GOT CAUGHT USING 11-15 OYSTER. HELP!!

[r4miii]

an update, after sending in my plea i got a letter where they want me to go to court. what can be the reason for this? why do i need to go to court if i said i didnt want to?

 

[Gloster]

an update, after sending in my plea i got a letter where they want me to go to court. what can be the reason for this? why do i need to go to court if i said i didnt want to?

They make the decisions, not you. If they considered that your offence was sufficient to justify the matter going to court, it goes to court, whether you like it or not. That is the nature of the law.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

an update, after sending in my plea i got a letter where they want me to go to court. what can be the reason for this? why do i need to go to court if i said i didnt want to?

If you can show us the exact letter, we can make some specific comments (for long term contributors - we need to see whether OP is being called for TICs, or whether this is a summons or an SJPN). But very briefly, it's not you who decides if you need to go to court: it's up to the prosecutors (i.e. TfL) to decide if they need you there. And so far, it looks as if they need you to be there, so you will need to go.

 

[AlterEgo]

an update, after sending in my plea i got a letter where they want me to go to court. what can be the reason for this? why do i need to go to court if i said i didnt want to?

Please post the letter with your details redacted. It's likely they have detected other offences (ie: more than just the one where you were stopped) and want these taken into consideration so you can be sentenced for the totality of the offending in one sitting. If that is the case, you will need to actually attend the court to confirm and admit to those offences, and it cannot all be done "on paper". You must attend, as the defendant, if that is the case.

We will need to see the paperwork to be sure, of course.

 

[ohnoes]

an update, after sending in my plea i got a letter where they want me to go to court. what can be the reason for this? why do i need to go to court if i said i didnt want to?

Generally, when someone breaks the law and is caught, saying you “dont want” to go to court doesn’t work. You asked them to settle out of court and TfL said no.

 

[island]

an update, after sending in my plea i got a letter where they want me to go to court. what can be the reason for this? why do i need to go to court if i said i didnt want to?

You don't get to choose whether you go to court or not when you break the law.

Please post up the letter in full (all pages, covering any personal info) and we will advise further.

 

[WesternLancer]

Generally, when someone breaks the law and is caught, saying you “dont want” to go to court doesn’t work. You asked them to settle out of court and TfL said no.

I'm thinking the OP was expecting / hoping to go through the SJPN - it's a v long thread this one (longest in disputes section?) but I have a feeling this was discussed at some point back in the thread and it may have been suggested to the OP that SJPN option was a distinct option for how they would be dealt with if a settlement offer was not forthcoming, so in fairness to @r4miii they may have been expecting that.

 

[r4miii]

n

Generally, when someone breaks the law and is caught, saying you “dont want” to go to court doesn’t work. You asked them to settle out of court and TfL said no.

no. it asked on the letter do you want to attend court or not, in some circumstances they will ask you to come. which they did. im just asking what the reason can be for this

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I'm thinking the OP was expecting / hoping to go through the SJPN - it's a v long thread this one (longest in disputes section?) but I have a feeling this was discussed at some point back in the thread and it may have been suggested to the OP that SJPN option was a distinct option for how they would be dealt with if a settlement offer was not forthcoming, so in fairness to @r4miii they may have been expecting that.

sorry i still dont understand. what can reasons be for them to want you to attend court after i sent my plea?

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What I want to know is possible reasons it cannot be dealt with through sjpn

 

[najaB]

sorry i still dont understand. what can reasons be for them to want you to attend court after i sent my plea?

Because there are facts that they don't feel have been adequately explained in your previous correspondence.

 

[Wolfie]

A few months ago, I had to go to court because i was caught using my siblings discounted oyster card. However despite being convicted my enhanced dbs is still clear so I didnt tell my university about my conviction despite studying a health care course at uni. Universities use dbs checks to check for convictions and since my dbs is clear there was no need in disclosing it

If the uni find out they are likely to regard the failure to disclose as equally, if not more, serious than the original offence.

 

[r4miii]

A few months ago, I had to go to court because i was caught using my siblings discounted oyster card. However despite being convicted my enhanced dbs is still clear so I didnt tell my university about my conviction despite studying a health care course at uni. Universities use dbs checks to check for convictions and since my dbs is clear there was no need in disclosing it

so you did your dbs yoursef im assuming? or did the uni do it

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Because there are facts that they don't feel have been adequately explained in your previous correspondence.

oh, what negative effect can this have that i need to attend court now? is there any?

 

[AlterEgo]

Is that all the paperwork you have been sent? Have you witheld any factual information from your correspondence with them, and have they at any stage indicated they have detected other offences?

 

[r4miii]

Is that all the paperwork you have been sent? Have you witheld any factual information from your correspondence with them, and have they at any stage indicated they have detected other offences?

after the sjpn this is all they sent if thats what you mean

 

[AlterEgo]

I don't think we have seen a SJPN case from TfL being dealt with by summons before, but you must attend.

It is possible the court want a chance to examine the mitigation you sent because they are not satisfied with it, but there could be other reasons too.

 

[swt_passenger]

Is that all the paperwork you have been sent? Have you witheld any factual information from your correspondence with them, and have they at any stage indicated they have detected other offences?

It’s 112 other offences, as shown on the form uploaded in post #273. As others have suggested, if TFl want 112 offences taken into consideration that presumably requires attendance at the magistrate's court.

 

[AlterEgo]

It’s 112 other offences, as shown on the form uploaded in post #273. As others have suggested, if TFl want 112 offences taken into consideration that presumably requires attendance at the magistrate's court.

But they don't seem to be asking to have these taken into consideration, as per later posts.

 

[r4miii]

It’s 112 other offences, as shown on the form uploaded in post #273. As others have suggested, if TFl want 112 offences taken into consideration that presumably requires attendance at the magistrate's court.

But someone mentioned they’re not charging me for those since the other costs of fines showed £0.00. Either way I mentioned in my plea that I investigated why I was being accused of 112 other offences from tfl who have told me that tfl has up to 3 months of data of the oyster used to show the travels made. And when your caught they accuse you automatically by assuming you made all the journeys in the last 3 months by fare evasion. Which I didn’t and stated in my plea

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I don't think we have seen a SJPN case from TfL being dealt with by summons before, but you must attend.

It is possible the court want a chance to examine the mitigation you sent because they are not satisfied with it, but there could be other reasons too.

Oh no, starting to worry as I can’t seem to find other threads like this either for advice

 

[skyhigh]

But someone mentioned they’re not charging me for those since the other costs of fines showed £0.00. Either way I mentioned in my plea that I investigated why I was being accused of 112 other offences from tfl who have told me that tfl has up to 3 months of data of the oyster used to show the travels made. And when your caught they accuse you automatically by assuming you made all the journeys in the last 3 months by fare evasion. Which I didn’t and stated in my plea

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Oh no, starting to worry as I can’t seem to find other threads like this either for advice

What, exactly, did you write on the SJPN?

It sounds like they have considered that although you pleaded Guilty on the form you provided mitigation that made it sound as if you weren't pleading Guilty, so they have summoned you to appear instead.

 

[Pushpit]

so you did your dbs yoursef im assuming? or did the uni do it


oh, what negative effect can this have that i need to attend court now? is there any?

There are 3 main types of DBS. For the Standard DBS, the Uni will normally have a relationship with a processing agency, but some deal directly with the core DBS agency. You will get a form from the university or the sponsor employer, typically an NHS body. You fill it in, and either there or on a separate form you are asked if you have any convictions or cautions. You return this to the Uni, who in turn sends it to their agency, Umbrella Body or DBS. DBS then write to you with your certificate, which will show relevant convictions, you finally take that DBS certificate the university and in some cases the NHS body that sponsors your course. So the uni doesn't get the certificate directly, but they are told when the certificate is sent out.

Enhanced DBS is similar but they can take police records, not just convictions. But at all levels there is a relevancy test depending on your precise role. So a more admin role with supervision they aren't going to mention a caution for smoking weed at a festival. But if dispensing controlled medicines then you have to be really squeaky clean - that's tougher than being a GP.

 

[r4miii]

What, exactly, did you write on the SJPN?

It sounds like they have considered that although you pleaded Guilty on the form you provided mitigation that made it sound as if you weren't pleading Guilty, so they have summoned you to appear instead.

I clearly stated at the start and end that I recognise I committed the offence

 

[notmyrealname]

Is that everything you said on the form? If there's more, I think the experts were rather hoping to see it in order to give you the best advice.

 

[AlterEgo]

I clearly stated at the start and end that I recognise I committed the offence

What else did you write? if you write a long spiel of mitigation on the SJPN which could be read as in fact trying to form a defence for the offence, the magistrate may reject your plea if they infer from what you write that you don't actually believe you are guilty. This is because they deal with a lot of people who cannot articulate themselves very well.

 

[r4miii]

Is that everything you said on the form? If there's more, I think the experts were rather hoping to see it in order to give you the best advice.

What do you mean on which form?

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What else did you write? if you write a long spiel of mitigation on the SJPN which could be read as in fact trying to form a defence for the offence, the magistrate may reject your plea if they infer from what you write that you don't actually believe you are guilty. This is because they deal with a lot of people who cannot articulate themselves very well.

I didn’t write much about the mitigation I wrote more about the fact I have learnt my lesson and realise how serious it is etc.

I called them they said they want to discuss my mitigation with my further.

 

[simonw]

What do you mean on which form?

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I didn’t write much about the mitigation I wrote more about the fact I have learnt my lesson and realise how serious it is etc.

I called them they said they want to discuss my mitigation with my further.

Did you keep a copy of what you wrote that you could post here?

 

[AlterEgo]

I called them they said they want to discuss my mitigation with my further.

Well, that could go one of two ways with you. Either they are hoping to cross examine your mitigation in your favour to reduce any sentence they decide to give, or they believe you have not been fully truthful in your submissions so far. It's impossible to say.

Did you keep a copy of what you wrote?

 

[r4miii]

Well, that could go one of two ways with you. Either they are hoping to cross examine your mitigation in your favour to reduce any sentence they decide to give, or they believe you have not been fully truthful in your submissions so far. It's impossible to say.

Did you keep a copy of what you wrote?

I do have a copy yes

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Did you keep a copy of what you wrote that you could post here?

I do , but it has some private circumstances in there my apologies

 

[greyman42]

sorry i still dont understand. what can reasons be for them to want you to attend court after i sent my plea?

Possibly as a punishment for you and a deterrent for others.

 

[simonw]

I do have a copy yes

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I do , but it has some private circumstances in there my apologies

Well it's difficult for people to advise as to why they may have called you in if you don't share a redacted version of what you sent.

 

[AlterEgo]

I do , but it has some private circumstances in there my apologies

Then we are unable to give any advice. You will need to attend court anyway regardless.

 

[r4miii]

Well it's difficult for people to advise as to why they may have called you in if you don't share a redacted version of what you sent.

I’ve found out already , as mentioned after I asked

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Then we are unable to give any advice. You will need to attend court anyway regardless.

It’s fine I just wanted to know why they took it to court which I found out as said above

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Possibly as a punishment for you and a deterrent for others.

Probably