Free Bus Travel for young people: Soon to be in England.

[mayneway]

And yet we've countless messages on here pre-free scheme of drivers moaning about anti-social behaviour on buses. I'm not disputing your experience, it is only natural that your views would be tainted by the experiences you have, but I feel that they may be isolated to the routes that you're driving and the area you're driving in. As has been outlined by plenty of people on the forum who likely travel on way more than the occasional bus (which I do travel on more than) there has been good experiences all round.

Your ignorance amazes me!
I’ve said previously that anti social behaviour across ALL bus stations in Greater Manchester is High, with the majority caused by kids within the age bracket for free travel. Again as I’ve previously said, TFGM as well as having their own travel safe officers patrolling the bus stations, also have to employ outside security firms to flank up security in bus stations. Bury and Rochdale are two prime examples!
There’s a hell of a lot of routes that serve both of them bus stations so I’d argue that it’s more than a personal experience which is why I’m negative to it all.

But again your most probable brief bus journeys each day counteract my knowledge and experience.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2026 ==

There's also a big difference between being objective and tarnishing a whole age range of people based upon a number of bad experiences.

If he thinks working at ASDA will be any less stressful in dealing with ASB I have some bad news...

So what to we do?? Put up with the anti social behaviour? Allow them to run fife on the buses smoking and causing damage?

 

[BuhSnarf]

So what to we do?? Put up with the anti social behaviour? Allow them to run fife on the buses smoking and causing damage?

I would suggest tackling the causes of anti social behaviour, rather than just not allowing any kids to benefit from free travel due to a SMALL minority.

If ASB is occuring on particuar routes have those routes patrolled by security officiers/police to ensure that drivers and the public feel safe. If TfGM have tracked the ASB and it's around certain times then restrict under 18 travel without an adult after that time. There's plenty of measures that can be taken rather than punishing the whole age group across the country.

Maybe we should close all shops and only serve people through a "night hatch" because there's lots of shoplifting?

 

[mayneway]

I would suggest tackling the causes of anti social behaviour, rather than just not allowing any kids to benefit from free travel due to a SMALL minority.

If ASB is occuring on particuar routes have those routes patrolled by security officiers/police to ensure that drivers and the public feel safe. If TfGM have tracked the ASB and it's around certain times then restrict under 18 travel without an adult after that time. There's plenty of measures that can be taken rather than punishing the whole age group across the country.

Maybe we should close all shops and only serve people through a "night hatch" because there's lots of shoplifting?

Firstly again your ring fencing it to certain routes. Please understand this ASB starts as they congregate and cause issues at interchanges/bus stations then pick random buses to travel on as they know they return to their ‘hub’ at the bus station.
They don’t sit waiting for certain buses, they are bored so jump on the first bus that comes along to pass some time and cause problems.

As for your second theory well I’ve just been to our local shop and there’s a huge sign on the door ‘two school kids at a time only’. Does the sign just apply to the naught teenagers? No

And again I don’t know where you live but our local Tesco express has all the ‘steal-able’ stuff behind Perspex screens now and you have to ask for it, butter and cheese is security tagged. Welcome to the real world!

 

[BuhSnarf]

Firstly again your ring fencing it to certain routes. Please understand this ASB starts as they congregate and cause issues at interchanges/bus stations then pick random buses to travel on as they know they return to their ‘hub’ at the bus station.
They don’t sit waiting for certain buses, they are bored so jump on the first bus that comes along to pass some time and cause problems.

As for your second theory well I’ve just been to our local shop and there’s a huge sign on the door ‘two school kids at a time only’. Does the sign just apply to the naught teenagers? No

And again I don’t know where you live but our local Tesco express has all the ‘steal-able’ stuff behind Perspex screens now and you have to ask for it, butter and cheese is security tagged. Welcome to the real world!

Well, let's never have anything nice then as clearly we've been defeated and these feral children are out causing havoc all day every day!

I'm just still shocked that the ASB stops at age 16 in Manchester, certainly when I lived in Manchester and Liverpool in the early 2000s and in the places I've lived since the ASB was not exclusive to the under 16s. Maybe we should just lock up all kids below the age of 16 as they'll only cause trouble!

 

[mayneway]

Well, let's never have anything nice then as clearly we've been defeated and these feral children are out causing havoc all day every day!

I'm just still shocked that the ASB stops at age 16 in Manchester, certainly when I lived in Manchester and Liverpool in the early 2000s and in the places I've lived since the ASB was not exclusive to the under 16s. Maybe we should just lock up all kids below the age of 16 as they'll only cause trouble!

I’ve never once suggested it stops at the age of 16, infact where I live our town centre is plagued with ASB by older men and women who shop lift, drink and cause trouble all day and night, but they are not causing issues on and around the bus network.

There is also isolated incidents on the buses by older people but the vast majority of trouble on a day to day basis is sadly caused by youths around 12-16.

 

[Megafuss]

Email from First (Potteries) this morning stating that from 6pm tonight, children must be accompanied by an adult travelling to/from Hanley Bus Station. The correspondence mentions ASB by name.

 

[BuhSnarf]

Email from First (Potteries) this morning stating that from 6pm tonight, children must be accompanied by an adult travelling to/from Hanley Bus Station. The correspondence mentions ASB by name.

They must have read my post above!

Sensible solution for post-6pm travel if they're seeing ASB on the routes.

 

[Deerfold]

Email from First (Potteries) this morning stating that from 6pm tonight, children must be accompanied by an adult travelling to/from Hanley Bus Station. The correspondence mentions ASB by name.

What happens if a child hasn't got the email and tries to get a bus home?

 

[mangad]

What happens if a child hasn't got the email and tries to get a bus home?

Naturally First don't put any of this information anywhere useful on their Potteries page. But in their press release (because I am sure all of First's customers are dedicated followers of the First Bus news page) they say:

The restriction on evening free travel for under-15s will remain in place until further notice. Drivers will continue to be able to exercise their discretion to provide free travel for unaccompanied children and young people if they are vulnerable or to ensure their safety.

Like I said many posts ago, we have as a country systematically destroyed any provision and services to give teenagers anything to do because it "costs too much". Well we as a nation reap what we sow, don't we?

 

[BuhSnarf]

Agree, the death of youth clubs and funding for organised teenage activities has a lot to answer for.

Of course, not that the kids 40 years ago were angels by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Megafuss]

What happens if a child hasn't got the email and tries to get a bus home?

"The restriction on evening free travel for under-15s will remain in place until further notice. Drivers will continue to be able to exercise their discretion to provide free travel for unaccompanied children and young people if they are vulnerable or to ensure their safety"

Let's see how that is applied in practice

 

[BuhSnarf]

"The restriction on evening free travel for under-15s will remain in place until further notice. Drivers will continue to be able to exercise their discretion to provide free travel for unaccompanied children and young people if they are vulnerable or to ensure their safety"

Let's see how that is applied in practice

I would hope that the driver uses their discretion to let on some genuine stranded kids, but denies boarding to those who they know will cause trouble.

 

[Djgr]

The success or otherwise of this initiative does not revolve around ASB.

It would be nice to move the discussion on to a bigger picture.

 

[mayneway]

I would hope that the driver uses their discretion to let on some genuine stranded kids, but denies boarding to those who they know will cause trouble.

You cannot look at a kid or group of kids at a bus stop and instantly assume they are going to cause issues.

The whole scheme needs looking at and refining, because what your going to rapidly find is that more and more operators walk away from the scheme as they deal with more ASB issues.

 

[Mark L]

D&G has said that it will only allow free travel for children after 6pm if they are accompanied by an adult. It is citing anti-social behaviour. See https://www.dgbus.co.uk/news/summer-bus-fare-offer/

 

[yorksrob]

It would be nice to move the discussion on to a bigger picture.

Which is surely, why are we giving free public transport, to a sector of the population that already has free board and lodging and in most cases, a paid for taxi service (the parents).

A discount, maybe, but free !

 

[mangad]

Which is surely, why are we giving free public transport, to a sector of the population that already has free board and lodging and in most cases, a paid for taxi service (the parents).

A discount, maybe, but free !

To help the parents out. Parenting not being cheap.

 

[YorkRailFan]

Which is surely, why are we giving free public transport, to a sector of the population that already has free board and lodging and in most cases, a paid for taxi service (the parents).

A discount, maybe, but free !

Not every parent has a car or is able to drive! They also have free board and lodging because they're not in employment or taxpayers for obvious reasons.

 

[yorksrob]

To help the parents out. Parenting not being cheap.

As was said in Saturday Night Fever "if you play, you pay"

Not every parent has a car or is able to drive! They also have free board and lodging because they're not in employment or taxpayers foro have free board and lodging because they're not in employment or taxpayers for obvious reasons.

Not every working age person has a car or is able to drive ? Why are they discriminated against ?

 

[johncrossley]

Free travel for kids is a novelty at the moment but if it was to continue indefinitely I would guess things would settle down eventually. When free travel for pensioners started in Scotland, there were long queues for express coaches to start with. If it did continue indefinitely then proof of age smartcards would be essential.

Presumably in areas where there are evening restrictions, under 16s are still able to travel if they pay the normal child fare, if child fares are available in that area, otherwise adult fare.

 

[JKP]

Free travel for kids is a novelty at the moment but if it was to continue indefinitely I would guess things would settle down eventually. When free travel for pensioners started in Scotland, there were long queues for express coaches to start with. If it did continue indefinitely then proof of age smartcards would be essential.

Presumably in areas where there are evening restrictions, under 16s are still able to travel if they pay the normal child fare, if child fares are available in that area, otherwise adult fare.

Out of curiosity what areas of the country do not offer child fares?

 

[RT4038]

Out of curiosity what areas of the country do not offer child fares?

I doubt there are many but there will be a lot of longer distance fares where the fare cap applies to both adult and child fares, meaning that they are the same.

 

[johncrossley]

If a particular area requires a specific proof of age smartcard, such as the London Zip card or Greater Manchester Igo card, then children from outside the region pay full fare unless they have gone to the trouble of obtaining that card, if it is even possible.

 

[Deerfold]

Presumably in areas where there are evening restrictions, under 16s are still able to travel if they pay the normal child fare, if child fares are available in that area, otherwise adult fare.

If operators in the scheme are being paid to carry children for free, are they allowed to charge them?

 

[YorkRailFan]

Not every working age person has a car or is able to drive ? Why are they discriminated against?

You said it yourself, they are working. They are generating some sort of income or if they aren't, can receive state support. A child is not generating income from employment.

 

[johncrossley]

Out of curiosity what areas of the country do not offer child fares?

Stagecoach Midlands says

Young Person

www.stagecoachbus.com

If you're under the age of 19, you qualify for our discounted DayRider and 7 or 28 day MegaRider tickets, which provide unlimited travel in your chosen zone during the time period you select.

If they are offering under 19s cheaper DayRiders on a commercial basis, maybe that means that regular single fares are not discounted for under 16s?

 

[yorksrob]

You said it yourself, they are working. They are generating some sort of income or if they aren't, can receive state support. A child is not generating income from employment.

Why do children need free bus transport ? They can kick around in the local park (as I was expected to do) or if they prefer a change of scene, use their pocket money to go further

 

[JKP]

If a particular area requires a specific proof of age smartcard, such as the London Zip card or Greater Manchester Igo card, then children from outside the region pay full fare unless they have gone to the trouble of obtaining that card, if it is even possible.

Thank you. How interesting that it is the two areas of the country that has franchising.

 

[johncrossley]

Thank you. How interesting that it is the two areas of the country that has franchising.

To be fair, Greater Manchester have had their Igo card for years.

 

[mayneway]

If a particular area requires a specific proof of age smartcard, such as the London Zip card or Greater Manchester Igo card, then children from outside the region pay full fare unless they have gone to the trouble of obtaining that card, if it is even possible.

Igo isn’t required for free travel in Manchester though. The TFGM memo sent to all drivers was that no proof of age, or igo was required. Effectively I’d someone requested a free child ticket to issue it to them.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Aug 2026 ==

Why do children need free bus transport ? They can kick around in the local park (as I was expected to do) or if they prefer a change of scene, use their pocket money to go further

Exactly!! And come September 1st when they all return to school it once again becomes the burden of the parents to pay for fares.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Aug 2026 ==

To be fair, Greater Manchester have had their Igo card for years.

They have but since franchising things have gone much more relaxed regarding the use of Igo cards. When everything was commercial the £1 child fare was only technically available along with the £2.50 day saver IF an igo card was produced otherwise they had to pay the non igo fare which was £1.75 and the day saver couldn’t be sold.

Since franchising has kicked in the non igo fares have disappeared and we are told to simply issue the £1 fares although the days saver should only be sold if an igo is produced.