Graffiti to Trains

[Y961 XBU]

Yesterday i saw 2 Merseyrail Trains in service with a lot of Graffiti around the outside of it, never saw this before, does it happen regular elsewhere?

I will try to upload a photo of one of the Damaged units later

 

[455driver]

It does happen but the TOCs try to remove it as soon as possible.
I think the morons that do it have realised that their 'art' will only last a few hours and wont be seen by many so they tend to go elsewhere to 'express' themselves.

 

[306024]

I will try to upload a photo of one of the Damaged units later

And give the 'artist' the publicity they crave? Those of us that see graffiti as vandalism and nothing more would prefer you didn't, but it's your call.

 

[Merseysider]

Yesterday i saw 2 Merseyrail Trains in service with a lot of Graffiti around the outside of it, never saw this before, does it happen regular elsewhere?

I will try to upload a photo of one of the Damaged units later

It used to be fairly common a couple of years ago to see the Merseyrail livery coated in some idiot's initials. Trains standing outside Birkenhead North depot would be easy targets for some of the local hooligans.

I've never seen a vandalised TPE, EMT or Northern train though, and that's about all else I get in my neck of the woods.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Isn't Bellingham on the Catford loop notorious for it?

 

[Crossover]

I saw a First Hull Trains set with one side of one of the Driving Motors covered in it at Doncaster last Monday

 

[prod_pep]

Rock Ferry is a particular hotspot on the Merseyrail network. There is a lot of graffiti on the lineside around the station and in the summer units are regularly 'tagged' there.

The problems with graffiti on Thameslink are well documented on this forum, but FCC's Great Northern 313s and AGA's 315s also seem to be badly affected.

 

[Oscar]

Yesterday i saw 2 Merseyrail Trains in service with a lot of Graffiti around the outside of it, never saw this before, does it happen regular elsewhere?

Yes, in and around London and many other big cities around the world.

 

[Titfield]

and of course Graffiti is praised by the BBC and the Art World in general this encouraging its perpetration.

 

[FQ]

EMT or Northern train though, and that's about all else I get in my neck of the woods.

I have once seen a vandalised HST in EMT.

But to be fair Chiltern seem to be really good at getting rid of it, as I have never seen anything chiltern with graffiti.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Chiltern stock does get graffitied, but it's out of service as soon as it happens. Trains can be cleaned fairly quickly with a jet washer so it's not like they are out of action for long if it's near any place fitters can be found.

I read something a while back about how Randolph Giuliani (mayor of New York when 9/11 happened) cleaned up the New York subway back in the 1980s. One of the first things he did was cancel a train immediately if it had graffiti on it. I'm sure everybody has seen movies set in NYC in the 70s and 80s where the subway was covered in graffiti and seen as a virtual no go area. It seemed that if you cleaned it up then it would attract the element you wanted and deter the element you don't. I think the policies undoubted success has led it to be copied worldwide.

wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory

 

[W-on-Sea]

Saw graffiti on the London Midland 153 on the Coventry-Nuneaton shuttle a few weekends ago: but in general the policy used by most operators now seems to be to clean it off before putting a train into service - it was a lot worse 20 or 25 years ago, at least as regards trains actually in service.

 

[Hornet]

Yes, in and around London and many other big cities around the world.

Some Italian rolling stock vandalism would make you weep.

 

[CC 72100]

Some Italian rolling stock vandalism would make you weep.

Paris is bad compared to the UK, however the pictures of Italy show an even worse situation. To be honest, limiting graffiti and its exposure is something we're actually quite good at!

 

[DarloRich]

and of course Graffiti is praised by the BBC and the Art World in general this encouraging its perpetration.

but it is a form of art - just because you dont like it doesn't make it any less valid as a form of artistic expression.

Now, clearly spraying it on anothers property and therefore damaging that property is both potentially criminal and wrong.

 

[Fincra5]

Tagging, IMO, is not an art form... that tribute to Roger Lloyd as Trigger on the 377 was good, could be artistic but Tagging just isn't. Southern are quite good at getting rid of it.

 

[DarloRich]

Tagging, IMO, is not an art form... that tribute to Roger Lloyd as Trigger on the 377 was good, could be artistic but Tagging just isn't. Southern are quite good at getting rid of it.

why isn't it art? I am interested what defines art and who makes that decision. Don't get me wrong i dont like it myself but dont dismiss it out of hand.

 

[fowler9]

Some Italian rolling stock vandalism would make you weep.

Indeed. Getting a coach in to Venice and seeing a train passing us on the causeway made me think I was heading in to 70's New York.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

why isn't it art? I am interested what defines art and who makes that decision.

I don't know, I think graffiti is often art, tagging often isn't. There is a crossover though. Doing it on someone elses property without their permission is a bit naughty.

 

[Stonesourscotty]

Worse places for Graffiti are The Netherlands Queensland Rail and Sydney although a special mention for Paris on the rer and metro to. Melbourne is quite bad with Internal Graffiti especially the areas near the ends of the units but externally not to bad

 

[starrymarkb]

SNCF TER units around Nice were very badly done. Every surface inside and out was tagged and on more then one unit the only bit that had been cleaned was a porthole for the driver to see out the windscreen

 

[BestWestern]

But it is a form of art - just because you dont like it doesn't make it any less valid as a form of artistic expression.

Now, clearly spraying it on anothers property and therefore damaging that property is both potentially criminal and wrong.

Why is it 'art'? Because it involves paint?! 'Art' has diversified extensively in recent generations to include all sorts of bollox way beyond just painting stuff. So if we're not to dismiss random yob efforts, presumably I could come to your house and express myself by taking a sh*t on your lounge floor and that would be just fine so long as I passionately defend it as art? Or perhaps I could scratch my initials into your car door for the same reason?!

Scrawling illegible rubbish onto other people's property is not art, it is vandalism. There will always be a clear distinction to most right minded people. It has little to do with 'expressionism' and is simply the human equivalent of a dog marking it's territory. A rather apt comparison as it happens.

 

[Fincra5]

why isn't it art? I am interested what defines art and who makes that decision. Don't get me wrong i dont like it myself but dont dismiss it out of hand.

Yes, yes... I'll agree that art is very subjective.. as I said, I don't see tagging as Art but some Graffiti can be...

 

[Clip]

Why is it 'art'? Because it involves paint?! 'Art' has diversified extensively in recent generations to include all sorts of bollox way beyond just painting stuff. So if we're not to dismiss random yob efforts, presumably I could come to your house and express myself by taking a sh*t on your lounge floor and that would be just fine so long as I passionately defend it as art? Or perhaps I could scratch my initials into your car door for the same reason?!

Scrawling illegible rubbish onto other people's property is not art, it is vandalism. There will always be a clear distinction to most right minded people. It has little to do with 'expressionism' and is simply the human equivalent of a dog marking it's territory. A rather apt comparison as it happens.

You have totally missed his point and his subsequent line of ' doing it on others property is wrong'.

But yes, it is art. In fact some of the graf out there is visually stunning and takes a lot of skill and time and efoort to do.

 

[GatwickDepress]

This RailUK Forums edition of the South Bank Show aside, I have noticed a lot less graffiti on trains in the past year or so then in say, 2007 or 2008. Has security and train presentation been given more focus, or has graffiti-spraying been superseded in some quarters by another activity?

I note infrastructure still has just as much though, and the majority couldn't be considered pretty by anyone - just a bare squiggle. I can do that too mate. It's called signing my name.

 

[FQ]

I know it isn't to do with trains but about a month ago, I caught one of my friends graffiting a canal bridge and he called me over and told me to do it. I said no and walked off, and we haven't spoken since, although I keep on seeing more graffiti on that bridge each time I walk under it.

 

[table38]

I've always wondered where do they get the paint from?

Perhaps we'd better not say on here, but I've always assumed that if I walked into Halfords to buy 50 cans of paint all different colours, they might be a bit suspicious...

Maybe they should put smart water in the paint, then we'd know who bought it!

 

[BurtonM]

I haven't seen any in a long time, really - the only time I really did was in London, when both C Stocks and slamdoors were still running, and Tox was a problem.
When a train has a huge, well done tag down the side I'll admit I do quite like it, but little scrawlings (such as Tox-08 etc) aren't that pleasant. I suppose graffiti is something of a modern equivalent to the dirty buildings of the '70s and '80s: if you notice, graffiti started to appear more as all the smog was cleaned off the buildings: it's almost as if modernisation was just giving people a literal blank canvas.
I also preferred the buildings dirty...
(I did see some graffiti on a Northern 156 the other week).

 

[CC 72100]

Worse places for Graffiti are The Netherlands Queensland Rail and Sydney although a special mention for Paris on the rer and metro to.

Special mention on the RER must go the bloke on the RER A who took a permanent marker to several trains, writing a speech about why he doesn't like the new trains and wants to keep the old MI84 trains...

https://twitter.com/ElBricou/status/300495103477284864

http://www.blogencommun.fr/2013-08-encore-des-degradations-et-des-menaces-dans-le-rer-a/

I believe the bloke has now been stopped, but it can serve as an example to when rail enthusiasts go extreme :roll:

 

[table38]

when rail enthusiasts go extreme

You should pitch that to Channel 5 for a new series

 

[RPM]

But to be fair Chiltern seem to be really good at getting rid of it, as I have never seen anything chiltern with graffiti.

If you scrutinize the Chiltern fleet closely you will see a lot of evidence of past graffiti attacks in the form of missing vinyl elements on the livery (things like the red stripe, blue to white fading on the doors etc). The graffiti removal process damages the vinyl and Chiltern don't have much of a facility to replace them in house.