Great Northern Fleet - 379s introduction

[trentbartonfan]

Platform 2 (Up Slow 1) at Alexandra Palace has now been cleared for 379s to pass through but not yet to stop at!

Could it be something to do with the doors? Sounds silly but that’s the only other thing I could think of.

 

[Robski]

It looks like all of the Letchworth class 379 diagrams have gone back to 700/0 operation.

 

[St. Paddy]

Could it be something to do with the doors? Sounds silly but that’s the only other thing I could think of.

May not have been checked yet, they seem to be concentrating on the Fenline currently

 

[jon0844]

Could it be something to do with the doors? Sounds silly but that’s the only other thing I could think of.

Could well be. They'll be needing to test the station lighting at night for every platform, whereby someone in black stands by each door to check if they can be seen. Perhaps this test (and others) wasn't done because of the platform issue.

 

[Fincra5]

Could it be something to do with the doors? Sounds silly but that’s the only other thing I could think of.

They platform needs the tests it wasn't able to have done before... Lighting, SDO, etc.

 

[trentbartonfan]

Could well be. They'll be needing to test the station lighting at night for every platform, whereby someone in black stands by each door to check if they can be seen. Perhaps this test (and others) wasn't done because of the platform issue.

Makes sense.

Is there any other platforms 379s need to be cleared for, or was it just the platforms at Ally Pally that meant that these tests couldn’t be done earlier?

 

[St. Paddy]

Makes sense.

Is there any other platforms 379s need to be cleared for, or was it just the platforms at Ally Pally that meant that these tests couldn’t be done earlier?

Platform 0 at Kings Cross is currently prohibited

 

[Intercity_225]

Some 379 testing tonight around Kings Cross & Hornsey Depot.

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 1912 Hornsey E.M.U.D. to London Kings Cross | 23/04/2025

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 1912 departure from Hornsey E.M.U.D. to London Kings Cross on 23/04/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[PointA Rail]

Some 379 testing tonight around Kings Cross & Hornsey Depot.

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 1912 Hornsey E.M.U.D. to London Kings Cross | 23/04/2025

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 1912 departure from Hornsey E.M.U.D. to London Kings Cross on 23/04/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Darn! I saw that set while passing Finsbury Park on the way home, and I was wondering what it was doing out so late!

 

[50002Superb]

I think that it is these trains, but stand to be corrected if I am wrong.

1Q85 0635 Peterborough to London Kings Cross
1Q09 0745 Letchworth to London Kings Cross
1Q11 0817 Letchworth to London Kings Cross

1P82 1642 London Kings Cross to Peterborough
1L48 1724 London Kings Cross to Letchworth
1L50 1754 London Kings Cross to Letchworth

Are they likely to increase the number of diagrams with the May timetable?

 

[LA50041]

Are they likely to increase the number of diagrams with the May timetable?

The 379 implementation and subsequent cascade is severely delayed at the moment. There should have been 6 more units in service a couple of weeks ago releasing 387's but this didn't happen

 

[Robski]

Are they likely to increase the number of diagrams with the May timetable?

There aren't any more self contained diagrams to put them on (I think) - the remaining peak services interwork with other service groups or are booked 12 coaches. Additional diagrams would require a sufficient number of drivers trained across the GN network to avoid situations where the train is stuck as the relieving driver doesn't sign 379's yet.

 

[50002Superb]

Understood chaps, thank you

 

[TSGN Spotter]

379017/010 are both in lynn cs replacing the previously based units

 

[St. Paddy]

There aren't any more self contained diagrams to put them on (I think) - the remaining peak services interwork with other service groups or are booked 12 coaches. Additional diagrams would require a sufficient number of drivers trained across the GN network to avoid situations where the train is stuck as the relieving driver doesn't sign 379's yet.

Driver training is virtually complete, it’s unit issues with SDO and PIS that’s preventing any expansion. They’re diagrammed for Kings Lynn from the May timetable change but until they’re cleared for the route, it will remain 387s

 

[TSGN Spotter]

379010 379017 in lynn cs

 

[Failed Unit]

Driver training is virtually complete, it’s unit issues with SDO and PIS that’s preventing any expansion. They’re diagrammed for Kings Lynn from the May timetable change but until they’re cleared for the route, it will remain 387s

Are there not lots ofd diagrams that don’t need SDO?

 

[St. Paddy]

Are there not lots ofd diagrams that don’t need SDO?

All the Cambridge stoppers and Kings Lynn services need it and they make up most of the work for the fleet

 

[Failed Unit]

All the Cambridge stoppers and Kings Lynn services need it and they make up most of the work for the fleet

Thanks, I have never travelled north of Cambridge, but do remember now that Waterbeach is a short platform, so keeping them on Ely - King Cross - Letchworth - Kings Cross - Ely diagrams won't work. Did the 379s never have SDO? Again I know they on Greater Anglia they would have no need unless they went to Kings Lynn as 8 cars (I am sure someone said if they did the rear unit was locked out of use at Cambridge anyway)

 

[Magdalia]

I have never travelled north of Cambridge, but do remember now that Waterbeach is a short platform

Waterbeach has 8 car platforms.

keeping them on Ely - King Cross - Letchworth - Kings Cross - Ely diagrams won't work.

There are no such diagrams. Off peak the Elys interwork with the Cambridges and the Kings Lynns interwork with the Letchworths.

In the peak all the fasts run to/from Kings Lynn and all the stoppers run to/from Cambridge, so they all need SDO.

 

[Failed Unit]

Waterbeach has 8 car platforms.


There are no such diagrams. Off peak the Elys interwork with the Cambridges and the Kings Lynns interwork with the Letchworths.

In the peak all the fasts run to/from Kings Lynn and all the stoppers run to/from Cambridge, so they all need SDO.

Good point, I should have known remembered I use the prefer to use the Letchworth services over the Cambridge because the interwork with the Kings Lynn so are very unlikely to be a class 700. Thank you. Hopefully it will be sorted out soon. Although my main hope is it reduces the number of 700s on the route. Although the 379s are slightly more comfortable, not enough to care if the offer is just a straight swap with 387.

 

[Sutton in Ant]

I have just found this move on Tuesday 6th May https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:K32629/2025-05-06/detailed. I wonder if it is more 379s coming down from Worksop?

 

[PointA Rail]

I have just found this move on Tuesday 6th May https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:K32629/2025-05-06/detailed. I wonder if it is more 379s coming down from Worksop?

It's best to keep an eye on it!
Possibly just because there was no 379 ready at the time, but last week that move was also listed, however it was cancelled about an hour after it should have left.
I don't know how many 379s are at Worksop, but if it does run then it certainly would be one.

This one https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C43209/2025-05-06/detailed is usually a good indication of whether the drag will happen or not.

ASIDE:
This is also listed the day before: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C42696/2025-05-05/detailed
Are any 379s being refreshed/under maintainance at Derby?

 

[windjabbers]

It's best to keep an eye on it!
Possibly just because there was no 379 ready at the time, but last week that move was also listed, however it was cancelled about an hour after it should have left.
I don't know how many 379s are at Worksop, but if it does run then it certainly would be one.

This one https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C43209/2025-05-06/detailed is usually a good indication of whether the drag will happen or not.

ASIDE:
This is also listed the day before: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C42696/2025-05-05/detailed
Are any 379s being refreshed/under maintainance at Derby?

i believe that there are 12 units still at Worksop - 003/005/007/008/009/011/012/013/014/015/018/030. BW DC

 

[whoosh]

With regard to Selective Door Opening - I forget the name of the system 387s use, but basically there is a database of locations and GPS is used. However, at certain platforms which are less restrictive, (e.g. the down platforms at Shepreth and Foxton are 8 cars, whereas the Up platforms there are 4 cars) a balise is fitted which communicates to the train the less restrictive information for that platform.

379s have SDO but are in the process of being fitted with the system which uses the balises. Once all fitted, they will be able to operate with SDO just like 387s do.

Until then though, they are only restricted to certain stations.

 

[Royston Vasey]

With regard to Selective Door Opening - I forget the name of the system 387s use, but basically there is a database of locations and GPS is used. However, at certain platforms which are less restrictive, (e.g. the down platforms at Shepreth and Foxton are 8 cars, whereas the Up platforms there are 4 cars) a balise is fitted which communicates to the train the less restrictive information for that platform.

379s have SDO but are in the process of being fitted with the system which uses the balises. Once all fitted, they will be able to operate with SDO just like 387s do.

Until then though, they are only restricted to certain stations.

The 387s still announce short down platforms at Shepreth and Foxton, and to be in the rear four cars, when they were in fact extended years ago and all doors do indeed open. I would say this is the majority of services, if not all!

 

[St. Paddy]

The 387s still announce short down platforms at Shepreth and Foxton, and to be in the rear four cars, when they were in fact extended years ago and all doors do indeed open. I would say this is the majority of services, if not all!

Because the database isn’t smart enough to have different platform lengths for different directions, hence the need for balises mentioned above. These are just as you enter the platform so until then, the train believes it can only release doors on 4 coaches

 

[Kite159]

Because the database isn’t smart enough to have different platform lengths for different directions, hence the need for balises mentioned above. These are just as you enter the platform so until then, the train believes it can only release doors on 4 coaches

Similar to the system used on the South Eastern 375s when it's a 12 coach set heading into Victoria. Announcements default to the shortest platform

 

[Royston Vasey]

Because the database isn’t smart enough to have different platform lengths for different directions, hence the need for balises mentioned above. These are just as you enter the platform so until then, the train believes it can only release doors on 4 coaches

That explains that, cheers.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 May 2025 ==

With regard to Selective Door Opening - I forget the name of the system 387s use, but basically there is a database of locations and GPS is used. However, at certain platforms which are less restrictive, (e.g. the down platforms at Shepreth and Foxton are 8 cars, whereas the Up platforms there are 4 cars) a balise is fitted which communicates to the train the less restrictive information for that platform.

379s have SDO but are in the process of being fitted with the system which uses the balises. Once all fitted, they will be able to operate with SDO just like 387s do.

Until then though, they are only restricted to certain stations.

Sounds like the 379s will be retrofitted with the same issue!

 

[Fincra5]

With regard to Selective Door Opening - I forget the name of the system 387s use, but basically there is a database of locations and GPS is used. However, at certain platforms which are less restrictive, (e.g. the down platforms at Shepreth and Foxton are 8 cars, whereas the Up platforms there are 4 cars) a balise is fitted which communicates to the train the less restrictive information for that platform.

379s have SDO but are in the process of being fitted with the system which uses the balises. Once all fitted, they will be able to operate with SDO just like 387s do.

Until then though, they are only restricted to certain stations.

Tracklink 3. So far the testing has gone well on the TL3 system on 379s. So will be phased to update the 379 fleet.
MITRAC SDO is GPS based, within an area of the station, hence why it cannot do doors per platform length (where mixed) or announce separetly. This makes Tracklink 3 a requiredment.
It's nothing new... 377s have been using Tracklink 2 for years.
Even the new 720s need a Baliase for stations!