Last night I took an overnight coach back from Newcastle to London. As this coach was stopping at Heathrow and I live only a 20 minute bus ride away I decided to get off there. However as I tried to leave the coach the driver stood in my way and demanded I return to my seat and told me I could be fined if I got off the coach at Heathrow! In the end I told him to either move himself out of the way or get pushed and he relented, but is what he said true? Do National Express have penalty fares and fines?
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Getting off a National Express coach early
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You'll usually find that airport fares are more expensive then ones to the next stopping point so, in theory, you've avoided paying the correct fare. However I suspect that kidnapping wouldn't be allowed in such a case!
I would strongly advise against any bus driver threatening to force a passenger to travel on their bus by preventing them from leaving it at a scheduled stop.
I would also strongly advise against any bus passenger threatening to push a driver, though.
I would also strongly advise against any bus passenger threatening to push a driver, though.
goldisgood
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Often you get cheaper fares going further, for example I had a train ticket from Exeter to Didcot Parkway via Reading, and found out that the train was stopping at Newbury, cutting an hour and a half off my overall journey time back home. As I tried to get through, the staff at the ticket gate warned me that I could be fined for not completing the journey, so often fares can be weird like this.
Dhassell
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Technically you are not meant to leave the service early,
(Taken from their Conditions of Carriage.)
"4.13 Joining and leaving a service: You may not board or leave any service except at the starting, or finishing, point of your journey, save for any mid journey refreshment break permitted in Clause 4.11 above"
But legally speaking they also can't trap you on the coach.
Next time I would advise speaking to the driver explaining your situation if you want to get off early, I can't see them having an issue with this.
(Taken from their Conditions of Carriage.)
"4.13 Joining and leaving a service: You may not board or leave any service except at the starting, or finishing, point of your journey, save for any mid journey refreshment break permitted in Clause 4.11 above"
But legally speaking they also can't trap you on the coach.
Next time I would advise speaking to the driver explaining your situation if you want to get off early, I can't see them having an issue with this.
Robertj21a
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Many people try that trick to avoid the higher fares charged to the airports, hence the problem.
overthewater
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Blame the airport for the high prices...
What would Heathrow do if the bus companies simply refused to pay the access fees? They can't withdraw access because then half of the people employed there won't be able to get to work! Also, do TfL pay those fees?
Its not just airport fares. I've looked at prices for a particular journey to London - from the first stop I looked at: £5.60, next stop (closer to London): £5.60, next stop: £7.10, next stop: £11.00, next stop: £11.00, next stop is in London. I should add that it takes 10 minutes to walk between stops 3 and 4 (provided you don't have too much luggage, or are old).
I know that this is just one example but there is a fair change it would be repeated elsewhere. Clearly NEx are using pricing to influence travel patterns or in the OP to make money (to recuperate costs). Unlike rail, coach fares are not regulated and never will be - NEx can charge what they want.
(All fares are listed as 'from')
I book from Exeter-London Victoria quite often, and if on the early morning coach, get off at Heathrow instead, as prefer it too sitting in traffic at peak time into London, never once had a problem, driver not notice or care, though they do change over en route, I just walk off coach and go on my merry way, though I dont say anything to drivers what I’m doing, so they dont know I’m doing it.
Interesting. I just tried this on the NE website for fares from Birmingham to Manchester and Manchester Airport, and the fares to Manchester city were less than half the fares to the airport, even though the airport was a shorter journey! The terms and conditions say that you CAN alight at a destination prior to that on your ticket EXCEPT (surprise, surprise) for journeys to the Airport and cheapo "advance" type fares.
Of course, if you are travelling to the airport with luggage the driver might simply refuse to get your luggage from the hold if you try airport short-faring.
A case of a coach operator running a more blatant scam than even the train TOCs dare.
Of course, if you are travelling to the airport with luggage the driver might simply refuse to get your luggage from the hold if you try airport short-faring.
A case of a coach operator running a more blatant scam than even the train TOCs dare.
Robertj21a
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Not sure how that can be a 'blatant scam' when it's in their T&Cs.
Teflon Lettuce
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how is it a scam? the fares are clearly advertised, as are the terms and conditions. Truth is that this is what competition does. I bet there is a Megabus service between Birmingham and Manchester city centre... and not one to Manchester Airport... hence Nat Ex charge a cheap fare to the city and not the airport!
Since luggage is placed in the hold according to destination, this is quite likely.
In other cases (such as those I quoted in #10) it is quite possible that the coach is not due to stop at that particular place as there are no passengers booked. Or, in extreme situations where a duplicate is required, you might end up on the wrong coach.
If a person got off and the driver refused to remove their luggage, surely it'd be a security risk for the driver to proceed in the knowledge of having unaccompanied baggage aboard?
True, but the driver might simply say that they are not going to unlock that luggage hold, and sit in the cab.
Also, I guess the contents of the suitcase are worth more than the difference between the fares of the two stops.
Is it a risk worth taking?
Most airport runs are multi stop and change drivers enroute.If you dont have luggage its fine to get off anywhere.Most times you get passengers who come and say i have changed my mind am flying from here i made a mistake.I normally just let them off to avoid arguments.
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Megabus do run a service between Birmingham and Manchester Airport - however it's at 0235 - with another 10 daily services to Manchester.
Looking at a random day, it is 33p more to go to the Airport with Megabus.
I'd define a "scam" as a significantly higher fare compared to those charged for similar or even greater mileage, with a view to making profit from the unwary or, in the case of airports, overseas visitors. This would include, for example, the Edinburgh trams charging £1.70 for any journey other than to the airport, where the fare jumps to a whopping £6.
I used to live in Manchester and fares on all forms of transport from the city were reasonable, however they have no control over fares on National Express to the airport.
I used to live in Manchester and fares on all forms of transport from the city were reasonable, however they have no control over fares on National Express to the airport.
Robertj21a
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I'd define a scam as anything purely designed to catch out the unwary - even those who had thought they understood all the T&Cs. Fares to/from airports etc are well known, throughout the world, to often attract premium fares, so can't be a scam (in my opinion).
Bletchleyite
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Arguably the passengers paying for a different journey than they are making is more of a scam. There is no fundamental reason why journeys should not be priced entirely by the market rather than by distance.
DavidGrain
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It used to be the law that a passenger could demand to leave the coach or bus at any place that it was safe for the vehicle to stop. This trick used to be played on coaches going to Portsmouth for the Isle of Wight. As licences where never issued for the ferry terminal, one of the passengers would be primed to ask the driver to stop as the coach was passing the terminal and everyone would get off. The coach would then continue empty to its licensed terminus. This did not, of course, work in reverse so passengers from the ferry had to catch a local bus to the official coach terminus which I think was in Southsea.
An airport is often a useful transport hub in itself for non-flyers, thus for example Manchester Airport is a very handy destination when travelling from the south to Wythenshawe, South Manchester and Stockport. It's a bit like traveling from Greater Manchester to Birmingham by train, finding out that Stockport is a far more convenient boarding point but having to travel all the way into Manchester and out again because it costs twice as much to board at Stockport!
I was wondering how many other examples of longer journeys being cheaper than shorter ones on the same route there are which don't involve airports. The only ones I could think of were cross-border journeys with an ENCTS pass, I could go from Carlisle to Edinburgh for free on the X75, then travel back for free, unless I got off at (say) Hawick on the return journey where I would have to pay full fare as it's a journey wholly within Scotland!
I was wondering how many other examples of longer journeys being cheaper than shorter ones on the same route there are which don't involve airports. The only ones I could think of were cross-border journeys with an ENCTS pass, I could go from Carlisle to Edinburgh for free on the X75, then travel back for free, unless I got off at (say) Hawick on the return journey where I would have to pay full fare as it's a journey wholly within Scotland!
There's the well-known lunacy which prevails in my part of the world, whereby if you live in or near Preston and wish to arrive by train in London before noon but want a cheaper off-peak fare, the way to do it is be driven to Lancaster and catch the train passing back through Preston half an hour later! Does National Express do that kind of thing, or are the journey times too long?
Bletchleyite
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That only exists because VT's franchise agreement specifies different "maximum" peak times for the two - North Wales is the same. If VT were allowed to they'd make peak tighter at Lancaster, just as they would have evening peak northbound restrictions from MKC if they were allowed to.
Actually, TBH, I reckon they would abolish off peak walk-ups for long distance journeys if they were allowed to.
DavidGrain
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I haven't done this recently but on Virgin trains from Wolverhampton and Sandwell you can use an off peak ticket on an earlier train from Birmingham New Street that you could if you were holding a Birmingham to London ticket. The same thing applies in reverse on the return journey when you can catch a later train with a Sandwell or Wolverhampton ticket than you can with a Birmingham ticket which is one of the reasons that tickets are checked manually at the barrier at Euston
There was the same issue with passes before ENCTS was introduced in England when routes crossed local authority boundaries as concessionary travel was normally only for journeys starting or finishing in within the area of the issuing authority.
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