark'/safer station or whatever accreditation FCC claims to have for its stations, but on London Underground stations every help point is brightly marked/lit and has a CCTV camera pointed directly at it.

This is one question I've asked FCC about with regards to Hertford as it's a manned station with both booking office and platform staff yet has a help point on Platform 1 to which when I asked the wisdom of the help point being there when it was a staffed station with a office clearly marked on Platform 3 (no such window as Welwyn Garden City yet on Platform 2) to be told it's quicker for help to be summoned via the help point from a central point then it is from staff actually on site with a window facing the area despite no CCTV coverage for that help point so how that works is beyond me.

It's not the only station not to have CCTV covering the help points as there are others on the route as well, now as to your point about LUL that's the way to go to have a minimum of one CCTV camera facing the help point so in the case of a unmanned station such as Bayford or Crews Hill, the operator could talk to you via the help point but also keep a eye on you via the CCTV camera.

I guess it's one of these things which should be kept under lock and key in Area 51 ie how railway management think and operate!

 

[jon0844]

Whether they are required to put a help point on camera or not, it would seem silly not to. Common sense surely?

I am sure that once you press the emergency button at a LUL station, the control centre will immediately get to see you and can make a judgement (besides what you say) on how to respond. It's possible to see timewasters (and perhaps prosecute them), as well as secure evidential footage if someone is being attacked and may be unable to communicate after the point of pressing the button.

That said, I've seen them being tested at St Pancras (FCC platforms) by staff and was shocked that it can take 30 seconds or more for anyone to answer!

I presume the emergency button goes to the control centre at Enfield, while the information button goes to somewhere else for routine enquiries. I've waited over a minute for the latter, and never actually had cause to use the emergency button.

Do you find that anyone uses them for information? I've tried a few times and found that the information given was worse than what I could already glean by checking the platform screens or my mobile! I've since pretty much given up on considering them a way to get information during disruption and have NEVER seen anyone else use one when things go tits up.

 

[EM2]

St Pancras ones are directed to the station control room. Either the local control on the platform, or if that is not manned, it diverts and rings through to the main control room.

 

[Aictos]

Whether they are required to put a help point on camera or not, it would seem silly not to. Common sense surely?

I am sure that once you press the emergency button at a LUL station, the control centre will immediately get to see you and can make a judgement (besides what you say) on how to respond. It's possible to see timewasters (and perhaps prosecute them), as well as secure evidential footage if someone is being attacked and may be unable to communicate after the point of pressing the button.

That said, I've seen them being tested at St Pancras (FCC platforms) by staff and was shocked that it can take 30 seconds or more for anyone to answer!

I presume the emergency button goes to the control centre at Enfield, while the information button goes to somewhere else for routine enquiries. I've waited over a minute for the latter, and never actually had cause to use the emergency button.

Do you find that anyone uses them for information? I've tried a few times and found that the information given was worse than what I could already glean by checking the platform screens or my mobile! I've since pretty much given up on considering them a way to get information during disruption and have NEVER seen anyone else use one when things go tits up.

As far as I am aware the information button goes to National Rail Enquires but I know they used to go to control centre at Enfield.