GWR Bike Policy

[mugam4]

This feature was broadcast tonight on BBC1 in the South.

Thousands of cyclists are protesting against a train company's new policy forcing bike owners to reserve bicycle spaces on high-speed services.
Great Western Railway (GWR) began the policy in May, meaning bicycle users must book two hours in advance.
Commuters have said the policy "discriminates against the cyclists" who buy open-returns, and several have criticised the booking system...

In summary, we see a cyclist complaining about the new HST bike reservation policy, and then attempting to board an HST that he had booked a reservation on and being refused because he did not have a 'bike pass'.

Firstly, are bike passes required for travel on GWR HSTs nowadays? I cannot see this mentioned on their website.

Secondly, I cannot understand why the guard refused to let the cyclist board. When asked if there are cycle spaces available, he says yes, but still denies boarding - surely with a camera crew standing there you'd want to give the best customer service possible? With the train at the penultimate stop (Reading) and cycle spaces available, what's the problem with letting someone board if there's only one cyclist there (with or without a reservation) and giving good customer service to one passenger? If I acted in this way on behalf of my company in front of BBC News, I'd be at risk of termination.

Lastly, is there a need for cycle spaces have reservations mandatory? Why can't the free spaces be given out on a first-come-first-serve basis?

 

[yorkie]

It is ridiculous. We've had at least one thread, Taking cycles on GWR? and possibly more.

We found all staff to be brilliant in Cornwall last Summer, but if the staff have been told by poor management to crack down, this will put us off future trips.

It's not clear to me what the booking deadline is. Is it 2 hours before the actual journey or before the train departs the origin? Even te former is unacceptable. VTEC allow bookings for immediate travel.

I've not heard of this "bike pass" thing before... I think they mean he phoned up to make a reservation but the Guard wanted to see a reservation coupon?

 

[455driver]

So you want to turn up at station A and be allowed on without a reservation because its first come first served, but I have booked a space from station C which I wont be able to use because your bike is in there, that is why first come first served wouldnt work.

There are a limited number of spaces on board the trains and they have to be regulated so everyone gets treated equally.

 

[yorkie]

So you want to turn up at station A and be allowed on without a reservation because its first come first served, but I have booked a space from station C which I wont be able to use because your bike is in there, that is why first come first served wouldnt work.

There are a limited number of spaces on board the trains and they have to be regulated so everyone gets treated equally.

The next stop was Paddington, he apparently had a reservation but not the coupon (e.g. could have been obtained from telesales), there was space and no-one was going to turn up at any intermediate station for anyone else to board. This is not common sense.

Last summer we experienced nothing but common sense and fantastic staff with the old policy. I didn't experience anything like what is shown on the video. If that's how GWR management want their staff to behave then they're not very good managers.

 

[LowLevel]

Is there perhaps an element of making it more different prior to arrival of the IEP units which presumably have less luggage space aboard than HSTs?

Break em in early and all that.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

I wonder how long it'll be before all TOCs require people to make reservations to take a bike onto a train at any time of day

 

[alxndr]

Is there perhaps an element of making it more different prior to arrival of the IEP units which presumably have less luggage space aboard than HSTs?

Break em in early and all that.

This seemed to be the sentiment I overheard while walking past a couple of GWR staff members the other day. Get people in the habit of booking before the new trains come in.

 

[racyrich]

Strange how GWR told the local MP that bikes could be carried without reservation if there was space. Surely GWR wouldn't tell an MP one thing and treat mere plebs differently. No.

http://www.exeterexpressandecho.co....tory-29288983-detail/story.html#ixzz490s2z9un

...I sought urgent clarification from GWR and they confirmed that you will still be able to put your bike on their trains if there is space, while encouraging people to book in advance.


"But they must do more to improve their booking system. It is ridiculous that you can't book a bike on line if you already have a ticket, but have to phone a call centre in India. I tried this on Sunday evening and couldn't get through....

 

[FGW_DID]

Pre-booking may also avoid the disappointment of turning up at the station to find all the spaces full. Pre warned you may be able to book an alternative train.

 

[theageofthetra]

Seems sensible to me though some common sense should prevail if there is space and you are joining at the second to last stop.

 

[telstarbox]

On a semi-related topic, does anyone know if the Southeastern Class 395s (Javelins) have space for cycles? The SE website doesn't say that you can't take bikes on High Speed services.

 

[Sprinter153]

I winced in sympathy for the GWR PR department at the film.

On the other hand as a guard being filmed and plastered over Twitter (and accordingly filling inches for lazy Twitter journalism) is a sadly regular occurrence. In my case anyway it wouldn't 'improve my customer service'. I know my job and what needs to be done in a particular situation, and someone waving an iPhone at me is not going to change that judgment, particularly as they will usually have displayed a poor attitude in the process... but you learn to stay calm and articulate your point clearly and professionally.

There are rules and processes, and they are required to be followed, at least most of the time. I don't consider it acceptable to film staff trying to doing their jobs as instructed, and by being reasonable and firm hopefully these types will see that it is not a means of having a tantrum and getting their own way.

AIUI the instruction is to ask all cyclists if they have a reservation, and if they say no allow them travel if there is space but remind them to get one next time. If you see them again without a reservation they can be denied travel on that service.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I wonder how long it'll be before all TOCs require people to make reservations to take a bike onto a train at any time of day

If it was extremely easy to obtain a reservation right up to departure, e.g. using a mobile phone app, I would be very welcoming of this. Cycle spaces are a very limited resource - better to be certain of being able to use it. If, for instance, you plan to cycle somewhere and return on the last train of the day, it could prevent being stranded.

To avoid people booking loads of them on any train they might use, a small fee e.g. £2 would manage things well.

The only thing wrong with the GWR scheme is the requirement to reserve 2 hours in advance - VTWC and VTEC do not require this. I had a FB chat with someone who is in some way responsible for the scheme (a friend of a friend) and he said it was because they have the same cutoff as seat reservations - but is now going to go and talk to VTEC to see how they do it.

 

[causton]

Indeed, on Tribute I can book a reservation for a cycle one or two minutes before it arrives at the station (the passenger ended up not making the train in the end, they were cutting it very fine!! ) - so assumed it was the same for all TOCs and not just Virgin!

 

[telstarbox]

Is that reservation then sent to the guard's Blackberry if the train has already left its starting station?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Is that reservation then sent to the guard's Blackberry if the train has already left its starting station?

Why does it need to be? If reservations are compulsory, there is no need to mark them at all.

 

[timbo58]

I have worked with both of the sterling Guards seen in that film, and seen them both use professional, friendly discretion in all cases in my past career so I am certainly not of the mind the refuser was being a jobsworth as has been implied elsewhere.

IMHO clearly FGW/GWR's policy is not being explained to the operations staff correctly, you have to understand that FGW's management are very keen to stamp their authority and will immediately jump upon staff not adhering to rules they've cobbled together -IME.

I have little doubt this is to ensure timely departures for the new fleet (180's were the same in this respect, they carried 3 at each end and made it a right PITA if someone turned up 'on spec').

However -bike reservations used to come on a slip for the train just as seat reservations -therefore IF the bike was booked then there would have been a ticket (and this would have been on the guards train list also).

I also disagree IME that 'most passengers have open returns (whether he means day returns or not since Reading -Padd doesn't have an open return AFAIAA?) and travel on various services.
IME most commuters travel on the same train day in/day out in both directions unless they happen to miss one.

 

[Master29]

Another sidelight. I may be wrong here but didn`t HST`s originally have the guard in one of the power cars and even now there seems an area large enough for a few bikes in the power cars. Just a passing thought.

 

[TheManBehind]

Another sidelight. I may be wrong here but didn`t HST`s originally have the guard in one of the power cars and even now there seems an area large enough for a few bikes in the power cars. Just a passing thought.

The doors can be real ****s, and need to be opened from the inside as they've got bolts. VTEC have limits on when they can be used.

 

[BestWestern]

Why does it need to be? If reservations are compulsory, there is no need to mark them at all.

The point being that a reservation obtained immediately before travel won't be on any paper lists held by the crew. It may be desireable to have some form of 'hard copy' as well whatever a passenger has on their phone etc.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The doors can be real ****s, and need to be opened from the inside as they've got bolts. VTEC have limits on when they can be used.

The doors can be unlocked from either side, however the inside of a power car is not an appropriate place for members of the public to be going without staff supervision. GWR HSTs have racks for three cycles in each power car, usually they are only used if a cycle is making an 'end to end' journey to avoid delays at intermediate stations.

 

[jopsuk]

On VTEC/predeccsors even when they've had luggage check in (Christmas protocol) at Kings Cross if I've had a bike it's gone in the TGS guard compartment; the power cars get used for the checked luggage

 

[yorkie]

I
I also disagree IME that 'most passengers have open returns (whether he means day returns or not since Reading -Padd doesn't have an open return AFAIAA?) and travel on various services.
IME most commuters travel on the same train day in/day out in both directions unless they happen to miss one.

Most people do travel on flexible tickets and that would surely include the vast majority of commuters.

The term "open return" is best avoided as you are correct that the old ticket type of that name did not refer to a day return. However various booking engines muddied the waters and caused confusion, and now the old ticket type of that name no longer exists, people use the term to mean different things!

However it's moot as what matters is the flexibility, and that applies to almost any ticket type other than 'Advance'.

When I take my bike on the train it's for leisure purposes, and the timing of most of these will vary depending on factors such as the weather, it's not always possible to know what train you are going to get far in advance. For example, we travelled from Bodmin Parkway to St Austell last Summer, it was not easy to be certain of arrival time at Bodmin Parkway, and it's not our fault that all the trains at certain times are reserveable long distance services.

 

[jopsuk]

I think that's a bit that's missed here- that this is mainly NOT about people travelling into and out of Paddington. The problems are further out, people making 20-40 ish mile "local" journeys on trains that just happen to be HSTs to or from London and there are no other services.

 

[paul1609]

On a semi-related topic, does anyone know if the Southeastern Class 395s (Javelins) have space for cycles? The SE website doesn't say that you can't take bikes on High Speed services.

Yes, you can subject to the normal Southeastern off peak rules. There is a multipurpose area in one the inner end coach of each 395 but the station stops are so short the staff just tell you to put them in the doorways and move them if anybody wants to get on or off.

 

[SPADTrap]

So if having to book in advance is discriminating against the cyclist what about passengers who require assistance having to book in advance? Is this a case of 'now that it affects me I realise the significance of the issue of having to book?'

Are these services popular with cyclists?

 

[Chew Chew]

It must have been a slow news day but what would they have done if the guy went "No problem mate, bring your bike on"?

 

[Loop & Link]

I think it was cleverly set up, otherwise there wouldn't be a story here would there?

I know the TM is being blamed from the video, but I know (sometimes) that us staff are too afraid to go against policy and use our own judgement because of what the management will say, who will most likely come down on us like a ton of bricks.

 

[Chew Chew]

I think it was cleverly set up, otherwise there wouldn't be a story here would there?

I know the TM is being blamed from the video, but I know (sometimes) that us staff are too afraid to go against policy and use our own judgement because of what the management will say, who will most likely come down on us like a ton of bricks.

Of course it was a set up, and the TM has been made the unfortunate fall guy in the situation.

 

[bb21]

It is far better for the TM to communicate a consistent message in line with company policy in public, rather than giving the impression that rules do not get enforced and causing unnecessary hassle for colleagues in other situations, even more so on TV, imo. Good customer service is consistent message being put across.

In private there can be leeway as the situation fits, as long as official policy is made clear to the passenger.

We either have a first-come-first-served policy, and reservations being cut a certain amount of time before the train leaves the origin station, or allowing reservations to be made right up till the last minute before the train departs but no turn-up-and-go facility. It is not possible to implement both, unless the customer only wished to travel one stop, or until real-time on-train reservation can be implemented.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If reservations are compulsory you do not need any system of communicating it to the train at all. You simply need the passenger to show it. Then they can be made right up to departure.

This is still "turn up and go", near enough, and it is how VTWC do it.

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