Good units in the snow?

[Failed Unit]

I understand that older units because they are less complex are better in the snow, for example a vep does not have to worry about inverters it just draws current. Which units are best in your fleets at dealing with snow. For example would FCC drivers prefer a 317 or a 365 to get them to their destination? Would emt go for a 156 or hst (ok that one probably is a fair comparison)

 

[Lampshade]

I think 455s are better in the snow than just about anything else SWT use.

 

[jopsuk]

Well, AC beats DC quite handsomly.

I've heard tale that on the Inverness line 158s cope with snow better than 170s

 

[Arriva158]

North Wales Coast a 158 beats the 175's as the computers really do not like wheelslip!

 

[anthony263]

The main problems with modern multiple units are that they are all are fitted with computers which while ok normally certainly cannot seem to cope well with the cold winters especially with ice & snow

 

[GodAtum]

is this true?

Meanwhile, old slam-door trains would have done a better job of coping with the cold spell than modern rolling stock are managing, a rail expert has said.

Trains with complicated software systems are much more susceptible to ice and snow, said Rail magazine managing editor Nigel Harris. He added that it was "outrageous and disgraceful" that passengers had been stuck overnight on trains. He said: "These incidents were near London and in southern England. It's hardly Outer Mongolia."

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20101202/tuk-300-spend-night-on-abandoned-train-6323e80.html

 

[anthony263]

is this true?



http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20101202/tuk-300-spend-night-on-abandoned-train-6323e80.html

In some respects yes, due to snow & ice it can cause a surge in power which trips the computers on board the modern units, slam door emu's didnt really have this problem and the units could easily be hauled by a class 33/73 locomotive if they had any problems.

I believe the power surge problems is what caused the problems with some of the class 375/376/450/444 EMU'S last winter

 

[90019]

In some respects yes, due to snow & ice it can cause a surge in power which trips the computers on board the modern units, slam door emu's didnt really have this problem and the units could easily be hauled by a class 33/73 locomotive if they had any problems.

Don't the older ones just end up on fire instead?

 

[Failed Unit]

Don't the older ones just end up on fire instead?

Keep drawing current until something gives

 

[WatcherZero]

Anything that uses compressed air suffers horribly in cold weather.

 

[The Barlow Boy]

Historically any Southern "A" stock E.M.U. coped with any amount of ice and snow.
For those of you of tender years these were yer basic EMU, no inverters, no motor generator sets, no EPB brake just a straight Westinghouse, not even a speedo! What they did have though was a line voltage jumper the length of the train and sodding great heavy shoes. Couple two to-gether and the first set smashed and broke the snow and ice and the rear set supplied the juice. 'course what modern H&S would make of a shunter handling a 750 volt line jumper nowadays is best not thought of.

 

[scotsman]

Story going about that 170s have been banned from the Highland Mainline until the snow dies down

 

[466.networkers]

The Class 395s are running ok on HS1.
Except the signalling problems, its all what is going into London from East Kent.

 

[Failed Unit]

Story going about that 170s have been banned from the Highland Mainline until the snow dies down

I am sure that happened last year as well.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The Class 395s are running ok on HS1.
Except the signalling problems, its all what is going into London from East Kent.

Good old overhead power

 

[466.networkers]

I am sure that happened last year as well.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Good old overhead power

AC from St Pancras to Ebbsfleet where it switches to DC onwards to Faversham .... :roll:

 

[Crossover]

The Class 395s are running ok on HS1.
Except the signalling problems, its all what is going into London from East Kent.

I seem to recall this being similar in the snow last Christmas...a friend came back to Dover off the ferry and at the station pretty much no trains were running...apart from the Javelins which ran perfectly to the timetable...only being delayed by waiting for passengers from failed Eurostars!

 

[Train wasp]

I remember the days when a class 56 was put on to the front of a Kent coast unit to over come the problem of the third rail issue. Do the TOCs still run ghost trains at night to keep the third rail from icing up?

 

[Bittern]

The 314s and 318s seem to be handling quite well, but my hat (that I don't have) goes to the 156s which have proved once again how valuable they really are

is this true?

Yes. London is nowhere near Outer Mongolia.

 

[Donny Dave]

is this true?

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20101202/tuk-300-spend-night-on-abandoned-train-6323e80.html

Hmm .... I notice there's no comment about the several thousand people in Germany who had to spend a night on trains very recently .....

It is worth noting that the German railway, with an international reputation for efficiency, has been ravaged by snow delays.

On Wednesday night, 3,000 passengers spent the night on German trains. More than 200 were stuck in Frankfurt station alone, sheltering in carriages after hotel rooms filled up.

"It was something that we could not have prevented," a spokesman for Germany's national railway company Deutsche Bahn explains. "The trains stopped just before they reached their final destinations in Leipzig or Frankfurt and, for their security, we offered them to stay on the train. We gave them hot drinks and blankets and the trains were heated.

"We tried to clean the snow off the track and had the equipment out but the snowfall was so severe that the tracks kept getting covered."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-11897825

 

[lm321412]

Do the TOCs still run ghost trains at night to keep the third rail from icing up?

SouthEastern have, or at least did a few days ago!

 

[imagination]

165s/166s have always seemed to run fairly well in the snow.

 

[jopsuk]

However, once you have a train breakdown the ghost trains are rather stuffed.

 

[466.networkers]

When I was at Sittingbourne earlier, a pair of 465/9s ran through Platform 1 at high speed (most probably 90mph, line speed) to clear the line for the Class 395s that were in service. As it was snowing at the time, when I went back there later in the morning, this is what the track at Platform 1 looked like:


The track for Platform 1 at Sittingbourne. by Photos By Ryan, on Flickr

 

[danfitz123]

The 175 that I was travelling on yesterday broke down. Whether this is because of the weather, i dont know,but it appeared to be that. It terminated at chester on the way to holyhead.

 

[43167]

On the southern/southeast. The slammers beat the Electrostars in these conditions. As has already been said Locomotives where available could be used in the slammers days to keep the service going in some form.

With the 375/377's etc they cant do that. Sorry for stating the obvious.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I remember the days when a class 56 was put on to the front of a Kent coast unit to over come the problem of the third rail issue. Do the TOCs still run ghost trains at night to keep the third rail from icing up?

I've posted this picture on the forum previously, but I think it is quite justified to re-post it here...

 

[Minstral25]

On the southern/southeast. The slammers beat the Electrostars in these conditions. As has already been said Locomotives where available could be used in the slammers days to keep the service going in some form.

With the 375/377's etc they cant do that. Sorry for stating the obvious.

Which is where many TOC's are vulnerable- their different coupling and control systems presumably prevent them from hiring in a few diesels to get the services going

 

[krus_aragon]

The 175 that I was travelling on yesterday broke down. Whether this is because of the weather, i dont know,but it appeared to be that. It terminated at chester on the way to holyhead.

Did they put you straight onto another unit instead? Because the 175 depot is at Chester, I've often found that late night ex-Cardiff services will have a unit swap at Chester (unannounced until after Wrexham). Swapping diagrams like that will let them take in a misbehaving unit sooner than scheduled to have a look at it.

 

[Wyvern]

I believe Bombardier are trying out a new conductor rail de-icing system for the Electrostars.

Anyone know how successsful it is?

 

[Class377/5]

is this true?

Quote:
Meanwhile, old slam-door trains would have done a better job of coping with the cold spell than modern rolling stock are managing, a rail expert has said.

Trains with complicated software systems are much more susceptible to ice and snow, said Rail magazine managing editor Nigel Harris. He added that it was "outrageous and disgraceful" that passengers had been stuck overnight on trains. He said: "These incidents were near London and in southern England. It's hardly Outer Mongolia."

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20101202/tuk-300-spend-night-on-abandoned-train-6323e80.html

I'm sorry but if Gatwick Airport had to clear 100,000 tonnes of snow in 24hrs how the hell does he expect the railways to do the same? From someone who is supposed to be behind the railways to have a go because a TOC acted in the best interests of the passenger is beyond belief.

Simple case that the safest place for passengers was to be kept at stations rather than let them get trapped in the middle of no-where with little chance of being rescued for hours.