Greater Anglia Good and Bad Discussion

[rj90]

My local stations are Enfield lock and Turkey street and I will be very glad when they are gone on the latter line. The stations are a state and the trains on the turkey street line are invariably full of rubbish and have a number of broken seats.

The thing that irks me most though is their useless-ness with train lengths (as many have pointed out). For example, Thursday December 18th, probably the night companies are most likely to have a Christmas party and the last train LST to Enfield lock was 4 carriages. The crowds at Tottenham hale were so big that they made the fast Cambridge train behind into a stopper so everyone could get home (and fair play for that). Another example was at a recent spurs game, train to Enfield town was 8 carriages and went near-empty, train to Cheshunt was only 4 and had to leave people on the platform. They really are useless and hopefully LO can improve the simple things like not having broken seats in the short term and obviously new trains in a couple of years.

It's also interesting to note, and it makes a lot of sense now, that their franchise didn't stipulate any necessary investment, which which in hindsight seems fair; I didn't know that until reading this thread.

 

[Suraggu]

I still chuckle to myself at the thought of 3 TOC's serving London Liverpool Street... I feel that we have gone into a time warp and its 2001. Back when Anglia, WAGN & FGE were ploughing the rails.

So gone is the DfT and their super Franchises. I know its because of Crossrail and LO taking another line into their control but I still think its mad.

 

[E-Rail]

Perhaps splitting Anglia and Great Eastern again would encourage improvements in service and standards. Looking back at around 2002, Ipswich had four tph to Liverpool Street (2 from each operator with their own competing offers on fares), Anglia offered a 'full service' on it's Mainline trains and Norwich to London was achieved in 1hr 40 mins every hour.

 

[nesw]

For all of it's benefits, I believe that Anglia railways was loss making.

 

[dk1]

For all of it's benefits, I believe that Anglia railways was loss making.

Dragged down by the locals so would be. Anglia where also caught out by GE going half-hourly to Ipswich.

 

[samuelmorris]

A bit chilly on the way in today on 315801 - heating I think was on as it was far from as cold as outside, but not as warm as I'd like or expect.
321309 on the return journey is much warmer, but still thick with the new year's snowy footprints on the floor and really does look a bit of a mess. Really now we're back into the normal weekday timetable I'd have thought the floors could at least have been mopped...

 

[SPADTrap]

A bit chilly on the way in today on 315801 - heating I think was on as it was far from as cold as outside, but not as warm as I'd like or expect.
321309 on the return journey is much warmer, but still thick with the new year's snowy footprints on the floor and really does look a bit of a mess. Really now we're back into the normal weekday timetable I'd have thought the floors could at least have been mopped...

Do hate what the grit does to the floors too!

 

[nesw]

Stock was displaced last weekend because of engineering work, so in some cases just a "turn around" clean was given.
Cyclic diagrams usually allow units to reach a depot every few days when it's more practical to wash floors etc. This can also be done off-peak.

 

[306024]

A bit chilly on the way in today on 315801 - heating I think was on as it was far from as cold as outside, but not as warm as I'd like or expect.
321309 on the return journey is much warmer, but still thick with the new year's snowy footprints on the floor and really does look a bit of a mess. Really now we're back into the normal weekday timetable I'd have thought the floors could at least have been mopped...

Now after years of trying to keep the trains clean on a shoestring budget the fleet obviously isn't as clean as that of some other TOCs who have invested more in their cleaning regime. But at last count there were something like 916 coaches in the AGA EMU fleet alone. The idea that they can all have the floors mopped at the first drop of dirt is perhaps just slightly optimistic?

Anglia where also caught out by GE going half-hourly to Ipswich.

And GE were caught out by the hire of WAGN 317s for those additional Anglia Ipswich services. It was all a bit of a game back then

 

[Kite159]

I still chuckle to myself at the thought of 3 TOC's serving London Liverpool Street... I feel that we have gone into a time warp and its 2001. Back when Anglia, WAGN & FGE were ploughing the rails.

So gone is the DfT and their super Franchises. I know its because of Crossrail and LO taking another line into their control but I still think its mad.

I count 4 TOCs in Liverpool Street

Greater Anglia, Crossrail [or TFL Rail], London Overground & C2C.

 

[CockneySparrow]

Dragged down by the locals so would be. Anglia where also caught out by GE going half-hourly to Ipswich.

No so much these days, if you are referring to the 3 lines out of Norwich I believe they are more or less holding their own these days, I did read somewhere (must have been 5 years ago) that Norfolk Council have cut funding to Anglia Railways

 

[dk1]

No so much these days, if you are referring to the 3 lines out of Norwich I believe they are more or less holding their own these days, I did read somewhere (must have been 5 years ago) that Norfolk Council have cut funding to Anglia Railways

They will never break even like almost all rural routes in the UK. Always remember being told back in the 80s by a guard that he takes more on a single 1st class Intercity fare than he took on a whole shift of local services. Things not changed that much. What they don't get from local councils just gets made up from a National franchise level.

 

[samuelmorris]

Not exactly what I said though, is it 306024?
I can accept and fully expect stock to get grimy over the new years period when fewer staff are on, but having most of the units out of traffic for an extended period would at least you'd think allow for a cursory clean - I'm not looking for a full refresh with replaced seat covers et. al - just a bit more than binning the previous day's papers would be nice!
Granted it's a far smaller fleet but c2c's stock is seldom dirty inside or out. That's not rose tinted glasses from seeing the occasional 357 at Stratford, but having used the line as a daily commute for over 2 years. Once or twice I spotted graffiti on a unit, and they're not always completely spotless, but even with a white exterior and similar hard flooring inside to most of GA's stock, they never look thoroughly dirty.
Does it not seem sensible for GA to have a proportionately larger army of cleaners to match the larger rolling stock fleet? I gather this is part of what the 'we're hiring more cleaning staff' announcement was about. Time will tell if it makes a difference.

I'm rather hoping that the 317s and 321s cascaded from Great Northern upon the arrival of 377/5s will be taken up by AGA to deal with the stock 'shortage' and allow more time for cleaning etc. and reduced likelihood of short-forms or cancelled services from failures. Assuming they have the depot space to keep them of course!

dk1: perhaps unsurprising given that the intercity first class tickets are priced at more than 75p a mile! Still, that's good value compared to the other intercity routes, or at least it would be if the rolling stock was a little better

 

[dk1]

dk1: perhaps unsurprising given that the intercity first class tickets are priced at more than 75p a mile! Still, that's good value compared to the other intercity routes, or at least it would be if the rolling stock was a little better

I am ashamed of the IC stock in its current well worn state. Let's hope with the refresh that opinions improve. I have been informed that although the Pretendolino has sockets, it's unlikely to have wifi whilst on the Anglia main line. You have been warned

 

[306024]

Not exactly what I said though, is it 306024?
I can accept and fully expect stock to get grimy over the new years period when fewer staff are on, but having most of the units out of traffic for an extended period would at least you'd think allow for a cursory clean - I'm not looking for a full refresh with replaced seat covers et. al - just a bit more than binning the previous day's papers would be nice!

Granted it's a far smaller fleet but c2c's stock is seldom dirty inside or out. That's not rose tinted glasses from seeing the occasional 357 at Stratford, but having used the line as a daily commute for over 2 years. Once or twice I spotted graffiti on a unit, and they're not always completely spotless, but even with a white exterior and similar hard flooring inside to most of GA's stock, they never look thoroughly dirty.

Does it not seem sensible for GA to have a proportionately larger army of cleaners to match the larger rolling stock fleet? I gather this is part of what the 'we're hiring more cleaning staff' announcement was about. Time will tell if it makes a difference.

I'm sure you can tell I was being a bit tongue in cheek, but I'd be prepared to wager AGA has one of the lowest ratios of cleaners to coaches of any big TOC. I was a East Ham Depot once and the number of cleaners that were working on a single unit was far more than all those at Ilford put together. Both TOCs were NX controlled then, but it was like chalk and cheese. Like you I hope the additional cleaner announcement makes a difference.

 

[samuelmorris]

I am ashamed of the IC stock in its current well worn state. Let's hope with the refresh that opinions improve. I have been informed that although the Pretendolino has sockets, it's unlikely to have wifi whilst on the Anglia main line. You have been warned

It wasn't until I walked past one tonight with the doors open that I realised they didn't even repaint the doors on the inside when they reliveried them. I mean I suppose why would they, but it doesn't say much about how much work has gone on since they first transferred to the Anglia network around 10 years ago does it? I glanced through the windows and they didn't seem as obviously dilapidated as the twitter photos would suggest, but even so, they're a bit 'retro' putting it politely - As I've mentioned several times before, there are plenty of examples of Mk3s being perfectly respectable modern coaching stock with a bit of a refresh so here's hoping AGA put enough effort in to deliver that. I'm not holding my breath but you never know!

 

[jon0844]

alas no.....this was entire units of 4.....some reports on twitter were 8 car trains....

But why are these not checked before being put into service? Drivers used to walk the trains - although appreciate a lot of the stock is non gangwayed....

Not great when you are paying through the roof is it! Pretty basic sevrice provision in Winter dont you think?

I always thought there was a thermostat in each carriage. I remember when National Express fitted the wrong type to 313s that caused problems (and maybe also fitted them to the 315s?).

When it comes to heating, I don't like a carriage that's too warm as I'm probably wearing warm clothing if it's cold outside.. and I don't generally take my coat off and get comfy on a train (unless it's Intercity). Of course you don't want no heating, but sometimes it can be rather too hot for my liking.

Now after years of trying to keep the trains clean on a shoestring budget the fleet obviously isn't as clean as that of some other TOCs who have invested more in their cleaning regime. But at last count there were something like 916 coaches in the AGA EMU fleet alone. The idea that they can all have the floors mopped at the first drop of dirt is perhaps just slightly optimistic?

When it's cold, all platforms are gritted. Thus, everyone boarding will carry that onto the train.

As such it's not just unrealistic for someone to expect them to be kept clean, but totally impossible.

 

[chubs]

It wasn't until I walked past one tonight with the doors open that I realised they didn't even repaint the doors on the inside when they reliveried them. I mean I suppose why would they, but it doesn't say much about how much work has gone on since they first transferred to the Anglia network around 10 years ago does it? I glanced through the windows and they didn't seem as obviously dilapidated as the twitter photos would suggest, but even so, they're a bit 'retro' putting it politely - As I've mentioned several times before, there are plenty of examples of Mk3s being perfectly respectable modern coaching stock with a bit of a refresh so here's hoping AGA put enough effort in to deliver that. I'm not holding my breath but you never know!

When they first transferred over from Virgin some went straight into service before refurb and were in appalling state. Blocked / permanently OOU toilets, dodgy heating, really worn interiors. Still better than the Anglia MkII's were at the time though.

 

[samuelmorris]

Which period do the inherited Mk3s date back to - the 87s or the 90s, or is it a combination of both?

 

[Alfie1014]

Most of the first class vehicles are MKIIIb which date from the 1980s but some of the seconds date back to the first MKIIIa vehicles which are from 1975.

 

[stu227]

As such it's not just unrealistic for someone to expect them to be kept clean, but totally impossible.

Compare cleanliness of floors in AGA trains with that of LUL - take a line like District, where many stations are similarly above ground and passenger numbers much higher - I'll bet the floors are cleaner on LU than AGA.

 

[Domh245]

The D stock floors do look quite dirty, as do those on the new(ish) S stock - especially at this time of year and particularly when it has recently rained

 

[jon0844]

I am not sure why it would be different. If there's anything put down on the platforms it will be carried on at each stop, simple as. And if the floor is vinyl then the only possible difference visually will be the colour.

If you did want to keep the floor looking spotless, you'd need to wash the floor at every stop, not just at turnarounds (and I don't think anyone washes or hoovers the trains at stations).

It's a few months of the year, and lot even every day, where this is a 'problem' and my car isn't immune to getting filthy either, just in case anyone thinks they'd be better off driving than being on a dirty train.

 

[36270k]

This evening I have travelled on a 153 and a 156 from Ipswich and there were both clean and in good condition.

 

[TheEdge]

This evening I have travelled on a 153 and a 156 from Ipswich and there were both clean and in good condition.

Representing for the rural network. Bored of hearing about the metro and WA stuff...

 

[samuelmorris]

Bit quiet in here lately - anything actually happening with regard to this 'action group'?

 

[TheEdge]

Bit quiet in here lately - anything actually happening with regard to this 'action group'?

They are too busy crowdfunding their franchise bid...

 

[samuelmorris]

Very poor showing on the metro service today, which is normally in my experience a lot better than the mainline services for obvious reasons. 20 minutes late to a meeting due to a pair of cancellations, the second of which was only announced at the time the train would have been due to depart Shenfield.
Using a 321 tonight but just as well as judging by the announcements it's no better this evening...

 

[LAX54]

Very poor showing on the metro service today, which is normally in my experience a lot better than the mainline services for obvious reasons. 20 minutes late to a meeting due to a pair of cancellations, the second of which was only announced at the time the train would have been due to depart Shenfield.
Using a 321 tonight but just as well as judging by the announcements it's no better this evening...

You wait til Crossrail takes over ! LOL

 

[jon0844]

Saw a poster bigging up the new Gold Card and proudly stating you can now use it on the entire AGA network, but with a * that then mentioned four stations not included. So that's not the whole network then!!