GTR - notice to prosecute ADVICE NEEDED

[bv1188]

This is my first time posting. I have received a letter from GTR informing me of their intention to prosecute (letter dated 2/5/25).

On 5/2/25 I was travelling from Hitchin to Farringdon on the 8:41 or 8:56 train (can;t remember exactly, believe it the latter, times being the time of scheduled departure from origin). I was in possession of a standard monthly season ticket, on my contactless card, and the associated photocard.

I entered the train in Standard class, but near the front (as is my normal MO) for a swift change at Farringdon onto the Elizabeth line. I had the intention of working on the train, and in the absence of seats with trays decided that using the luggage rack as a standing desk was a better option. I hurt my back over Christmas so this only cemented the decision.

The racks in the front carriages (far as I could see) had people or luggage in, and I don’t like the rack near the 1st class door, so chose to enter 1st class and use the empty rack there. I also liked the idea of less people and quieter so I could focus.

I took off my coat, bag etc, and sorted myself out (using an empty seat) before setting myself up in the luggage rack. Soon after the train existed Stevenage station (say, 7-8 min total journey duration since departing Hitchin) a revenue prevention officer entered the carriage.

When he got to me I offered my contactless card with the season ticket, and explained my intention to work in the rack. He was very friendly, but then informed me I couldn’t even stand in 1st class without (a) 1st class ticket, and/or (b) the rest of the train being so busy no other standing was possible. Our conversation was amicable and courteous, and he intimated that he was initially minded to wave it off and ask me to move. He admitted that he had seen me setting myself up/working from the rack, rather than sitting in a seat.

I was honest when I told him I was unaware of the rule/law regarding standing, and I offered to pay the difference. He instead took my details and said Head Office would contact me, most likely to explain the rules, and possibly issuing a fine. The first communication I have received is the Notice of Intention to Prosecute letter (photos attached with redacted details).

Few more points to note:
- From memory I have paid a fine once for a standard to 1st upgrade. This was 3+ years ago, and I believe it was for a paper ticket not the same contactless card. From memory this was a paper penalty charge given to me by the revenue protection officer.
- I have also (not this route/journey) ran for a train to make it home on time and hoped to buy a ticket from a guard, but found out it wasnt possible. I cannot remember details, but it was a fine plus the full price ticket, and was a paper penalty charge given to me by the revenue protection officer.
- My recollection is of the general “gist” of the conversation. I cannot recall verbatim the conversation, but am 100% certain in it being amicable courteous and that I showed honesty and willing to pay a fine there and then.

From reading other threads I will clearly need to write a letter professing my remorse and requesting out of court settlement. I was wondering if there is anything from the narrative I should or should not include? I will be sending a letter 1st class recorded on Tuesday when the Post Office is open.

I really want to avoid magistrates court and a criminal record, and so any assistance is greatly appreciated.

 

[Honestviews]

Hi, I wouldn't include that the revenue protection officer admitted he saw you setting up. I can't see it's relevant at all because he didn't know you had a standard ticket rather than a first class ticket.

Also and in case you feel it's unfair because you didn't know that you bent even stand in first, you made the point you went in to first in part because "I also liked the idea of less people and quieter so I could focus."

I sometimes upgrade to first for those very reasons. If anyone could come in and stand then it is less likely to be quieter and there certainly won't be less people.

 

[bv1188]

Thanks. I won’t be mentioning the chit chat. I’ll be sure to admit that I wasn’t aware of the rules but am now and will not make the same mistake again in the future.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

Stevenage is my local station and I am very familiar with Thameslink services between hertfordshire and London.

When you say contactless card I assume you mean a The Key which is often used to hold season tickets?

The front 1st Class carriage on Thameslink trains between Hitchin and London is not declassified (the rear compartment is permanently declassified) so you comitted an offence by travelling in there with a standard class ticket, even if you were standing. There are many other luggage racks on Thameslink trains so was there a reson you chose to use one in 1st classm, other than it being more convenient for interchange to the Elizabeth Line at Farringdon?

GTR are normally willing to offer an out of court settlement in these sort of cases to people who co-operate with them, and who haven't come to their attention before. I would mention the following points in a short, concise reply:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

From what you've said you have had somne 'history' with the railway but that's probably long enough ago not to adversely impact the chances of a settlement but you do need to be careful in future to make sure you travel with the correct ticket.

If you pop a draft reply int his thread forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[bv1188]

Hi Hadders, thank you for the key talking points. I’ve drafted a response; listed below.

I am curious about whether to mention the fact the RPO didn’t issue me a prosecution notice/paper fine. He actually thought Head Office would write to me to inform me of the rules. I have noted the first point in my email, not the latter re: head office.

I’d greatly appreciate feedback on my letter draft, and any other details I should include (eg email address, mobile, etc)?

————

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

I am writing in response to notice of intention to prosecute dated xxxxxx 2025, reference G25xxxxxxxx

Firstly, I would like to apologise for travelling on a Thameslink train in a first class carriage on a standard class ticket.

Please be assured I had no intention to deliberately avoid paying the correct fare and I appreciate the chance to explain what happened on the day.

On 5th February 2025 I was travelling from Hitchin to Farringdon with a valid standard class ticket for my journey. I boarded the train at Hitchin into the foremost Standard Class carriage of the train. It was my intention to use a luggage rack to work from on my laptop, and as I could see that those closest to me had luggage or people using them I chose to walk into the First Class and use the empty rack there. I also discounted the rack nearest the 1st class carriage door to avoid clashing with anyone trying to enter or exit the 1st class section (eg to use WC facilities towards the rear).

Having removed my jacket and bag I began to set myself up to work, when, somewhere south of Stevenage, I was approached by a Revenue Protection Officer who requested to see my ticket, and then stated that my ticket was not valid on this first class carriage.

He explained that whilst I was not using a seat, I am also required to hold a 1st class ticket to enter the 1st class carriage. I apologised and provided my ID and contact information as requested. At the time I was not requested to pay a fine or the additional fare, and the officer did not issue a prosecution notice, stating that I would be contacted by Govia Thameslink Railway.

I was not aware of the rule, and I now understand my error, and the reasons the rules are in place. To avoid repeating my mistake, in the future I will always sit in clearly designated standard class accommodation.

I would be grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter without the need for court action and am prepared to pay the appropriate fare plus any administrative costs you feel appropriate.

Sincerely,

Xxxxxx

 

[furlong]

"I was not aware of this rule". In law, all that counts is whether there was a notice on display to tell you that you needed a first class ticket to remain wherever it was on the train that you were. The criminal offence is to disregard the contents of the notice that you are expected to have seen and digested.

The inspector should have pointed out the relevant notice at the time and ideally taken a picture of it (in case there was a decision to prosecute and you challenged its existence).
Compliant notices would normally as a minimum contain a short sentence stating that a first class ticket is required by anyone remaining in that area of the train. Some train companies do this well with clear and concise notices - others may leave themselves open to challenge.

 

[BAFRA77]

May I suggest @bv1188 - in your latest reply with the letter draft just above - if that is the actual Case Number - removing it from the post - as staff who work on the inside also frequent these forums - so they can tie this conversation to your case

 

[AlterEgo]

May I suggest @bv1188 - in your latest reply with the letter draft just above - if that is the actual Case Number - removing it from the post - as staff who work on the inside also frequent these forums - so they can tie this conversation to your case

They can do that anyway. The text of their own correspondence is on here!

 

[Hadders]

Hi Hadders, thank you for the key talking points. I’ve drafted a response; listed below.

I am curious about whether to mention the fact the RPO didn’t issue me a prosecution notice/paper fine. He actually thought Head Office would write to me to inform me of the rules. I have noted the first point in my email, not the latter re: head office.

I’d greatly appreciate feedback on my letter draft, and any other details I should include (eg email address, mobile, etc)?

————

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

I am writing in response to notice of intention to prosecute dated xxxxxx 2025, reference G25xxxxxxxx

Firstly, I would like to apologise for travelling on a Thameslink train in a first class carriage on a standard class ticket.

Please be assured I had no intention to deliberately avoid paying the correct fare and I appreciate the chance to explain what happened on the day.

On 5th February 2025 I was travelling from Hitchin to Farringdon with a valid standard class ticket for my journey. I boarded the train at Hitchin into the foremost Standard Class carriage of the train. It was my intention to use a luggage rack to work from on my laptop, and as I could see that those closest to me had luggage or people using them I chose to walk into the First Class and use the empty rack there. I also discounted the rack nearest the 1st class carriage door to avoid clashing with anyone trying to enter or exit the 1st class section (eg to use WC facilities towards the rear).

Having removed my jacket and bag I began to set myself up to work, when, somewhere south of Stevenage, I was approached by a Revenue Protection Officer who requested to see my ticket, and then stated that my ticket was not valid on this first class carriage.

He explained that whilst I was not using a seat, I am also required to hold a 1st class ticket to enter the 1st class carriage. I apologised and provided my ID and contact information as requested. At the time I was not requested to pay a fine or the additional fare, and the officer did not issue a prosecution notice, stating that I would be contacted by Govia Thameslink Railway.

I was not aware of the rule, and I now understand my error, and the reasons the rules are in place. To avoid repeating my mistake, in the future I will always sit in clearly designated standard class accommodation.

I would be grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter without the need for court action and am prepared to pay the appropriate fare plus any administrative costs you feel appropriate.

Sincerely,

Xxxxxx

The letter's along the right lines but I'd simplify your explanation, discounting racks nearest the first class carriage door to avoid clashing with anyone entering or exiting first class, and removing jackets and bags is unnecessary detail.

I'd simply say you entered 1st class to stand at the luggage rack to work on your laptop, and that you didn't think standing in 1st class was an offence but since the interaction with the inspector you now realise it is.

 

[bv1188]

Thanks all. All feedback noted and incorporated into the below:

———-

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

I am writing in response to notice of intention to prosecute dated xxxxxx 2025, reference G25xxxxxxxx

Firstly, I would like to apologise for travelling on a Thameslink train in a first class carriage on a standard class ticket.

Please be assured I had no intention to deliberately avoid paying the correct fare and I appreciate the chance to explain what happened on the day.

On 5th February 2025 I was travelling from Hitchin to Farringdon with a valid standard class ticket for my journey. I boarded the train at Hitchin into the foremost Standard Class carriage of the train. It was my intention to use a luggage rack to work from on my laptop, and so I chose to enter the First Class and use the empty rack there as at the time I did not realise standing in first class was an offence.

Somewhere south of Stevenage I was approached by a Revenue Protection Officer who requested to see my ticket, and then stated that my ticket was not valid on this first class carriage. He explained that whilst I was not using a seat, I am also required to hold a 1st class ticket to enter the 1st class carriage.

I apologised and provided my ID and contact information as requested. At the time I was not requested to pay a fine or the additional fare, and the officer did not issue a prosecution notice, stating that I would be contacted by Govia Thameslink Railway.

I was not aware of the rule, and I now understand my error, and the reasons the rules are in place. To avoid repeating my mistake, in the future I will always sit in clearly designated standard class accommodation.

I would be grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter without the need for court action and am prepared to pay the appropriate fare plus any administrative costs you feel appropriate.

Sincerely,

Xxxxxx

 

[185143]

Thanks all. All feedback noted and incorporated into the below:

———-

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

I am writing in response to notice of intention to prosecute dated xxxxxx 2025, reference G25xxxxxxxx

Firstly, I would like to apologise for travelling on a Thameslink train in a first class carriage on a standard class ticket.

Please be assured I had no intention to deliberately avoid paying the correct fare and I appreciate the chance to explain what happened on the day.

On 5th February 2025 I was travelling from Hitchin to Farringdon with a valid standard class ticket for my journey. I boarded the train at Hitchin into the foremost Standard Class carriage of the train. It was my intention to use a luggage rack to work from on my laptop, and so I chose to enter the First Class and use the empty rack there as at the time I did not realise standing in first class was an offence.

Somewhere south of Stevenage I was approached by a Revenue Protection Officer who requested to see my ticket, and then stated that my ticket was not valid on this first class carriage. He explained that whilst I was not using a seat, I am also required to hold a 1st class ticket to enter the 1st class carriage.

I apologised and provided my ID and contact information as requested. At the time I was not requested to pay a fine or the additional fare, and the officer did not issue a prosecution notice, stating that I would be contacted by Govia Thameslink Railway.

I was not aware of the rule, and I now understand my error, and the reasons the rules are in place. To avoid repeating my mistake, in the future I will always sit in clearly designated standard class accommodation.

I would be grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter without the need for court action and am prepared to pay the appropriate fare plus any administrative costs you feel appropriate.

Sincerely,

Xxxxxx

This is pedantic, but the offence is to *remain* in the 1st class carriage, not to enter it. On most SWR services, to say you cannot even enter the 1st class area to pass through would be ludicrous.

It would also mean you cannot enter the accessible area (and one of the two toilets) on a TPE 185 if you have boarded in any other part of the train.

 

[Hadders]

A couple of minor amendments:

I'd call it carriage 1 rather than the foremost carriage.
The officer would not issue a fine (only a court can do that!) but he did not issue you with a Penalty Fare

Otherwise I think it's good to go. Please do let us know how the case ends up.

This is pedantic, but the offence is to *remain* in the 1st class carriage, not to enter it. On most SWR services, to say you cannot even enter the 1st class area to pass through would be ludicrous.

It would also mean you cannot enter the accessible area (and one of the two toilets) on a TPE 185 if you have boarded in any other part of the train.

This is irrelevent. @bv1188 entered and remained in the 1st class compartment (they were working on their laptop), they weren't simply passing through.

The layout of SWR and TPE trains doesn't matter, as the OP was travellig on a class 700 train.

 

[X-City-WM]

It may seem pedantic, but I would take this bit out:

whilst I was not using a seat

Because here, you state that you were using a seat, albeit to store your coat and bag.

I took off my coat, bag etc, and sorted myself out (using an empty seat) before setting myself up in the luggage rack

IMO, it would be better to say nothing about it rather than be caught out.

 

[bv1188]

Thanks all. Final version going in registered 1st class as follows:

————

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

I am writing in response to notice of intention to prosecute date xxxxxxx 2025, reference Gxxxxxxxxxx.

Firstly, I would like to apologise for travelling on a Thameslink train in a first class carriage on a standard class ticket.

Please be assured I had no intention to deliberately avoid paying the correct fare and I appreciate the chance to explain what happened on the day.

On 5th February 2025 I was travelling from Hitchin to Farringdon with a valid standard class ticket for my journey, and I boarded the train into carriage 1. It was my intention to use a luggage rack to work from on my laptop, and so I chose to enter the First Class and use the empty rack there.

Somewhere south of Stevenage I was approached by a Revenue Protection Officer who requested to see my ticket, then informed me that my ticket was not valid for travel within first class. He explained to me that I am required to hold a 1st class ticket to enter the 1st class carriage and remain there. At the time I did not realise standing in First Class was an offence.

I apologised and provided my ID and contact information as requested. I was not issued with a Penalty Fare, and the officer informed me that I would be contacted by Govia Thameslink Railway.

I was not aware of the rule, and I now understand my error, and the reasons the rules are in place. To avoid repeating my mistake, in the future I will always sit in clearly designated standard class accommodation.

I would be grateful for the opportunity to resolve this matter without the need for court action and am prepared to pay the appropriate fare plus any administrative costs you feel appropriate.

Sincerely,

 

[Hadders]

Looks ok to me.

 

[bv1188]

Thanks all. Sent the letter via registered. Will let you know the outcome.

 

[bv1188]

UPDATE:

Received a settlement offer on 15/5/25 (6 days after sending letter, 13 days after receiving the notice).

£89.90 - balance of the fare plus fees. Settled the following day.

Thanks for all your help.

 

[AlterEgo]

Thanks for giving us an update, it’s always helpful!