Greater Anglia 2019 - What could possibly go wrong?

[dk1]

Not sure how bad it's getting for the staff, but the repeated pressing of the PA button and hearing the ding followed by ABBA being played about 12 times tonight on the 19:45 ex Peterborough was certainly a random thing to happen. I saw the amusing side of it but I thought the passenger trying to sleep next to me was going to burst a blood vessel!

Is this a one off or can we expect entertainment on a regular basis in 2019?

Most definatley not on my train it won't. Would do my head in.

 

[F Great Eastern]

This is something I must have missed - what's that all about?

It was slightly weird, whilst we were at Peterborough about 5-6 times the PA bell went on followed by ABBA being played over the speakers for varying lengths of time, with an occasional bit of laughter in the background. Happened a couple more times up to Ely, after that happened again when someone pressed the PA button about 4-5 times in quick succession (heard ding sound 4-5 times, followed by more dancing queen.

Have to say whilst most people took it in good humour, It did seem a little unprofessional and if was trying to sleep I would not be amused in the slightest with it. Sounded like someone holding a phone up to the mic in all honesty as it drifted in and out a little. I regret I didn't record it but my battery was almost dead and the person in the window seat was using the socket.

 

[samuelmorris]

Is this a bit like the Thomas the Tank Engine theme being played through the PA on the Northern 319s?

 

[dk1]

It was slightly weird, whilst we were at Peterborough about 5-6 times the PA bell went on followed by ABBA being played over the speakers for varying lengths of time, with an occasional bit of laughter in the background. Happened a couple more times up to Ely, after that happened again when someone pressed the PA button about 4-5 times in quick succession (heard ding sound 4-5 times, followed by more dancing queen.

Have to say whilst most people took it in good humour, It did seem a little unprofessional and if was trying to sleep I would not be amused in the slightest with it. Sounded like someone holding a phone up to the mic in all honesty as it drifted in and out a little.

Things like that are just tedious. Some staff take it far too far I'm afraid.

 

[86246]

I regret I didn't record it but my battery was almost dead and the person in the window seat was using the socket.

You couldn't have been travelling on 170273 unless the power sockets have finally been fixed.

 

[F Great Eastern]

You couldn't have been travelling on 170273 unless the power sockets have finally been fixed.

I have no idea what unit was on that service as I didn't look, but the guy next to me in the window seat had something plugged into the socket so I didn't even attempt to use it.. If it was working I have no idea.

 

[dk1]

You couldn't have been travelling on 170273 unless the power sockets have finally been fixed.

Fully functioning sockets on 273 this morning & looks like it's had a hand bash as looming like new exterior wise, My only fault is the very loud auto PA.Hi

 

[F Great Eastern]

Excellent news coming out of Greater Anglia's own press release.

Greater Anglia is replacing every single train with brand new state-of-the-art longer trains from the middle of next year.

I think it is great news that Greater Anglia have now committed to replacing every single 8 car EMU with 10 car EMUs and every 12 car EMU with a 15 car EMU which surely means that there will no longer be any capacity problems on the line that many of us have been fearing for the last few months

However I do have a few questions

1) How is the work going to lengthen platforms to support this, will it be done in time?
2) What kind of older stock will they be keeping on in order to achieve this, or have they taken up options to extend the existing order?
3) What is the case for DOO operations when it is a 15 car EMU? Have the unions agreed to this?

 

[jopsuk]

I think they'll cheerfully tell you that they're making the claim on the basis of replacing 80m units with 120m and 240m units...

 

[F Great Eastern]

I think they'll cheerfully tell you that they're making the claim on the basis of replacing 80m units with 120m and 240m units...

It's sarcasm, of course and of course that's what they'll point to, but at the end of the day it's once again yet more spin that is being used to try and cover-up the fact that a number of 8 car EMUs are going to be replaced by 5 car EMUs that will substantially downgrade the amount of people you can fit on the train at peak time, since whilst you will gain a few more seats, you'll lose an awful lot of standing space.

In 2018 the Greater Anglia spin machine was in overdrive, but in the last few weeks it's become something more than spin, with the recent factually incorrect comments from the MD claiming some of the trains were much older than they actually are, they have more fleets than they actually do and that GA as a franchise have delivered new trains before when they haven't and now this.

It's easy to see similarities with Scotrail where Abellio are busy making claims about the railways up there being the best they have ever been, when customer satisfaction and performance figures would suggest otherwise as they are unable to pack up their lofty promises and marketing with the actual operation of their services. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if we saw the same in Greater Anglia.

Still, if the rail business continues to go tits-up for Abellio, I'm sure that they can re-focus themselves as a marketing agency or a PR firm since their skillset is probably suited to that, or perhaps politics would also be a good industry to be involved in, since that is another place where never answering a straight question with a straight answer is useful.

 

[samuelmorris]

Yeah I noticed the 'inaccuracies' in that article. Having met Jamie Burles he's pretty clued up so I suspect that's part of a blurb prepared by marketing. He probably knows some of that statement is inaccurate.

Scotrail could conceivably be 'Scotland's best ever railway' if everything they proposed had gone to plan. The exact same applies to GA. To be fair, compare what we have to GTR passengers in 2018 or SWR passengers in 2017 and we really don't have it that bad, even now. Shortforms may be bad news, but compared to living in zone 5 and getting just 1 train per hour (Sutton loop) and still in excess of a 10% cancellation rate with that single train for a period of 6 months, things aren't that bad.

It's crunch time for Abellio. If Scotrail and GA start to go right, they'll probably stick it out, but already under heavy scrutiny for how much better NS fares than their UK operations, with numerous calls for them to be stripped of the Scotrail operation (serious ones, not just raging commuters calling for it on twitter that every TOC gets) and financial difficulties in Anglia, if one fails, so too might the other and they may end up exiting the industry like NX. Where that would leave WMT I'm not sure. The worst is yet to come with the PRM fallout plan not yet decided and costly lease extensions for the existing fleet yet to be procured.

 

[HH]

Abellio - great ideas, lousy execution.

And if Jamie Burles is spewing Marketing speak, when he knows it isn't true, then shame on him. I thought he was better than that.

 

[Wivenswold]

Business types' marketing/double speak is widely accepted within business to indicate a lack of knowledge and/or confidence. It still seems to be prevalent in marketing and public services sectors though. Burles is either being deliberately oblique to avoid saying anything of substance or isn't up to the job. It's a concern.

 

[Class 170101]

Abellio - great ideas, lousy execution.

Not eaxctly helped by NR and their timetable meltdown last year which the railway still hasn't recovered from and with NR controlling their workload via the number of trains they will process at one time has slowed timetable development down somewhat.

 

[47421]

Not eaxctly helped by NR and their timetable meltdown last year which the railway still hasn't recovered from and with NR controlling their workload via the number of trains they will process at one time has slowed timetable development down somewhat.

Sure the NR problems may have delayed things, but the May19 planned timetable changes were minor and really should have been manageable if in fact they are deliverable (and if they are not then difficult to see how they will delivery the promised extra 1144 services a week). Below is what I posted on another thread https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...d-new-station-at-meridian-water.122783/page-3.

A number of these commitments of course need external parties to deliver, but some don't. No reason why GA should not have delivered on carnet ticket initiatives, or the commitment to install wifi in entire existing fleet. So far only one 317 been sent away for PRM mods which suggests they wont meet December deadline to have 27 sets done.

By way of update on the below. On the new Meridian Water to Stratford service: there is no firm info on this, but when I asked GA a few weeks ago when it would start i just got a noncommital holding response. TfL did not reply to my email. New services are not in realtimetrains so seems likely they will not start in May 19.

On platform extensions I FoIed Network Rail. Response was:

"Hertford East / Ware
I can confirm that we hold information relevant to this part of your request.2 Please see below the latest update and information on the infrastructure work.
We are currently working with Greater Anglia at GRIP stage level 4 to develop platform extension proposals at Hertford East and Ware. At this time the current programme shows that the works are to be competed in 2021, however we are exploring whether this date can be accelerated.

Hackney Downs / Seven Sisters / White Hart Lane / Edmonton Green / St Margaret’s
I can advise that no information is held regarding infrastructure work to these stations as we have not been approached to develop platform extension proposals at these
locations."​

This is a summary of key obligations in FA, it ignores financial underperformance/drawdown of subordinated shareholder funding a la VTEC and ongoing poor operational performance, likely delays to 720s taking into account the 6m+ delay to 710s on Goblin/WestAnglia inners, also lists some future deadlines for reference:

• Schedule 6.2 para 76.6 by 1 May 2018 introduce anytime flex carnet and off peak flex carnet
• Schedule 6.2 para 105 by 1 Sept 2018 extend platforms at Hertford East, Wickford, Manningtree, Kings Lynn, Elsenham, Ware, St Margarets and Enfield Lock Stations
• Schedule 6.2 para 9.1 by 31 Oct 2018 automatic SDO on 27x317 and beacons at 96 platforms
• Dec 18 TSR 2TPH Meridian Water to Stratford
• Schedule 6.2 para 4 by 31 Dec 2018 ontrain wifi on entire existing fleet

• Schedule 6.2 para 81 by 30 Jan 2019 use best endeavours to introduce post-pay account based ticketing London to Southend V, Norwich or Cambridge
• Schedule 6.2 para 80 by 30 April 2019 introduce 6m pilot for near field communication smartphone ticketing
• May 2019 TSR 2 (Hertford East 2TPH to 3TPH off peak only/Southend Vic 3TPH to 4TPH off peak only/Norwich Cambridge hourly extended to Stansted Airport all day/LivSt Ipswich hourly semifast extended to Norwich all day)
• Schedule 6.2 para 51 complete redevelopment of stations at Brox, Cheshunt, Harlow Town and Southend Vic
• Schedule 6.2 para 10 date unspecified but must mean by 31 Dec 2018 complete PRM mods on 27x317

• May 2020 TSR 3 full recast with 1144 additional services a week
• Schedule 6.2 para 51 complete redevelopment of Cambridge station by 31 Dec 2020

 

[samuelmorris]

I suppose given new stock won't be ready in time for the May 2020 recast they see no need to press ahead with the May 2019 adjustment either. A little bit disappointing really, especially since Norwich in 90 and its consequential detriment to other peak services still went ahead.

 

[iphone76]

I suppose given new stock won't be ready in time for the May 2020 recast they see no need to press ahead with the May 2019 adjustment either. A little bit disappointing really, especially since Norwich in 90 and its consequential detriment to other peak services still went ahead.

I wonder if they have the drivers available to run the extra services to Southend and Hertford East from May 19?

 

[samuelmorris]

Possibly not, but they can't need that many to achieve that, surely. That's what, 5 extra diagrams?

 

[43096]

Abellio - great ideas, lousy execution.

And if Jamie Burles is spewing Marketing speak, when he knows it isn't true, then shame on him. I thought he was better than that.

It’s worse than that. He’s the MD so the marketing spin is his responsibility as well.

 

[dk1]

I wonder if they have the drivers available to run the extra services to Southend and Hertford East from May 19?

Guaranteed 4-day week from May has been agreed today for all Anglia & GE drivers.

 

[adrock1976]

It was slightly weird, whilst we were at Peterborough about 5-6 times the PA bell went on followed by ABBA being played over the speakers for varying lengths of time, with an occasional bit of laughter in the background. Happened a couple more times up to Ely, after that happened again when someone pressed the PA button about 4-5 times in quick succession (heard ding sound 4-5 times, followed by more dancing queen.

Have to say whilst most people took it in good humour, It did seem a little unprofessional and if was trying to sleep I would not be amused in the slightest with it. Sounded like someone holding a phone up to the mic in all honesty as it drifted in and out a little. I regret I didn't record it but my battery was almost dead and the person in the window seat was using the socket.

Having just caught up with this thread and with a slight sideways move off topic, this post reminds me of one of my former partners who had imposed herself on me when I was still residing in my native West Midlands during the mid 1990s. When that relationship ended not on very good terms, I gathered up her contents to put them into black bags. The very first bag I filled and placed outside the door to the flat contained her Abba, Cliff Richard, Bros, and New Kids on the Block records as I wanted to be sure that she would take that rubbish away with her as I used to be tortured with listening to that during the course of that relationship.

Perhaps I should start a new thread in the General Discussion section to see if other forum members have used unorthodox methods in trying to finally get a former partner or spouse to leave?

 

[samuelmorris]

Well it certainly doesn't belong in this thread!

 

[adrock1976]

Well it certainly doesn't belong in this thread!

Well, I have not long posted a new thread there anyway.

 

[HH]

This is a summary of key obligations in FA, it ignores financial underperformance/drawdown of subordinated shareholder funding a la VTEC and ongoing poor operational performance, likely delays to 720s taking into account the 6m+ delay to 710s on Goblin/WestAnglia inners, also lists some future deadlines for reference:

• Schedule 6.2 para 76.6 by 1 May 2018 introduce anytime flex carnet and off peak flex carnet

This hasn't happened AFAIK.

 

[F Great Eastern]

GA said to be considering asking for derogations to be made from 1st January 2020 on it's existing EMU fleet following indications that the Stadler Fleet is now running over 2 months late, in addition to the previously discussed Bombardier issues.

 

[trebor79]

As predicted.

 

[HH]

As predicted.

Since the start of the franchise...

 

[Wivenswold]

I wonder exactly how late the 720s actually are now given that they were due for testing late 2018 and into service in February 2019 in the original blurb. It must be approaching 6 months now.

 

[whhistle]

Not sure why some people seem desperate to point out things that are wrong or when they were right.
I don't think anyone at Stadler has tried to delay the introduction to the UK.
No company is going to add an extra couple of months on to an order as a "just in case" prediction either.

I also can't remember any project that hasn't been delayed in one way or another.
So the real question is, why are people surprised, or "predict" it'll be late?
It's not a prediction... it's normal.

I also can't think of any company that doesn't stretch the boundaries of truth.
I have personally been involved in a marketing campaign that was a downright lie... to get people talking about the company.

 

[Wivenswold]

Lots of project finish on time or even early, it depends how they're managed. The Stadlers will be passing the perfectly on-time Olympics Park and may well be taking football fans to The Emirates, again finished on time.

To suggest that late delivery of a project is normal, well. I deal with insurance on wide range of things but I mostly look after Professional Indemnity claims and on the project side the moment it looks as if a contract clause will be broken, an army of solicitors move in and letters start being sent in all directions between every single company involved.

Away from the world of Marketing things are taken much more seriously but that's not to say that the marketing arms of companies like GA don't mislead sometimes. The devil is usually in the things that aren't detailed.