Great Northern prosecution letter

[LP1]

Hi all, I really need some advice. My son who is currently at uni has received a notice of intention to prosecute letter from great northern/southern/thameslink trains. He was caught travelling on a child ticket that was also not purchased to cover his entire journey. He owned up to what he had done after being stopped at Brighton station. He has now been issued an intent to prosecute letter. He knows what he did was wrong but says he did not have enough money for a ticket and good for the rest of the week. Obviously he made the wrong choice by try to dodge the fair. Has anyone any advice for us before I consult a solicitor as not he has racked up £50,000 in student fees he can not afford a criminal record and won’t get employment. Any advice is sincerely welcomed

 

[30907]

Hi and welcome to a forum you didn't want to join

The train company will almost certainly be willing to settle without going to court, provided your son engages with the process (he is an adult so needs to do this himself). Typically they will ask for the correct fare (with no Railcard discounts) plus an amount for the costs of investigating, possibly as low as £50 but I would budget for more.

They will almost certainly investigate your son's ticket purchase history, and if they discover he has done this before it may add to the cost. However, unless the story is much more complicated, it's not worth consulting a solicitor.

There are plenty of posts by member Hadders giving advice on replying - the search facility top right will find them!

Lastly, please don't worry too much about this - even if he gets taken to court for travelling without a ticket it is unlikely to affect his future career significantly - whereas trying to conceal a conviction is a no-no.

 

[John R]

Just one slight digression - the 50k of student loan is paid off as effectively a graduate tax at a rate of 9% over around 26k pa earnings. And for those currently graduating it’s written off after 30 years. So it doesn’t really impact affordability.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi all, I really need some advice. My son who is currently at uni has received a notice of intention to prosecute letter from great northern/southern/thameslink trains. He was caught travelling on a child ticket that was also not purchased to cover his entire journey. He owned up to what he had done after being stopped at Brighton station. He has now been issued an intent to prosecute letter. He knows what he did was wrong but says he did not have enough money for a ticket and good for the rest of the week. Obviously he made the wrong choice by try to dodge the fair. Has anyone any advice for us before I consult a solicitor as not he has racked up £50,000 in student fees he can not afford a criminal record and won’t get employment. Any advice is sincerely welcomed

can you or your son upload anonymised copies of all the paperwork - this will help get you good advice on what to do next. I suspect if this is the 1st stage correspondence it is not a prosecution but 'we might prosecute you but please tell us your side of the story' letter. This is the chance to try and seek an out of court settlement. May not need to engage a solicitor yet.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

I suggest your son writes a short, concise reply mentioning the following points:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Govia Thameslink Railway are generally one of the more reasonable train companies to deal with when it comes to this sort of thing. Normally they will offer an out of court settlement to people who co-operate with them, and who haven't come to their attention before. Expect an out of court settlement to cost around £150 plus the outstanding fare at the full Anytime rate with no credit given for the ticket your son did purchase. The settlement would need to be paid in full withink a few days of it being offered.

One potential complication is if your sone has done this sort of thing before. GTR will be able to research your son's online ticket purchasing history and discover if he has been buying child rate tickets. You need to be careful how you reply to the letter - if the letter refers to the specific incident where your son was caught then I would confine your response to that incident only - you are not required to incriminate yourself. On the other hand if the letter mentions the possibility of other incidents then it would be wise to 'come clean' about these in your reply.

My view is it isn't necessary to use a solicitor for this. Should you not get a favourable reply to your letter then that wold be the time I would consider using a solicitor.

Feel free to post a copy of your draft reply in this thread and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you. As noted above the letter to GTR needs to come from yoru son but there's nothing stopping you from helping him to write it.

 

[LP1]

Thank you everyone for your replies they are really helpful as I am in full panic mode. I have attached the letter sent by train company and my son assures me this is the first time this has happened. I am more than happy to pay any amount for fine but just to do this the correct way in order to avoid going to court.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you everyone for your replies they are really helpful as I am in full panic mode. I have attached the letter sent by train company and my son assures me this is the first time this has happened. I am more than happy to pay any amount for fine but just to do this the correct way in order to avoid going to court.

First time he has been caught or the first and only time he has ever done this? People on here who fare evade seem to find it difficult to make that distinction. I'm not syaing your son is a liar but may not see the difference...

This is REALLY important - if he has done something like this before chances are they will find out - esp if tickets bought on line. He has short fared and bought child tickets when an adult - it's statistically unlikely he got caught on the first time he did either or both of these things. he needs to be 100% honest about this - as if they detect any lie the prospects of prosecution are increased

But if they are not asking about other occasions now don't mention them at this stage, but don't say 'never done this before' either unless that is 100% guaranteed.

Anyway - see the post from Hadders at post 5 and get your son to start drafting up something that is along those lines - see other threads for plenty of examples of other people efforts. Get that drafted and post it up here for people to help get it as good as it can be. If he is at University I am sure he can write what is needed.

There won't be a fine as such - what your son needs to do is basically ask them if they will be kind and sympathetic enough to allow him to settle the matter out of court for a sum that represents the fares evaded and the costs of their admin. All the cards are in their hands, but they do often settle in this way. This then avoids the criminal record that will result for court action

Also - get him to buy a Railcard NOW. This is then something that he can mention in the reply to show that he has taken steps to legitimately reduce his fares in future without breaking the law, helping support the point that he has learned his lesson and will not evade again.

Finally do not miss the deadline for response, send your reply by tracked Royal Mail postage too - you need to guarantee they get it.

 

[LP1]

Hi all, my son has drafted this response before we sent could anyone let us know if it is the correct way forward

I would like to start by stating my sincerest apologies for the incident of travelling on the railway without a valid ticket entitling travel. It was a very foolish act made by me and I accept total responsibility for my actions. My lapse of judgement in this situation is a regrettable mistake which I never intend to make again. As a student with no fixed income I made a very poor decision to avoid paying full train fare to try and save money for groceries.
I have learnt that my actions on the day were totally stupid and understand how this affects the rail industry as a whole. I am in the process of purchasing a Railcard in order to legitimately help me reduce my travel costs in the future.
I would be very grateful if you would consider allowing me to settle this matter out of court. I will pay any outstanding train fare plus administration fees that have occurred. My Journey was from Crayford Station to Brighton Station.
I am very concerned that my foolishness in this matter will have a disproportionate effect on my future employment and I hope my full cooperation in getting this situation settled is favourable.​

 

[Haywain]

I am in the process of purchasing a Railcard in order to legitimately help me reduce my travel costs in the future.

It takes minutes to buy a railcard. Buy one and say you've bought one, that will carry more weight than a vague promise to buy one.

 

[LP1]

It takes minutes to buy a railcard. Buy one and say you've bought one, that will carry more weight than a vague promise to buy one.

I will do this now and add the card ref number to letter thank you

 

[antharro]

This needs editing. Remember the people reading it will be reading dozens of these if not more, so the more concise you can be the better.

My edits are in bold and strikethrough, with comments in italics.


Reference: xxxxx

Dear Fares Evasion Manager,

I would like to start by stating offering my sincerest apologies for the incident of travelling on the railway without a valid ticket entitling travel. It was a very foolish act made by me and I accept total responsibility for my actions. I have learnt that my actions on the day were totally stupid and I have since come to understand how this affects the rail industry as a whole. I have since purchased a railcard to help with my travel costs - [railcard type and number here].

My lapse of judgement in this situation is a regrettable mistake which I never intend to make again. As a student with no fixed income I made a very poor decision to avoid paying full train fare to try and save money for groceries. <-- they will not care one jot about this; it is not a justification

I am in the process of purchasing a Railcard in order to legitimately help me reduce my travel costs in the future. <-- removed as you've bought a railcard

I will pay any outstanding train fare plus administration fees that have occurred. <-- you are not in a position to tell them what you are willing to pay, it's on them to offer you a settlement.

I am very concerned that my foolishness in this matter will have a disproportionate effect on affect my future employment, and I offer hope my full cooperation in getting towards resolving this the situation settled is favourable. I would be very grateful if you would consider allowing me to settle this matter out of court. I am willing to pay whatever costs GTR has incurred as a result of my actions. My Journey was from Crayford Station to Brighton Station.

Yours faithfully,

Firstname Lastname


That's a lot of editing. It also needs a line about how it's not going to happen again and a few other edits and additions to help it flow better. So let's add those and look at the final version.


Reference: xxxxx

Dear Fares Evasion Manager,

I would like to start by offering my sincerest apologies for the incident of travelling on the railway without a valid ticket. It was a very foolish act and I accept total responsibility for my actions. I have since come to understand how this affects the rail industry as a whole and have purchased a railcard to help with my travel costs - [railcard type and number].

I am very concerned that my foolishness in the is matter will affect my future employment, and I would be very grateful if you would consider allowing me to settle this matter out of court. I offer my full cooperation towards resolving the situation and offer to pay the fare I avoided for my journey (from Crayford to Brighton), as well as any costs GTR has incurred as a result of my actions. I hope this, and the purchase of the railcard show that I am determined to not let this situation reoccur.

Yours faithfully,

Firstname Lastname

 

[John R]

I wouldn’t use the word “willing”, as it’s not really up to the writer. GTR will decide what offer to make, so the penultimate sentence is redundant. I’d also put details of the journey earlier - it feels rather odd coming right at the end.

 

[antharro]

Quite right @Brissle Girl . That's the same advice I give out but apparently forgot to apply in this case. Also yes the journey details were odd at the end there. I've given it a re-work; previous post edited.

 

[LP1]

Hi, Just want to start by saying thank you to all that have helped my son put this together. I know it has to be to the point and not a sob story, so any comments on this draft would be greatly appreciated.




Dear Fares Evasion Officer

I would like to start by offering my sincerest apologies for the incident of travelling on the railway without a valid ticket from Crayford to Brighton Station. It was a very foolish act and I accept total responsibility for my actions. I have since come to understand how this affects the rail industry as a whole. I have now purchased a Railcard ref: _________in order to help with my travel costs.

I am very concerned that my foolishness in this matter will affect my future employment, and I would be very grateful if you would consider allowing me to settle this matter out of court. I offer my full cooperation towards resolving the situation and offer to pay the fare I avoided for my journey (from Crayford to Brighton), as well as any costs GTR has incurred as a result of my actions. I hope this, and the purchase of the railcard show that I am determined to not let this situation reoccur.

Yours faithfully …

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Hi, Just want to start by saying thank you to all that have helped my son put this together. I know it has to be to the point and not a sob story, so any comments on this draft would be greatly appreciated.




Dear Fares Evasion Officer

I would like to start by offering my sincerest apologies for the incident of travelling on the railway without a valid ticket from Crayford to Brighton Station. It was a very foolish act and I accept total responsibility for my actions. I have since come to understand how this affects the rail industry as a whole. I have now purchased a Railcard ref: _________in order to help with my travel costs.

I am very concerned that my foolishness in this matter will affect my future employment, and I would be very grateful if you would consider allowing me to settle this matter out of court. I offer my full cooperation towards resolving the situation and offer to pay the fare I avoided for my journey (from Crayford to Brighton), as well as any costs GTR has incurred as a result of my actions. I hope this, and the purchase of the railcard show that I am determined to not let this situation reoccur.

Yours faithfully …

I think that this letter as written should work, and GTR will agree to settling out of court.

I suspect that it won't make any difference to whether GTR accept or not, but strictly it's not for your son to offer a settlement - it's up to the railway to decide if they're prepared to offer one (where they set the amount) in exchange for not prosecuting. So rather than your son saying that they 'offer to pay the fare (...) as well as any costs' the ideal wording would be something like 'would be grateful if you would allow me to pay the fare (etc.)'.

 

[Haywain]

and offer to pay the fare I avoided for my journey (from Crayford to Brighton), as well as any costs GTR has incurred as a result of my actions

I would change 'offer' to 'would appreciate the opportunity'.

 

[LP1]

I would change 'offer' to 'would appreciate the opportunity'.

noted thank you

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Jun 2024 ==

I think that this letter as written should work, and GTR will agree to settling out of court.

I suspect that it won't make any difference to whether GTR accept or not, but strictly it's not for your son to offer a settlement - it's up to the railway to decide if they're prepared to offer one (where they set the amount) in exchange for not prosecuting. So rather than your son saying that they 'offer to pay the fare (...) as well as any costs' the ideal wording would be something like 'would be grateful if you would allow me to pay the fare (etc.)'.

i will get him to amend thank you