Free upgrades to 1st class?

[tjhux]

How easy is it to get free upgrades to 1st class? I know you have to pay for them normally, and usually I would either just buy 1st class seats or stop moaning, but I want to treat myself for once without spending.
Is it like on planes, where if there are empty seats they sometimes allow you to upgrade for free? Or does it depend on how the staff are feeling? Or, (most likely) is it only accessible if I pay?

please don't think I'm spoilt or ungrateful, I rarely get to travel by train and don't have the money to afford 1st class and just want to know if there's a loophole to get 1st class

BTW I'll be travelling by Avanti which is why I'm asking

 

[Iskra]

Extremely unlikely, but there are places you can do it relatively inexpensively if you just want to try it. Scotrail for example do a reasonably priced upgrade for £10/15 which is excellent value if doing a journey like Aberdeen-Edinburgh. Or look at Holyhead-Bangor, Wakefield Westgate-Leeds as a couple of examples with reasonable walk-up fares.

I would say that generally speaking most UK rail first class isn’t particularly exciting though, I don’t think it’s comparable with airline first class.

There are some limited opportunities to get it for free, without breaking rules, but generally speaking to get First Class travel for free, you’re looking at being compensated by a TOC for something that has gone badly wrong on a previous journey, and presumably that helps if you were in First Class on that journey too.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

You could travel on the rearmost first class carriage of a Thameslink service, for example between Brighton and Bedford (or vice-versa). That's always declassified.

First Class | Thameslink Railway

Upgrade to First Class on Southern for your season ticket, day ticket or Travelcard.

www.thameslinkrailway.com

Extract..

The first class compartment at the rear of Thameslink trains is always declassified.

 

[Iskra]

You could travel on the rear most first class carriage of a Thameslink service, for example between Brighton and Bedford (or vice-versa). That's always declassified.

First Class | Thameslink Railway

Upgrade to First Class on Southern for your season ticket, day ticket or Travelcard.

www.thameslinkrailway.com

Extract..

If it’s declassified, it’s not first class.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

If it’s declassified, it’s not first class.

Take your point, but it'd be like travelling in first class with Thameslink but without there being an extra charge.

 

[tjhux]

thank you for the replies^^
How often do they even check tickets? Would it be worth just risking sitting there?

 

[Iskra]

thank you for the replies^^
How often do they even check tickets? Would it be worth just risking sitting there?

It’s very common to have your ticket checked in First Class, I would not recommend trying it without a valid ticket, or being prepared to pay for an upgrade while already being in possession of a Standard Class ticket.

 

[skyhigh]

thank you for the replies^^
How often do they even check tickets? Would it be worth just risking sitting there?

Definitely, 100%, no.

If you are found without a First Class ticket, the penalty will be anywhere from paying the difference/Weekend First rate to getting a penalty fare or even a criminal prosecution for fare evasion.

There are several threads in the prosecution sub forum where someone has sat in First without the correct ticket and been reported.

If anything, tickets are checked in First more often than Standard.

 

[Wolfie]

thank you for the replies^^
How often do they even check tickets? Would it be worth just risking sitting there?

Look in the fares dispute section to see why that would be a really really bad idea.

 

[[.n]]

How easy is it to get free upgrades to 1st class? I know you have to pay for them normally, and usually I would either just buy 1st class seats or stop moaning, but I want to treat myself for once without spending.
Is it like on planes, where if there are empty seats they sometimes allow you to upgrade for free? Or does it depend on how the staff are feeling? Or, (most likely) is it only accessible if I pay?

please don't think I'm spoilt or ungrateful, I rarely get to travel by train and don't have the money to afford 1st class and just want to know if there's a loophole to get 1st class

BTW I'll be travelling by Avanti which is why I'm asking

As you mention travelling with Avanti - try the Seatfrog app - it allows you to bid for discounted 1st class tickets (or buy for a reduced price)

 

[tjhux]

As you mention travelling with Avanti - try the Seatfrog app - it allows you to bid for discounted 1st class tickets (or buy for a reduced price)

why do I hear about all these good apps and stuff after my tickets are booked :`(

 

[hexagon789]

why do I hear about all these good apps and stuff after my tickets are booked :`(

You still can bid for Seatfrog upgrades after buying a travel ticket. It will actually ask you if you already have a ticket for travel.

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

It’s very common to have your ticket checked in First Class, I would not recommend trying it without a valid ticket, or being prepared to pay for an upgrade while already being in possession of a Standard Class ticket.

Do the avanti train managers not often suggest over the PA to just sit in first class and pay for an upgrade if required when they come round. Im sure I have been on busy services that do this.

 

[Iskra]

Do the avanti train managers not often suggest over the PA to just sit in first class and pay for an upgrade if required when they come round. Im sure I have been on busy services that do this.

Yes, that would be paying for an upgrade while in possession of a standard class ticket.

Of course, if you’re prepared to pay for an upgrade but happen to sit in part of a train where the conductor can’t get to you on certain operators, you will essentially receive a free upgrade…

 

[AlterEgo]

First class is policed quite well on Avanti. I don't recommend sitting there and expecting to freeload.

 

[skyhigh]

Do the avanti train managers not often suggest over the PA to just sit in first class and pay for an upgrade if required when they come round. Im sure I have been on busy services that do this.

The OP said they can't afford First Class. I'm not sure taking a seat in First then declining to pay or attempting to move back to standard to avoid paying the upgrade (in the hope nobody would come round) would go down too well...

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

The OP said they can't afford First Class. I'm not sure taking a seat in First then declining to pay or attempting to move back to standard to avoid paying the upgrade (in the hope nobody would come round) would go down too well...

I missed that part sorry, I thought they were just hoping for a cheapish upgrade. Obviously I wasn't advocating any sort of fare avoidance.

 

[Wolfie]

The OP said they can't afford First Class. I'm not sure taking a seat in First then declining to pay or attempting to move back to standard to avoid paying the upgrade (in the hope nobody would come round) would go down too well...

That way lies a thread in Fare Disputes.....

 

[philosopher]

You can travel on Chiltern’s former Business Zone carriage on a Standard Class ticket on Chiltern’s Class 67 + Mark 3 services that travel between London Marylebone and Birmingham Moor Street.

Although not strictly First Class as it is permanently declassified, you get more comfortable 2+1 seating.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

My wife and I were on a two hour journey recently where we were the first to board in a relatively quiet 12 car service... as soon as we boarded, we checked which of two close together stations was the closest to where exactly we were going and sat ourselves down in the correct part of the train. Five minutes later, the guard came to see us, got out his pad of forms and said "I'm going to give you a free upgrade to first class, outwards and return."

...so it does happen, albeit as others have said - rarely.

I'd suggest, pick a quiet service, board at the start of the journey, be neatly dressed and pass the attitude test and you just might get offered...

 

[tjhux]

My wife and I were on a two hour journey recently where we were the first to board in a relatively quiet 12 car service... as soon as we boarded, we checked which of two close together stations was the closest to where exactly we were going and sat ourselves down in the correct part of the train. Five minutes later, the guard came to see us, got out his pad of forms and said "I'm going to give you a free upgrade to first class, outwards and return."

...so it does happen, albeit as others have said - rarely.

I'd suggest, pick a quiet service, board at the start of the journey, be neatly dressed and pass the attitude test and you just might get offered...

well considering it's a early-ish (10am) service going to up t'uh north I doubt it will be quiet. But I am starting at Euston so hopefully I get lucky

 

[Sealink]

Is it like on planes, where if there are empty seats they sometimes allow you to upgrade for free? Or does it depend on how the staff are feeling? Or, (most likely) is it only accessible if I pay?

The free upgrades on flights is entirely at the airlines convenience - when they have overbooked othe classes. The days of turning up in a suit or saying it's your birthday etc. cuts no ice with airlines these days.
Having said that, my brother and his wife were escorted from Economy to Business Class for the second half of their flight to New York as they bought the crew sweets.
I'd told him to do that but not to expect anything, so was pleasantly surprised when it happened.

Train companies are slowly catching up on what to do with unsold First Class tickets - using Seat Frog to auction seats.

 

[tjhux]

The free upgrades on flights is entirely at the airlines convenience - when they have overbooked over classes. The days of turning up in a suit or saying it's your birthday etc. cuts no ice with airlines these days.
Having said that, my brother and his wife were escorted from Economy to Business Class for the second half of their flight to New York as they bought the crew sweets.
I'd told him to do that but not to expect anything, so was pleasantly surprised when it happened.

Train companies are slowly catching up on what to do with unsold First Class tickets - using Seat Frog to auction seats.

it's been a couple years since I last used the "birthday" card to get an upgrade ahah

 

[Polarbear]

It was a long time ago (Cross Country with 47's & Mk2's), but I recall getting a "free" upgrade to 1st class once. I will qualify this by saying that it was New Years' Day, with hardly anyone on the train and I was fully prepared to pay the weekend first upgrade fee (which I think was £10 back then).

The conductor came up, checked my ticket & said that as the train was so quiet, no-one would notce & didn't bother charging me! Birmingam New Street to Oxford, diverted by Worcester so I feel as though I did quite well!

As others have said, this is very much the exception & I wouldn't expect that to happen these days.

 

[MalaiseForever]

Take your staff ID and ask nicely for a cheeky move into 1st... worked for me from Birmingham to Plymouth last week on a packed out 4 car Voyager.

 

[LittleRedTrain]

In 25 odd years of travelling all over the country I have only been 'upgraded' to First for free a very small number of times.
Once when accompanying someone travelling on a 'dependent' Priv ticket, on a quiet late night train, and we were invited into First by the guard and offered some free snacks.

Once on the seated coaches on a sleeper, when my reserved Standard seat was occupied by someone already asleep, so was given a free seat in First by the TM to avoid any kind of disturbance to other passengers.

Finally, when I've been accompanying someone with a mobility impairment who had Passenger Assistance booked, but Standard was massively overcrowded, so the assistance staff and TM agreed we could sit in vacant seats in First instead. (Also happened when my companion was in a wheelchair but the Standard wheelchair space was already in use).

The last way is most likely to lead to a free First upgrade, but there's a special level of Hell for anyone pretending to be disabled in order to blag an upgrade!

 

[KNN]

There are two actual answers for Avanti if you want to avoid the "unconventional" tactics.

Seatfrog where you bid for a cheap upgrade, a bit like ebay https://seatfrog.com/

Or if you are happy enough with sitting in a First Class carriage without the food and drink, you can upgrade to Standard Premium for a fixed price.

Standard Premium | Avanti West Coast

Upgrade to Standard Premium with Avanti West Coast. Travel in comfort with extra space and perks on your UK train journey for a premium experience.

www.avantiwestcoast.co.uk