GC vs NXEC

[upyourjunction]

A silly article.

It starts - and ends - talking about the new structure, yet the article is about GC's problems, but most of the bad attitude they experienced actually came from NXEC.

Anyway, the rude people who work on the railways should be removed immediately as they give us all a bad name. In this case, rude people from NXEC are giving the entire industry a bad name to GC's customers. The more these idiots are rude to people, the less people are encouraged to travel by rail. They should, quite frankly, be sacked.

How very dare you blame NXEC staff? You obviously have no idea of abuse we suffer at the hands of the public! GC screws up their travel plans with a S*** service & who gets it in the neck, the poor bloke in the booking office or on the information desk!
Treat anyone with politeness & respect & you get the same back!

 

[Max]

How very dare you blame NXEC staff? You obviously have no idea of abuse we suffer at the hands of the public! GC screws up their travel plans with a S*** service & who gets it in the neck, the poor bloke in the booking office or on the information desk!
Treat anyone with politeness & respect & you get the same back!

Presumably you work for NXEC? If so, I'm sorry to say that a good number of your staff treat passengers with no respect, even when they've done nothing wrong.

 

[me123]

Having travelled on NXEC's Aberdeen route, I can only say that the staff I've seen have been exceptional crew members. Friendly, curteous and jovial. I have also trtvalled a few times between Edinburgh and Glasgow and a similar high standard has been set.

 

[Max]

Having travelled on NXEC's Aberdeen route, I can only say that the staff I've seen have been exceptional crew members. Friendly, curteous and jovial. I have also trtvalled a few times between Edinburgh and Glasgow and a similar high standard has been set.

To be honest, I think it varies between depots. The Scottish ones tend to be nicer than the English ones I feel.

 

[schmoo_smith]

Presumably you work for NXEC? If so, I'm sorry to say that a good number of your staff treat passengers with no respect, even when they've done nothing wrong.

sorry but i have too second that too, i had a saver from chippenham to sunderland, missed the last afternoon peak train because the train into paddington was (there's a shocker) and the fella wouldnt let me on and had to wait til 7pm until i could get the next train on my ticket type, in another incident i had two separate tickets, both advance tickets which i could only use on the specific train printed on the ticket (cant remember the exact name for the ticket type?) one ticket from chippenham to paddington and the other from kings cross to sunderland, the train into paddington was late (bit of a pattern forming here) and missed my train from kings cross, the fella in the ticket office would not authorize my ticket so i could use it on the next train, which incidentally was the last train up north and i had no money to buy a new ticket, so I was left stranded, I was fuming, luckily I had some money to get a tube ticket to go stay with my cousin in wembley and returned the next day to speak to someone else at which point the lady i spoke to was very understanding and authorized my ticket for the next service back up north. I wish I had noted the guys name at the time and complained to his manager. But this just goes to show how nasty and unhelpful train staff can be.

 

[me123]

The Scottish ones tend to be nicer than the English ones I feel.

Isn't that true of everyone? :razz:

 

[upyourjunction]

sorry but i have too second that too, i had a saver from chippenham to sunderland, missed the last afternoon peak train because the train into paddington was (there's a shocker) and the fella wouldnt let me on and had to wait til 7pm until i could get the next train on my ticket type, in another incident i had two separate tickets, both advance tickets which i could only use on the specific train printed on the ticket (cant remember the exact name for the ticket type?) one ticket from chippenham to paddington and the other from kings cross to sunderland, the train into paddington was late (bit of a pattern forming here) and missed my train from kings cross, the fella in the ticket office would not authorize my ticket so i could use it on the next train, which incidentally was the last train up north and i had no money to buy a new ticket, so I was left stranded, I was fuming, luckily I had some money to get a tube ticket to go stay with my cousin in wembley and returned the next day to speak to someone else at which point the lady i spoke to was very understanding and authorized my ticket for the next service back up north. I wish I had noted the guys name at the time and complained to his manager. But this just goes to show how nasty and unhelpful train staff can be.

Our Guards hear these stories everyday from passengers traveling on cheap advance tickets but want to turn up and travel on any train. The fact that the fare was cheap is because its for a specific service doesn't seem to enter their heads.
When booking a journey in which you travel across London from another region you have to give plenty of connection time & allow for delays & such. If your not prepared to do this then don't buy a cheap advance ticket & expect to treat it as a full price open!

 

[Techniquest]

Seems someone's been wound up by NXEC passengers...

Will echo the other guy's comments about Scottish crews being nicer, usually are IMX.

 

[Max]

Our Guards hear these stories everyday from passengers traveling on cheap advance tickets but want to turn up and travel on any train. The fact that the fare was cheap is because its for a specific service doesn't seem to enter their heads.
When booking a journey in which you travel across London from another region you have to give plenty of connection time & allow for delays & such. If your not prepared to do this then don't buy a cheap advance ticket & expect to treat it as a full price open!

What are you talking about? We don't choose connection times, the trainline or indeed the National Express website does it for us. It gives a set amount of time for travel across London, we can't change this! You're forgetting that if a connection is missed on an advance ticket because of a delayed train, the TOC has an obligation to get you to your destination, be it by train or taxi if neccessary. It's people like you that give the railways a bad name.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Our Guards hear these stories everyday from passengers traveling on cheap advance tickets but want to turn up and travel on any train. The fact that the fare was cheap is because its for a specific service doesn't seem to enter their heads.
When booking a journey in which you travel across London from another region you have to give plenty of connection time & allow for delays & such. If your not prepared to do this then don't buy a cheap advance ticket & expect to treat it as a full price open!

BUT IF THE OP HAD ALLOWED SUFFICIENT TIME TO CROSS LONDON, AND CHANGE TRAINS/STATIONS, NXEC SHOULD HAVE ACCEPTED THE TICKET, AS IT WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN THE OP'S FAULT THAT THEY MISSED THE ORIGINAL CONNECTION..

Isn't it funny that some TOCs, e.g. VIRGIN WEST COAST, (yes, the same TOC which is a very big, far superior rival company to NXEC) are 9/10 very understanding, very friendly, and always try their best to solve any problems which customers may have with invalid tickets etc..

I always find VWC TM's very understanding, but at the same time, i'm not saying that you'd get away with having invalid tickets without a very good reason, as they will always treat you fairly.

 

[Max]

Great minds think alike Voyagerdude...

 

[voyagerdude220]

Thanks Max

(I hadn't actually seen your post until now, as we must have posted our original posts at the same time, with the forum showing the times as different, to show which one was posted first)

 

[upyourjunction]

What are you talking about? We don't choose connection times, the trainline or indeed the National Express website does it for us. It gives a set amount of time for travel across London, we can't change this! You're forgetting that if a connection is missed on an advance ticket because of a delayed train, the TOC has an obligation to get you to your destination, be it by train or taxi if neccessary. It's people like you that give the railways a bad name.

Read the post I replied to, The guy had 2 separate advance tickets 1 from chippenham to paddington and the other from kings cross to sunderland. It wasn't a through ticket & thats why it wasn't authorized!.

 

[djw1981]

I disagree. If he has a GC-only ticket (which I am assuming the London-Sunderland portion was - if it was not then these comments do not apply) and he misses the GC train then NX should charge full fare or he can wait for the next GC service.

If he had an 'any TOC' but service/time specific ticket, then yes NX should have allowed the travel. However, since they are often not aware of delays on other TOCs, I have always got the Guard of the service which was delayed to annotate my ticket, or at last provide some evidence of the trains late running which made me miss my connection.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Well that's what i'm assuming, as the OP hasn't specified otherwise, and if the OP did indeed have an "Any TOC" service/time sepcific ticket, I still strongly feel that NXEC should have accepted it...

Besides, even if this isn't the case, don't you get the feeling that NXEC enjoy behaving like little ****s? (OK it's not very fair to sterotype every single NXEC staff member, but...)

Just look at "up your junction" 's reply to schmoo_smith, and you should be able to see what i mean...

If he had an 'any TOC' but service/time specific ticket, then yes NX should have allowed the travel. However, since they are often not aware of delays on other TOCs, I have always got the Guard of the service which was delayed to annotate my ticket, or at last provide some evidence of the trains late running which made me miss my connection.

 

[schmoo_smith]

Our Guards hear these stories everyday from passengers traveling on cheap advance tickets but want to turn up and travel on any train. The fact that the fare was cheap is because its for a specific service doesn't seem to enter their heads.
When booking a journey in which you travel across London from another region you have to give plenty of connection time & allow for delays & such. If your not prepared to do this then don't buy a cheap advance ticket & expect to treat it as a full price open!

i allowed an hour and half! I lived in london for 4 years and i know exactly whats its like travelling across and dont tell me it didnt enter my head it was a cheap ticket so there is no need to be like that towards me. if i had treat it as a full price open i would have got straight on the train wouldnt i? i would also to add that the bloke in the ticket office even looked it up in his book to see the chaange time time allowance between paddington and kings cross which if i remember rightly is 45 mintues so i actually allowed myself double the time when i booked the tickets.
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Will echo the other guy's comments about Scottish crews being nicer, usually are IMX.

yes i agree greatly and people in the north
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I disagree. If he has a GC-only ticket (which I am assuming the London-Sunderland portion was

it wasnt, it was a nxec ticket
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Read the post I replied to, The guy had 2 separate advance tickets 1 from chippenham to paddington and the other from kings cross to sunderland. It wasn't a through ticket & thats why it wasn't authorized!.

thats what the fella in the ticket office said but so what anybody would have saw i bought those two tickets intended for a through journey, my reason for buying two separate tickets was beacuase.......drum roll please.......it was cheaper than a through ticket
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If he had an 'any TOC' but service/time specific ticket, then yes NX should have allowed the travel. However, since they are often not aware of delays on other TOCs, I have always got the Guard of the service which was delayed to annotate my ticket, or at last provide some evidence of the trains late running which made me miss my connection.

the really stupid thing was was that he checked on the system to see if the train into paddington was indeed late so he had the evidence to prove that it was late!

 

[williamn]

I understand that the Mk3's are from the WCML and had to be altered to run with the HST power cars. So where did the MK3's that used to run with the power cars go to?

 

[1D53]

All in use!

They were always more powercars then rakes to cover for spares and maintenance.

 

[16CSVT2700]

All in use!

They were always more powercars then rakes to cover for spares and maintenance.

Not quite.
A couple half-rakes have been written off and scrapped due to Southall, Ladbroke Grove and Ufton Nervet.

 

[upyourjunction]

thats what the fella in the ticket office said but so what anybody would have saw i bought those two tickets intended for a through journey, my reason for buying two separate tickets was beacuase.......drum roll please.......it was cheaper than a through ticket

Thats why through tickets cost more, it gives you the extra insurance that if your journey gets delayed you can transfer to a later train, buying 2 cheaper advance tickets is just the risk you take!

 

[schmoo_smith]

Thats why through tickets cost more, it gives you the extra insurance that if your journey gets delayed you can transfer to a later train, buying 2 cheaper advance tickets is just the risk you take!

so the rail systems attitude is too penalize people for saving money. what a load of rubbish.

 

[1D53]

Not quite.
A couple half-rakes have been written off and scrapped due to Southall, Ladbroke Grove and Ufton Nervet.

Also lost 3 powercars too though - which also would level things back up.

 

[Donny Dave]

Upyourjunction, as Max says, I presume you work for NXEC ....

It's staff with your attitude thats stopped me from using NXEC services. I'll either drive to York and get a GC service to London, or take the TPE to Sheffield and get a MML service now.

Is it any wonder that passengers are opting to do that when they see posts like yours, or generally the way NXEC staff act?

I've seen non-NXEC passengers hassled at York, Doncaster and Kings Cross in the last 9 months, because they dare to use other TOCs services (IE Cross Country, Grand Central or Hull Trains.) I've even had a ticket check at York because I was about to get on a GC service. Until NXEC pull their collective socks up when it comes to customer relations, I won't be using their services again.

Oh and why do GC bend over backwards to help NXEC when they cancel services, but the reverse doesn't apply? Is it because NXEC will do anything to see GC go bankrupt?

 

[djw1981]

NXEC staff at Edinburgh - train crew, platform and travel centre all seem very friendly and helpful. The Newcastle crews have also been very friendly IMO. My only ventures down south recently have been with VWC so I cannot comment on NXEC London / Leeds tc crews.

 

[yorkie]

How very dare you blame NXEC staff? You obviously have no idea of abuse we suffer at the hands of the public! GC screws up their travel plans with a S*** service & who gets it in the neck, the poor bloke in the booking office or on the information desk!
Treat anyone with politeness & respect & you get the same back!

Quality. Point proven. Thank you Mr Fawlty.:roll:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

... one ticket from chippenham to paddington and the other from kings cross to sunderland, the train into paddington was late (bit of a pattern forming here) and missed my train from kings cross, the fella in the ticket office would not authorize my ticket so i could use it on the next train, which incidentally was the last train up north and i had no money to buy a new ticket, so I was left stranded, I was fuming,.....

It is fine to combine tickets providing you allow enough connectional allowance time. Presumably you did? In which case they can't refuse, I'd argue (But IANAL).
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Read the post I replied to, The guy had 2 separate advance tickets 1 from chippenham to paddington and the other from kings cross to sunderland. It wasn't a through ticket & thats why it wasn't authorized!.

Re-read the NCoC. You can combine tickets for your journey, providing the train calls or you allow enough connectional time. Unless you have evidence that he did not allow enough time, I suggest you do not go down that path.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Thats why through tickets cost more, it gives you the extra insurance that if your journey gets delayed you can transfer to a later train, buying 2 cheaper advance tickets is just the risk you take!

Where is this documented, or have you just made it up?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I've even had a ticket check at York because I was about to get on a GC service.

I hope you refused to show your ticket.

I have been told that in the early days NXEC tried this, but walking past them saying "I am not using your trains" did the trick.
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i allowed an hour and half!.....time allowance between paddington and kings cross which if i remember rightly is 45 mintues so i actually allowed myself double the time when i booked the tickets....

Indeed. I'd have definitely got his name. I'd then have gone to the guard (although not directly, I wouldn't want Mr Jobsworth to see me try to go over his (big) head) as 90% of the time the guards are friendly, and explain the situation, chances are they'd say yes.

 

[theblackwatch]

Quite a lot of coaches have been used to increase the length of HST sets over the years - Great Western from 7 to 8, GNER (now NXEC) from 8 to 9, several others used for the NMT.

 

[Metroland]

I think the reality is there are good and bad staff in most medium large size companies, which includes the railways.

Although it depends on your definition of good and bad.

You have to feel sorry for the person that has to enforce rules they know is silly, just because some official has worked out and justified through their job as an official policy. Customers, sometimes quite rightly, see these rules obstructive and in some cases unfair and often take it out on the staff that have little sway over any decision.

You have to realise the British style of management, especially in public service organisations is still command and control, with little opportunity to allow staff to exercise common sense.

This is why we have a culture where everyone is desperate to become a middle manager in this country, instead of something really useful like a writer, engineer, medic or entrepreneur. It’s nothing to do with the desire to do useful work; it’s a desire to travel up the pecking order because you are allowed an extra 0.2-0.5% of original thought.

Of course there is some staff that delight in taking rules and regulations to the limit, to cause the maximum amount of difficulty. There are various reasons behind this: Sometimes it’s a power trip, but more often than not it’s because they have made concessions in the past, made a bad (unlucky?) judgement and ended up in being hauled over the coals by some bombastic official to justify their own job. We do so love scapegoats in this country.

 

[paul1609]

Re-read the NCoC. You can combine tickets for your journey, providing the train calls or you allow enough connectional time. Unless you have evidence that he did not allow enough time, I suggest you do not go down that path.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Where is this documented, or have you just made it up?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I hope you refused to show your ticket.

[/QUOTE]

I dont believe that applies to certain cross London Transfers unless by Thameslink etc. The Journey is not continuous because you leave for instance Paddington buy a tube ticket which is not a national rail ticket before starting a new journey at Kings Cross.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

The TOC only has to provide onward travel for a missed connection on a through ticket, not a split ticket, however most would allow it if it was authourised through their control centre.

I would imagine most NXEC staff are getting it in the neck more than any other TOC or OAO at the moment. It is completely understandable for staff to lose there rag if 200 people appear at once and all demand something that can't be given and won't accept anything else. They can't just walk off and cool down and its impossible just to let it roll off their backs in such a situation. I wonder if any of the people here who are against this opinion have actually faced this situation on a daily basis?

 

[diligentdave]

Lets not lose the plot of the original thread here.
Whatever problems there are between NXEC and the rest of the world, should be kept for another thread.
The issues at hand are Grand Centrals trains.
Currently, the situation stands today that there are NO trains running, the one HST set available has failed to materialise (I do know why but am not allowed to say so), and there are no spares available.Period.

Of the 6 power cars, there is only 1 servicable.
The blame does not fall squarely on GC or Sovereign trains shoulders, DML (as they were) are 90% to blame for the poor overhaul that was done.
Considering that they also deal with navy contracts, and the overhaul of every valenta still running, this is an extremely poor state of affairs.
Do we hear of warships continuously breaking down?
The main question that needs answering is what went wrong with the power car overhauls?
I saw the engines when they were being overhauled (ie. in 1000 pieces on the workshop floor), and to be fair it looked good, but unfortunately something went awry.
GC have at every opportunity tried to run a service, be it with one working power car, hired in locomotives, buses or taxis, and they will certainly be feeling the pinch.

If for now other TOC's can put aside differences and help each other out LIKE IT USED TO BE whilst these problems occur, then the travelling public can benefit from what is a great railway system.