Greater Anglia peak /off peak?

[grainy]

Newbie here, to both the forum and train travel, so please be patient.

In December I took the train from Penrith to Sheringham, Norfolk. I bought an off peak return, collected at the machine at Penrith using my disabled railcard for the first time.

For the return a few days later I decided to break the journey in Norwich, but didn't want to arrive home too late, so I wanted to take the 8.22 Greater Anglia train out of Sheringham, which I thought would be peak hours so I would need to buy a separate ticket. I was surprised when the conductor told me that my off peak ticket was valid for that train, however at Norwich my ticket was declined by the automated barriers. A friendly staff member let me through (and back again later) and I caught the EMR train successfully.

As I am planning a similar trip soon, I wonder if I have done anything wrong? Should my ticket have allowed me on to the early train. If not , is it OK to buy a ticket for that peak time journey then use the remaining off peak return later in the day?

 

[jfollows]

There’s no such thing as “peak hours”, the times an “off peak” ticket can be used are determined by the restriction code of the ticket, which is printed on the ticket, and can be looked up.

Penrith-Sheringham’s code is CG

Ticket Restriction CG | National Rail

Ticket restriction details CG. Each train ticket restriction code states when and/or on what train(s) the ticket is not valid and the days and/or dates that these restrictions apply.

www.nationalrail.co.uk

Restrictions​

Applicable Days​

Monday to Friday
Mondays-Fridays

Outward Travel​

Not valid on any train timed to depart after 04:29 and before 09:00.

Return Travel​

Not valid on any train timed to depart after 04:29 and before 09:00.

Notes​

For travel from/to/via Stevenage, restriction 1L or 9D applies as appropriate to direction of travel.

So in this case the 08:22 from Sheringham wasn’t a valid service for the ticket, no.

 

[transportphoto]

An off peak return from Penrith to Sheringham is not valid on any train timed to depart after 04:29 and before 09:00.

By rights your ticket should not have been accepted on the 08:22 departure from Sheringham. It is worth noting that off peak day returns from Sheringham to Norwich become valid at 07:45 hence the guard probably accepting a wider view of off peak tickets for that journey.

 

[Watershed]

Welcome to the forum!

The simple answer is the trains you can take is determined by the ticket you hold. Each Off-Peak ticket has a restriction code which sets out the restrictions that apply. If you had a simple Penrith to Sheringham Off-Peak Return (rather than a combination of tickets, i.e. 'split tickets'), this would have the restriction code CG. This would be printed on the ticket - it will say something like "For restrictions see nre.co.uk/CG".

As per that link, restriction code CG allows you to travel from 9am onwards, so your ticket wasn't actually valid for the 08:22 train from Sheringham. That being said, the reason the conductor likely accepted it is that an Off-Peak ticket from Sheringham to Norwich has restriction code B8, which allows travel from 07:45 (i.e. the 08:22 is the first valid train). The conductor is probably so used to that train being the first valid one (since the majority of passengers will just be travelling to Norwich) that they accepted your ticket without looking it in more detail.

As for the barriers at Norwich, the only way to know for sure why they rejected your ticket would be if you happened to spot the 3-digit code displayed next to the "Seek Assistance" message. These codes each have a specific meaning, as explained on this website. The most likely explanation is that you were using a ticket which wasn't issued to or from Norwich - I know that might sound a bit strange, but barriers have to be manually programmed to accept anything that isn't a ticket to/from the station in question. The most common journeys will get programmed in (e.g. Sheringham to London probably is), but the gates are quite rudimentary and don't have enough memory to store every possible valid journey.

Your idea of buying a new ticket for the 'peak'/restricted part of your journey is fine and is often going to be the cheapest option - well, that or buying split tickets, depending on when and where you're travelling.

 

[Royston Vasey]

https://www.brfares.com/!faredetail?orig=PNR&dest=SHM&rlc=DIS&rte=700&tkt=SVR only excludes any train timed to depart between 04:29 and 09:00.

Boarding at Norwich it is valid on the 09:52 EMR departure, regardless of whether you could have got to that train legitimately by 09:00 from Sheringham on that ticket, as break of journey is permitted.

RE the advice given above by @Watershed, there is an Off Peak Return and Day Return, but no Off Peak Single. There is only an Anytime Day Single from Sheringham to Norwich, so if only needed one way as I interpret here, this is marginally cheaper than the Off Peak Day Return, with no restrictions to worry about anyway.

So in short, yes, you can buy the £6.70 Anytime Day Single (DSB) to legitimately board the 08:22 and use your Off Peak Return back to Penrith from Norwich on the 09:52.

 

[grainy]

Thanks all for taking the time to answer

 

[grainy]

Planning a similar trip in February and checking the journey planner on here it suggests advance singles to Norwich splitting at Ely followed by an off peak return Norwich to Sheringham with restriction CZ which shows an easement on the 8.22 am return, allowing travel on the earlier train.

This possibly explains why my CG ticket was accepted previously but I guess that the easement only applies to the local ticket?

 

[saismee]

As for the barriers at Norwich, the only way to know for sure why they rejected your ticket would be if you happened to spot the 3-digit code displayed next to the "Seek Assistance" message. These codes each have a specific meaning, as explained on this website. The most likely explanation is that you were using a ticket which wasn't issued to or from Norwich - I know that might sound a bit strange, but barriers have to be manually programmed to accept anything that isn't a ticket to/from the station in question. The most common journeys will get programmed in (e.g. Sheringham to London probably is), but the gates are quite rudimentary and don't have enough memory to store every possible valid journey.

The rejection will depend on the type of ticket. I find that these Cubic barriers are pretty clever when it comes to E-tickets/Aztec codes, but paper tickets are very hit-or-miss for break of journey. It's likely that the barrier rejected it due to the time more than anything, which I find happens a lot in this region. It's always funny seeing my friends who don't use trains much get scared when their ticket is rejected, even though it's just a quirk of the off-peak programming on the barriers.