GorillaBus - new coach service

[Mojo]

The timetable on the East Midlands Airport website says the coach from Birmingham to Liverpool is at 14.00, whereas the GorillaBus booking engine says 14.15.

 

[anthony263]

The timetable on the East Midlands Airport website says the coach from Birmingham to Liverpool is at 14.00, whereas the GorillaBus booking engine says 14.15.

Someone needs to have a look at that.

As for promoting it.

Eurolines have started a service from London to Ireland via Bristol, Cardiff etc, they had a coach with photographer taking shots in Cardiff yesterday. That said there was an issue with the photographers 1 of whom was crouched down in the middle of road trying to get a snap (Certain bus driver didnt like that) no high vis on any of them.

Seems Megbus have got some competition.

I do agree that perhaps this gorrila bus might be genuine but after the whole inccident with Dash coaches i can understand why people are being careful, however would a fraudulant company go through all this trouble registering on various forums etc.

That said i do think getting some picture, artical in the local press and perhaps 1 of the bus magazines would be a good idea and should hopefully settle the doubters

 

[Mojo]

Does this service only operate when someone has a reservation? I just stood in the vicinity of the Birmingham stop for 30 Min for the 14.15 departure and no bus showed up.

 

[northwichcat]

Does this service only operate when someone has a reservation? I just stood in the vicinity of the Birmingham stop for 30 Min for the 14.15 departure and no bus showed up.

It does say on the website that you can't pay on board as they might not run a service if no-one is booked on it. That's actual similar to what National Express do with some of the less well utilised stops, if no-one's booked they bypass them.

 

[Steve Elms]

Mojo, the service is scheduled to lay over in Birmingham for fifteen minutes. The timetable on the EMA site is designed for customers travelling to and from there, so the arrival time in Birmingham, 1400, is shown on that timetable. The time shown on the booking engine, 1415, is the time the service departs for Liverpool. It has been mentioned several times that the service only operates for pre-booked customers, including at the bottom of the timetable on the EMA website. I do understand your concerns over marketing, but my personal experience is that conventional advertising simply doesn't work, we have used primarily online means, and it is working for us - clearly if it wasn't, we wouldn't have a business. I would hope that you would appreciate that, solely for commercial reasons, it would not be prudent to post who we have targetted and exactly how, but suffice to say that, if our methods were not working for us, we'd change them. I accept that there may be a downside in that we are not as prolific as some operators in certain media, but, speaking personally, does having a picture in enthusiast and trade magazines actually reach many, or any, potential customers? I would argue probably not - I've responded on several forums, and the number of members who have actually suggested that the service would be useful for them is very small indeed. The question for us is, who would use a service like this, and how do we communicate with them? Remember that this is a business, if we weren't carrying anyone, we'd be doing something about it very quickly. I completely understand concerns over Dash, and DodgyAir, but really, how many other ways can I say that your payments are totally secure and refundable through PayPal, so if we didn't turn up, what could we possibly gain? Thanks for the comments about journey times, during this phase while we are offering pre-booked only, there is a lot of flexibility in improving journey time, but we will be reviewing these things in a few weeks, with a view to speeding up those sections that are proving popular.

 

[Deerfold]

It does say on the website that you can't pay on board as they might not run a service if no-one is booked on it. That's actual similar to what National Express do with some of the less well utilised stops, if no-one's booked they bypass them.

True - I did a few Nottingham - Cambridge runs on NX when I was a student and we never went into Grantham which was a booked stop (there was the 90 minutes we spent just outside Grantham when we broke done once though).

 

[Mojo]

It has been mentioned several times that the service only operates for pre-booked customers, including at the bottom of the timetable on the EMA website.

Thank you, but that wasn't the question I asked. I went to your stop in Birmingham without having a reservation and nothing turned up. Is it the case that services don't run/stop if nobody is booked on them. Is this a regular occurrence and can you advise when a service will next be visiting Birmingham?

I do understand your concerns over marketing

I haven't expressed any concerns about your marketing.

 

[WestCoast]

I haven't expressed any concerns about your marketing.

That was from earlier posts.

I do appreciate your responses Mr Elms, and if the service is working, then that's great.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Being totally honest, if I typed any firm into Google and found no search results apart from a website/facebook page, I would be a little concerned....Now, I'm not for a minute suggesting that your business isn't real, because it quite obviously is. However, people do have concerns because of these past scams.

Everything that needed to be said..."in a nutshell." I still think the company should do something to make its website more professional.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The first ever service should have been accompanied by a press release published by Gorilla Bus on their website with photos of passengers being welcomed on the coach by the manager. This would then put this new route in line with what's been done by other companies on other routes.........Google News finds no stories for Gorilla Bus at all. This is surprising as I would have expected them to have told local newspapers about the new service and considering local newspapers will have occasions when there aren't many local news stories, a story about a new transport link should have been published.

You have picked up on a marketing opportunity lost, that you would have expected to be a source of much free publicity, had the local media been informed that this would be a news-worthy item. Any new company needs its profile raising as quickly as possible.

 

[Steve Elms]

Mojo, I did answer your question - the service only operates to pick up pre-booked customers, if nobody has booked to be picked up or set down at a particular point, then the bus will not serve it, this has been said many times now. The regularity of a stop being served depends entirely on the bookings received. If you book to travel from Birmingham then the service will be there. I wasn't specifically answering you about marketing, just catching up on responses to other posts. Mr. Sidorczuk, you've made the same comment about the website three times now, and each time I have responded that it is being reviewed in light of comments made about it, and that I would welcome suggestions as to how you feel it may be more useful - nobody has yet offered any, just commented on their distaste for it. I've also mentioned before that we have been in contact with local newspapers, but very few, the Sheffield Star group, which also covers titles in Derbyshire and Nottinghamshire, and the Express and Star in Wolverhampton being notable exceptions, showed any interest in the services at all. I think, as regards marketing, we will have to agree to differ. I don't personally subscribe to the view that anybody takes any notice of a cliched picture story of a new business being opened by a manager or a celebrity, and, ultimately, it is me alone that will stand or fall by that opinion. The avenues we have used work for us, and should they stop doing so, we will try something else. I understand what you are trying to say about Google, but if you are already aware of the product enough to search the name, surely your main interest would be in the website being found. If you don't know the name, you would be using other search terms anyway. Naturally it will take time for reviews and comments to filter through.

 

[WestCoast]

Personally, I don't think there is anything wrong with the website from a functional point of view, the FAQ forum is good and there are clearly labeled drop-off/pick-up points e.t.c

To use a competitor as an example, it reminds me of an early version of the megabus site (2004 snapshot).

They have gone slightly more professional looking over the years to this.

It's a more polished image, which still gives the impression of being cheap.

 

[Steve Elms]

Thanks, WestCoast. The feel that we wanted to go for was along the lines of the likes of Ryanair really, and clearly Megabus have been very influenced by them in many aspects of their marketing as well. I guess it's a very fine balancing act between reflecting cheap and cheerful and maybe going too far the other way, and getting that balance right inevitably involves inviting comment from other people. I don't personally have any criticism of something like the National Express website, in the respect that it clearly conveys the image that its demographic appreciates, there is certainly much research out there suggesting that Megabus, for example, are not taking passengers from National Express in the main, but generating them from elsewhere, largely because marketing tools, such as their website, appeal to completely different types of people. Some of the facilities that we are providing have never been offered by National Express, because they would never be used by 'their' customers, but we are finding that these are just where we are experiencing the most interest. Taste will, of course, always play a part in it, but as you suggest, getting the functionality and content right first is the most important thing.

 

[anthony263]

Thanks, WestCoast. The feel that we wanted to go for was along the lines of the likes of Ryanair really, and clearly Megabus have been very influenced by them in many aspects of their marketing as well. I guess it's a very fine balancing act between reflecting cheap and cheerful and maybe going too far the other way, and getting that balance right inevitably involves inviting comment from other people. I don't personally have any criticism of something like the National Express website, in the respect that it clearly conveys the image that its demographic appreciates, there is certainly much research out there suggesting that Megabus, for example, are not taking passengers from National Express in the main, but generating them from elsewhere, largely because marketing tools, such as their website, appeal to completely different types of people. Some of the facilities that we are providing have never been offered by National Express, because they would never be used by 'their' customers, but we are finding that these are just where we are experiencing the most interest. Taste will, of course, always play a part in it, but as you suggest, getting the functionality and content right first is the most important thing.

Steve thanks for taking the time to answer our questions on here. I know of a few operator's who have started off with very basic websites but have sorted them out as they go along.

Veolia transport's website for terrible for a number of years and not sure if they have sorted it when I told them about it 3 years ago.

As for having a article in some of magazines, it cant really hurt ok maybe it wont advertise much to the average member of the public but it does gt you some attention from the industry.

As I said before if I need to travel in the area where you guys operate I will take a look. I do think its a good idea using paypal by the way I know paypal are good at refunding you as I had a problem when I purchased something off ebay a few years ago.

 

[WestCoast]

Thanks, WestCoast. The feel that we wanted to go for was along the lines of the likes of Ryanair really, and clearly Megabus have been very influenced by them in many aspects of their marketing as well

Ryanair's website is a mess, although it has been tidied up recently.

As long as you're not too influenced by Ryanair For example, don't start charging £6 per person each way card fees, which are only avoidable by taking out a special prepaid card. :roll:

I like the fact you've gone for a 'funky' name actually. My favourite has to be BoltBus in the US though.

Do your contracted coaches carry a GorillaBus sticker in the window, or do they have a modified livery?

 

[Steve Elms]

Thanks Anthony, like I say, I genuinely welcome suggestions, the great advantage of a website over a timetable booklet, for example, is that it can easily be improved when issues are highlighted - if it's lacking anything that would make customer's lives easier, I'm happy to add it. I have to agree with you over the Veolia website, the homepage all looked so professional, but the content was rather sparse, particularly any information on their timetables. I think, for a lot of companies, uploading a website is often just box ticking, when the reality is that is should be something that constantly evolves and provides a one-stop shop for a business. Of course, you're right, being in the trade press probably wouldn't hurt, it's just not been a priority, we've found other ways of getting information across to the people who might find the service useful. As I think I've mentioned before, we all know that there are silent members on every forum, and discussing strategy in front of them would not be too clever - maybe when we're a little more established I'll explain exactly who we are trying to encourage and how we've gone about it! PayPal is a key element of our business, particularly because of the damage that the likes of Dash have done - I'm not sure many people realise that it is as secure as you can get, merchants have no access to credit card or bank details, and the refund policy counts for all transactions. I hope to see you joining us at some point then!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Haha, no, I just like the feel of the Ryanair site rather than it in itself, although if you've ever read the story of how the site was created, you'll appreciate why it looks the way it does! Some aspects of Ryanair, from a business perspective anyway, are brilliant, and they are often hilarious, plus I actually prefer flying with them over certain airlines - have you ever experienced five hours on a Monarch plane?? But no, one Ryanair is quite enough, I wouldn't want to emulate them, and besides I don't think many people these days really believe that the headline fare is all you'll end up paying! I'm quite happy with a 'what you see is really what you get' policy! Actually, I really like the name BoltBus as well, although I had to see the logo before I got it! It seems the US has gone for budget buses in a big way, have you seen the 'I Survived the Fung Wah Bus' t-shirts? We always intended to give ourselves as much flexibility as possible during the first few months - the idea was that we would soon see patterns emerging - which is happening already - that we would then concentrate on and develop a few months further down the line. We deliberately chose our contractors because they had a mixed fleet, so we have a choice of anything from minibuses to full size coaches dependent on loadings. Because of this, we haven't asked for anything to be liveried as yet, although in the next phase, we will be able to ask for the committment of dedicated vehicles. We are generally using clearly-marked magnetic sign boards in the meantime. I must admit that it would be great to be able to see a fleet of liveried coaches on the road, quite aside from the marketing value of that, but it's something to look forwards to anyway! Of course, it does mean that the livery isn't yet settled, so bring on the suggestions - I won't bias you by telling you what we are intending it to be just yet!

 

[tbtc]

I'm finding this thread really interesting.

Whilst I've not used the service yet (and was initially a bit confused about some of the finer details...), the approach taken here is fresh - I share Mr Elms' view that some of the marketing techniques that transport companies try are dated (and possibly are of more appeal to enthusiasts, or to massage the ego of directors at the company) rather than getting the message over to potential customers/ passengers (who, lets face it, don't read the trade press).

 

[Greenback]

I can see that the marketing is geared towards a target market that is highly unlikely to read trade press or local newspapers.

I think those who are sceptical have just misunderstood what Mr Elms and the company are trying to do, as well as being cautious about scams.

 

[OMGitsDAVE]

Looking at their site, it seems as if a 5-year old designed it, and got paid £1 for some sweets. It's horrible!

 

[Greenback]

I agree that it's not pleasant to either look at or use, but perhaps it's exactly what the target market likes?

 

[martinsh]

Has anybody tried this service yet ? I know some people said they were going to ...

 

[madannie77]

From the gorillabus website: after 30th November the following stops will no longer be served:

Chesterfield
Hartshead Moor Services
Manchester City Centre
Nottingham City Centre
Nottingham trent University
Sheffield City Centre
Tibshelf Services

 

[northwichcat]

From the gorillabus website: after 30th November the following stops will no longer be served:

Chesterfield
Hartshead Moor Services
Manchester City Centre
Nottingham City Centre
Nottingham trent University
Sheffield City Centre
Tibshelf Services

Manchester Airport will be served instead of Manchester Chorlton Street. Maybe they think there's too much competition for Manchester-Liverpool and Manchester-Sheffield.

The £1 fares seem to have gone with £5 the cheapest I can see with discounts available for NUS card holders.

 

[Deerfold]

From the gorillabus website: after 30th November the following stops will no longer be served:

Chesterfield
Hartshead Moor Services
Manchester City Centre
Nottingham City Centre
Nottingham trent University
Sheffield City Centre
Tibshelf Services

That's a shame - the couple of trips I was likely to try were Bradford - Manchester and Manchester-Nottingham.

Not that I was likely to be a regular customer - my trips to Manchester and Nottingham are being increasingly infrequent.

Bradford to Nottingham now seems to have a mimum fare of £15. I can usually beat that on the train (albeit with 1 change) - and I suspect that will be faster - the website no longer seems to give you any idea when you'll turn up which is odd - I often know when I need to arrive and work back to see which service I need to catch.

 

[northwichcat]

Bradford to Nottingham now seems to have a mimum fare of £15.

I imagine they aren't selling enough of the more expensive tickets to be able to offer the £1 fare. A coach with 15 people booked in advance at £1 each isn't going to be profitable.

the website no longer seems to give you any idea when you'll turn up which is odd

It does for me in a grey box under the drop down menu where you select the service. It does say estimated time but that's understandable due to possible delays and stops being omitted if no-one's booked to board or alight there.

 

[Deerfold]

I imagine they aren't selling enough of the more expensive tickets to be able to offer the £1 fare. A coach with 15 people booked in advance at £1 each isn't going to be profitable.

Perhaps - but when I can get a 1st class advance for the train they're unlikey to get many travelling at that price (checked for 24th November on eastcoast.co.uk - several £15 advance 1sts available each way)

The page is also screaming at me "Seats from just £1 plus 50p booking fee "(with the double space)- I hope there are some somewhere so they're not breaking the Trade Descriptions Act, but I can't see any.

It does for me in a grey box under the drop down menu where you select the service. It does say estimated time but that's understandable due to possible delays and stops being omitted if no-one's booked to board or alight there.

Ah, perhaps it's something to do with the old version of IE I'm forced to use at work - but then I'm probably not alone in that.

EDIT: odd, it works for some journeys, but not Bradford - Nottingham for me.

 

[northwichcat]

Perhaps - but when I can get a 1st class advance for the train they're unlikey to get many travelling at that price (checked for 24th November on eastcoast.co.uk - several £15 advance 1sts available each way)

Yes there seems to be limited (if any) tickets that are noticeably cheaper than equivalent train fares. Gorilla Bus does have the advantage of an overnight service which only a selection of equivalent train routes. However, one route that does have an overnight train service is Sheffield to Manchester for which Gorilla Bus only offer £10 fares for.

The page is also screaming at me "Seats from just £1 plus 50p booking fee "(with the double space)- I hope there are some somewhere so they're not breaking the Trade Descriptions Act, but I can't see any.

The cheapest I can find for 30th Nov is £2.50 + 50p booking fee which is only available to NUS Extra card holders.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Perhaps someone ought to invite Steve Elms to comment upon this forum, as he has done in the past on this thread, concerning the latest changes and to say when their website will be amended to show the correct new minimum fare.

 

[Steve Elms]

Probably the two main points to make are, first, the £1 price is not a minimum fare, it's a headline fare, and is generated using yield management techniques. Although I'm certainly not going to publish the parameters for it, suffice to say that, since the first day of operation, up until the expiry date of the current ticket availability next February, there has been, at the very least, one seat available at £1, plus booking fee, on every scheduled journey regardless of boarding or alighting point, at some point during the booking cycle. The second point to make, is that this has not changed. Looking at the times that posts were made on here, it may well be the case that members were looking during the time that the system was being updated with the new wave of tickets - uploading takes place in real time, and is far from a five minute job - and there would have been a system lag between the standard fare being uploaded, and the yield management function becoming active. As our customers have been - deliberately - told that this batch would be made available from 1 November, there should not have been any inconvenience caused, and reviewing bookings made, there would not appear to have been. Certainly by yesterday morning, a full range of fares were available for the whole period. Tickets for travel before 30 November should not have been affected - the only reason £1 fares would not have been displayed on Wednesday for travel before that date is if they had already been purchased. Clearly we would not advertise something that we were not offering.

As for the changes, I did mention a while back that it was our intention to review the extensive network after talking with our customers. From these conversations, it was clear that serving certain locations was increasing journey times unnecessarily, as customers were frequently making onward connections. Manchester Airport and Meadowhall offer equivalent, and in some cases better, facilities for travel to the same suburbs as their respective city centres, for example, and serving Nottingham was adding up to an hour on to the journey time, largely due to the abysmal traffic management in Clifton, when there is an excellent Skylink service available from East Midlands Airport, for which we are hoping to arrange through ticketing.

 

[embers25]

Whilst I fully agree with all the changes being logical and necessary you probably need to change your website banner as you'll no longer be serving City-City! (Unless you are taking Ryanair's approach to the definition of serving city)

 

[tbtc]

Manchester Airport and Meadowhall offer equivalent, and in some cases better, facilities for travel to the same suburbs as their respective city centres

Meagabus have already given up on central Sheffield (Arundel Gate) and moved their local "stop" to Meadowhall (which is also convenient for a large part of Rotherham etc), I can see why you're doing the same.