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Freight train speed limits

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Qwerty133

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In all seriousness drivers don't speed and would know if they were. The last driver I know of who was aught speeding was seen doing 125 through a 50 tsr and was sacked. Don't know exactly why he was speeding but it was through a station and another companies driver manager saw him and reported it.

And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!
 
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A-driver

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And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!

Well that will come down to the reason the 50 tsr was in place in the first place and the outcome of the investigation into why he was speeding.

If it had caused a derailment which led to injury or death then he could face criminal proceedings.
 

GB

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And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!

You want a pound of flesh as well?
 

A-driver

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And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!

Having re read your post I no longer stand by what I said before In response as you have missed a major difference. Doing 125 in a car is dangerous at all times on public roads. Doing 125 in a 125 capable train on a 125 cleared line is not at all dangerous. The problem is that there was a TSR in place. Now weather or not it was dangerous comes down to the reason for the speed being in place.

He shouldn't have done it and paid a high price but it certainly isn't comparable to doing 125 in a car on a 50mph road!
 

notadriver

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Would people please stop comparing driving vehicles on the road with train driving? They are completely different. Train drivers are far more professional and more highly trained than any car/bus/lorry driver and are the only drivers who can legally exceed 70 mph in this country as a matter of routine.
 

Dieseldriver

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The massive, massive difference between rules infringements while train driving and car driving is that 99.99% of the time, when a train driver does it, it is a genuine mistake. When a car driver does it, 99.99% of the time it was intentional.
Example, a car driver drives through a red traffic light as it has just changed as they are in a hurry and can't be bothered to wait.
A train driver passes a red signal because they have had a lapse in concentration/misjudged braking etc etc, it would be extremely rare for it to be deliberate (for obvious reasons!!).
 

the sniper

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And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!

I don't know of many 125mph roads in Britain that have 50mph temporary speed limits, so a pretty poor but comparison to make. You'll also be disappointed to know that in those circumstance on the road the driver would only be looking at a very long ban and a large fine, so the train driver 'got off' much worse by having their career and livelihood taken away from them.

All the other very obvious reason for why your comparison and opinion are wrong have been posted by others above.
 

notadriver

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The massive, massive difference between rules infringements while train driving and car driving is that 99.99% of the time, when a train driver does it, it is a genuine mistake. When a car driver does it, 99.99% of the time it was intentional.
Example, a car driver drives through a red traffic light as it has just changed as they are in a hurry and can't be bothered to wait.
A train driver passes a red signal because they have had a lapse in concentration/misjudged braking etc etc, it would be extremely rare for it to be deliberate (for obvious reasons!!).

Fantastic post dieseldriver +1 +1 +1 :)
 

455driver

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And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!

I went through a 40 TSR the other week at about 70 (brake in full service), do you think I should be prosecuted and/or sacked?

edit-
And yes I did report it immediately to the signalman via the CSR radio system.
 

KA4C

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And if he did the same speed in a 50 zone in his car he would have been liable to dangerous driving which incurs a maximum penalty of 2 years inside or an unlimited fine, so IMO getting away with *just* getting sacked is too lenient!!

No he wouldn't, he'd be done for speeding
 

Pumbaa

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I went through a 40 TSR the other week at about 70 (brake in full service), do you think I should be prosecuted and/or sacked?

edit-
And yes I did report it immediately to the signalman via the CSR radio system.

Well as long as you didn't get to read the WON, surely you'll be alright ;)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
'ang on - haven't you lot gone onto GSM-R now?
 

GB

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I went through a 40 TSR the other week at about 70 (brake in full service), do you think I should be prosecuted and/or sacked?

edit-
And yes I did report it immediately to the signalman via the CSR radio system.

No no, hung drawn and quartered is the way to go for you:lol:
 

455driver

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Well as long as you didn't get to read the WON, surely you'll be alright ;)
It was in the WON and I had been through it the previous day (at 40)!



'ang on - haven't you lot gone onto GSM-R now?

All 158,159 and 458s fitted, now being fitted to the 455 and Desiro stock, this one still hadnt been fitted.


Just waiting for the first driver of a 455 to be reported by a passenger for using his mobile phone when there is a a call comes in on the GSMR. :lol:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
No no, hung drawn and quartered is the way to go for you:lol:

No problems and I got a "well done" off my manager.

Can you guess why?
 
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Would people please stop comparing driving vehicles on the road with train driving? They are completely different. Train drivers are far more professional and more highly trained than any car/bus/lorry driver

care to justify this assertion and how much of rail driver training is actually about operating the vehicle and how much is other material

and are the only drivers who can legally exceed 70 mph in this country as a matter of routine.

wholly and substantially incorrect ...
 

A-driver

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care to justify this assertion and how much of rail driver training is actually about operating the vehicle and how much is other material



wholly and substantially incorrect ...


First of all anyone can get a car driving licence, once you have it you have it you are never re-assessed and so the quality of your driving can easily (and regularly does) decline. Train drivers are constantly monitored and re-assessed. Plus as car drivers arnt paid for what they do more will chance breaking traffic laws like speeding, running red lights, drinking too much alcohol, taking drugs, using their mobile etc-all stuff which no train driver would do as they know they would be sacked and possibly worse for it. That is indisputable fact.

Train drivers are also incredibly knowledgable about their routes and traction whereas a car driver can pick up any car and drive it anywhere with no training on the new roads & cars. They find out how a particular car handles on a new stretch if road as it careers off into the bushes!

A train driver does at least 250 hours practicle driving in both daylight and night and a good chunk of rules and traction courses relate to handling the train. There is no limit in how many driving hours you need to pass a car test. You don't need any lessons at all to attempt the test infact.

As for the last bit-care to tell us why its incorrect? Exactly who is permitted to exceed 70 regularly? They only people I can think of are the police (I doubt other emergency services often get above 70 but if they do then I class them in the same bracket as police anyway for one good reason...) and the emergency services get special training on driving to allow then to break the speed limit when absolutely necessary and are assessed on it.

Unless you know others who may break the speed limit?
 

notadriver

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care to justify this assertion and how much of rail driver training is actually about operating the vehicle and how much is other material



wholly and substantially incorrect ...

Cars/bus/lorry drivers are prone to exceeding their legal speed limits. As for the other I did mean vehicles on public roads and not emergency vehicles responding to emergencies.
 
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<snip>

As for the last bit-care to tell us why its incorrect? Exactly who is permitted to exceed 70 regularly? They only people I can think of are the police (I doubt other emergency services often get above 70 but if they do then I class them in the same bracket as police anyway for one good reason...) and the emergency services get special training on driving to allow then to break the speed limit when absolutely necessary and are assessed on it.

Unless you know others who may break the speed limit?

vehicles used for police, fire and rescue service , ambulance, SOCA , and various military purposes are allowed to exceed speed limits by legislation , an un caveated statement as made by notadriver ...

there is NO legal requirement for vehicles used for emergency services purposes to have drivers with specialist training to exceed the speed limit ( unless and until the secondary legislation required to enact S19 of the road safety act 2006 is made ) also the law allows exceeding thespeed limit when doing so would hinder the purpose of use, there is not 'absolute' or 'necessity ' test ...

with regard to a comparison of group 1 drivers and train drivers rather than group 2 , PHV, Hackney and ES drivers ...
 

notadriver

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vehicles used for police, fire and rescue service , ambulance, SOCA , and various military purposes are allowed to exceed speed limits by legislation , an un caveated statement as made by notadriver ...

there is NO legal requirement for vehicles used for emergency services purposes to have drivers with specialist training to exceed the speed limit ( unless and until the secondary legislation required to enact S19 of the road safety act 2006 is made ) also the law allows exceeding thespeed limit when doing so would hinder the purpose of use, there is not 'absolute' or 'necessity ' test ...

with regard to a comparison of group 1 drivers and train drivers rather than group 2 , PHV, Hackney and ES drivers ...

Not routinely - in the course of their duties - emergency calls etc.

As for group 1 - do you mean bus drivers?
 

A-driver

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vehicles used for police, fire and rescue service , ambulance, SOCA , and various military purposes are allowed to exceed speed limits by legislation , an un caveated statement as made by notadriver ...

there is NO legal requirement for vehicles used for emergency services purposes to have drivers with specialist training to exceed the speed limit ( unless and until the secondary legislation required to enact S19 of the road safety act 2006 is made ) also the law allows exceeding thespeed limit when doing so would hinder the purpose of use, there is not 'absolute' or 'necessity ' test ...

with regard to a comparison of group 1 drivers and train drivers rather than group 2 , PHV, Hackney and ES drivers ...

They rarely exceed 70 though-I doubt a heavy fire engine would get near that anyway! More likely they will cut through traffic jams and through red lights (neither of which would be done anywhere near 70!)

And weather there is requirement or not, the main veichels to ever go above 70 will be police cars and the police officers who deal with high speed driving will be advance drivers who have received specialist training, as will all emergency service drivers.

So I think you missed notadriver's point. M
And as for the rest of the post, I can't see how you can argue that train drivers arnt more professional than car drivers.
 

455driver

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For being honest and not trying to cover it up or wriggle out of it?
Nope because NR staff were being a bunch of <woops matrons>.
You offered them sexual favours?
of course not.

I still cant sit down though! ;)
He was being dreadfully sarcastic? ;¬)

Nope it was genuine.


Okay the answer is that NR were in the middle of removing the TSR and they had already removed the temporary magnet and warning board and were on their way (in the van) to remove the commencement and termination boards when I went flying through.

I nearly spilt my coffee! :oops:
 
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Not routinely - in the course of their duties - emergency calls etc.

As for group 1 - do you mean bus drivers?

a group 1 driver is a car or motorcycle licence holder

a bus driver is a group 2 driver as they hold a vocational licence and are subject to vocational / group 2 licence retention requirements ( medicals, Traffic Commissioner etc ).

in some cases drivers of group 1 vehicles are subject to group 2 medical standards e.g. Emergency services, PHV and hackney ...
 

A-driver

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a group 1 driver is a car or motorcycle licence holder

a bus driver is a group 2 driver as they hold a vocational licence and are subject to vocational / group 2 licence retention requirements ( medicals, Traffic Commissioner etc ).

in some cases drivers of group 1 vehicles are subject to group 2 medical standards e.g. Emergency services, PHV and hackney ...

As interesting as that is what has it got to do with train drivers and how they are trained?
 

TOCDriver

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What's all this rubbish comparing driving different vehicles all about? You can't make any comparisons. But as for certain train drivers here blowing their own trumpet about how magnificent we are - try taking a police pursuit advanced driving course and I'm sure you'll relax your views about how professional train drivers are compared to professional advance pursuit car drivers who are also continually assessed driving at break neck speeds
 

A-driver

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What's all this rubbish comparing driving different vehicles all about? You can't make any comparisons. But as for certain train drivers here blowing their own trumpet about how magnificent we are - try taking a police pursuit advanced driving course and I'm sure you'll relax your views about how professional train drivers are compared to professional advance pursuit car drivers who are also continually assessed driving at break neck speeds

No ones arguing against that or had even hinted at it-infact no one has been saying train drivers are more professional than police drivers, just that police drivers who do that are trained specifically for it.
 

TOCDriver

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No ones arguing against that or had even hinted at it-infact no one has been saying train drivers are more professional than police drivers, just that police drivers who do that are trained specifically for it.

Not the impression I got but that's just me :)
 
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