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GWR needing more carriages.

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Pompey00

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What’s the most carriages gwr can run as Portsmouth to Cardiff vice versa only normally has 2-3 sometimes 4 but they are always packed and cramped and sometimes have to stand. Is there a restriction.
 
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JonathanH

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What’s the most carriages gwr can run as Portsmouth to Cardiff vice versa only normally has 2-3 sometimes 4 but they are always packed and cramped and sometimes have to stand. Is there a restriction.
5 coaches is the maximum. They are struggling with fleet availability (eg to run a 3-coach 166 and 2-coach 165 coupled) but as you can guess there is no money to do much about it.
 
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507020

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What is happening about the 5 car 150s for St Ives? By far the busiest train I have been on in my life was a 4 car 150 to St Ives. That was properly crush loaded. I can see a passing loop being necessary, with 5 cars every 15 minutes still being full and standing in the summer.
 

Pompey00

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It’s rare you see it tho, and would be better due to the fact it’s not Comfortable when cramped.
 

Biscuit 56

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There’s been a lot of 2 cars on the Pompey run lately, full and standing is an understatement
 

Xavi

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What is happening about the 5 car 150s for St Ives? By far the busiest train I have been on in my life was a 4 car 150 to St Ives. That was properly crush loaded. I can see a passing loop being necessary, with 5 cars every 15 minutes still being full and standing in the summer.
A passing loop adjacent to West Cornwall golf club is proposed.
 

Parallel

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It seems the Cardiff - Portsmouth and the Exmouth - Paignton routes are the first to suffer most when there is a shortage of units, as these seem to be the only services that often run with more than one (regional) unit.

A couple of Fridays ago, I saw that 4 Cardiff-Pompeys in a row were short formed to 2 coaches (vice 3, 4 and 5) and the one I was on was short formed to 3 coaches (vice 5). There were some passengers on the train that had been unable to board the previous one. It’s also more regular on JourneyCheck to see trains reported as full and standing from Cardiff (towards Portsmouth) or from Fratton (towards Cardiff) - often these are 2 car units. It seems to be turning into quite a miserable route for passengers.
 

jackot

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It seems to be turning into quite a miserable route for passengers.
It has been fairly miserable for the last few years and seems to be getting worse still. I remember when people (including me!) complained about having a 5-car turbo do the route, and now you'd be lucky to get a 3-car! Again, its' another route in need of more money which simply doesn't exist...
 

Dr Day

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Again, its' another route in need of more money which simply doesn't exist..
If the main issue is fleet availability, where is the financial block? Are the DfT preventing maintenance happening - either directly or indirectly?
 

Dr Hoo

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Isn’t this connected with the inability to get the multi-mode 769s into service, which could cascade some more Turbo units from the Reading area?
 

Taunton

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It has been fairly miserable for the last few years and seems to be getting worse still. I remember when people (including me!) complained about having a 5-car turbo do the route, and now you'd be lucky to get a 3-car! Again, its' another route in need of more money which simply doesn't exist...
It's funny how the money exists for the passengers to buy fares in such substantial numbers that many of the trains are regularly crowded out, but somehow that money doesn't make it back to being able to be spent on providing what they have bought.
 

Drsatan

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It's funny how the money exists for the passengers to buy fares in such substantial numbers that many of the trains are regularly crowded out, but somehow that money doesn't make it back to being able to be spent on providing what they have bought.
It's not helped that the A36 from Bath to Southampton is largely single carriageway and usually isn't any quicker than the train.

Is there a reason why GWR is struggling so much with unit availability at the moment? Is it just due to a lack of spare parts, lack of fitters, financial constraints or all three? Would the DfT intervene to block GWR from purchasing spare parts for its units?

I've been on a couple of crush-loaded 166s towards Bristol. One one journey formed of a single 166 people were being left behind by Bradford upon Avon.
 

Starmill

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Would the DfT intervene to block GWR from purchasing spare parts for its units?
It would be the other way around. An order for parts or a specialist may need to be approved by the civil servant in charge of the contract, depending on how much the bill will be. The Department may simply sit on the request, unapproved, or send it back with questions. Delaying payment makes it easier for the Department to manage its budget.
 

fgwrich

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It's not helped that the A36 from Bath to Southampton is largely single carriageway and usually isn't any quicker than the train.

Is there a reason why GWR is struggling so much with unit availability at the moment? Is it just due to a lack of spare parts, lack of fitters, financial constraints or all three? Would the DfT intervene to block GWR from purchasing spare parts for its units?

I've been on a couple of crush-loaded 166s towards Bristol. One one journey formed of a single 166 people were being left behind by Bradford upon Avon.
It's not the first time I've seen or heard of full and standing services along that line either. When I travelled on one of the last remaining SWR services last winter, we were picking up a lot of passengers from Warminster and Westbury onwards, to the point where we were leaving stations full and standing. And that's despite a GWR Stopper running about 10 minutes ahead of us.
 

Snow1964

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Isn’t this connected with the inability to get the multi-mode 769s into service, which could cascade some more Turbo units from the Reading area?
Partly, but even if the whole Thames fleet moved over tomorrow, wouldn’t allow all the trains to become 5car and allow the Bristol area service improvements.

There are a few stations that have platforms of 120-135m in Wessex area, but there is a lack of money to add a few metres of platform extension and allow flexibility to run 6car units (even though a large chunk of turbo 165-166 fleet is 3 car). It is obviously much harder to form trains with a 2 and 3 car unit. There are even some 158s formed with extra driving car to bodge a 3car unit by splitting 2car units

You could also argue that not completing the electrification from Chippenham to Bristol also resulted in a lack of trains, some workings could have been 387s (although it did allow Heathrow Express services to utilise some 387s)

There doesn’t appear to be a strategy except convert some Wessex trains to Warminster and Frome to EMU operation, but only if Western decarbonisation phases 1 and 2 go ahead (which might be years if it ever happens), meanwhile Wessex continues with 30+ year old trains and no replacement planned.
 

Requeststop

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A passing loop adjacent to West Cornwall golf club is proposed.
That will upset the nudists in the dunes below the ridge at Porthkidney sands. Strangely, however, Despite the extensions of the platforms at St Erth and Lelant, there were no 5 car trains run on the branch this past summer and Lelant remains a Request Stop.
 

John R

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A passing loop adjacent to West Cornwall golf club is proposed.
Given it's pretty tight to do a full return trip within 30 mins, would a 15 min service be feasible if you had to add the time in for crossing at the passing loop, especially as it isn't at an existing station stop. Surely it would be every 20 mins, with more realistic turn around times at both ends.
 

Sheridan

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It would be the other way around. An order for parts or a specialist may need to be approved by the civil servant in charge of the contract, depending on how much the bill will be. The Department may simply sit on the request, unapproved, or send it back with questions. Delaying payment makes it easier for the Department to manage its budget.

Sorry if I’m missing something, but you’ve just said ‘it would be the other way around’, but then described exactly what the person you quoted described, i.e. the DfT making it harder for the TOC to acquire spare parts. I’m a bit confused!
 

Starmill

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Sorry if I’m missing something, but you’ve just said ‘it would be the other way around’, but then described exactly what the person you quoted described, i.e. the DfT making it harder for the TOC to acquire spare parts. I’m a bit confused!
Well the end result is indeed precisely the same yes. But the phrasing of the question originally implied that it was GWR's money and the DfT were intervening to stop them, when in reality it's actually inaction at DfT to release the funds stopping some things of this nature from proceeding.
 

Sheridan

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Well the end result is indeed precisely the same yes. But the phrasing of the question originally implied that it was GWR's money and the DfT were intervening to stop them, when in reality it's actually inaction at DfT to release the funds stopping some things of this nature from proceeding.

Okay, I see what you mean now, although I am surprised if the DfT are controlling budgets on that sort of level (i.e. day-to-day maintenance), while I fully understand they want to exercise control over the bigger picture spending.
 

Xavi

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Given it's pretty tight to do a full return trip within 30 mins, would a 15 min service be feasible if you had to add the time in for crossing at the passing loop, especially as it isn't at an existing station stop. Surely it would be every 20 mins, with more realistic turn around times at both ends.
I didn’t take note of the service pattern. I’ll take another look.
 
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