Football

[richw]

The bottom line is that a court of law convicted him and I think we have to respect that.

I don't think we do, he was convicted by jury who have no legal qualifications and base on opinion on a topic.
There are far too many quashed convictions where prosecution was decided by jury.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

A precedent was set in 2007 when Oldham Athletic signed Lee Hughes who had been convicted of causing death by dangerous driving and had served half the six year sentence at the time of that signing.

Remember this posting that I made a few days ago?

 

[Antman]

I don't think we do, he was convicted by jury who have no legal qualifications and base on opinion on a topic.
There are far too many quashed convictions where prosecution was decided by jury.

Yes I appreciate that the system isn't foolproof but he has already lost an appeal against his conviction. It remains to be seen what will come of his latest attempt to clear his name.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The latest soundbite from the club only talks of an 80% chance of the deal being done.

Surely either it's a deal or it isn't? I can't understand what all the delay is about. I think Oldham Athletic are just asking for trouble but as you mentioned they do have previous with Lee Hughes.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Oldham Athletic are not now signing Evans due to public pressure, if they didn't forsee a public backlash they are either incredibly stupid or incredibly arrogant

 

[Clip]

Oldham Athletic are not now signing Evans due to public pressure, if they didn't forsee a public backlash they are either incredibly stupid or incredibly arrogant

Or they were testing the water to see how far they could push it before really making a decision.

 

[Antman]

Or they were testing the water to see how far they could push it before really making a decision.

It seems Evans is now showing some contrition, better late than never. Is he going for the sympathy vote now? Whoever has been advising him (Gordon Taylor and the PFA?) couldn't have done a worse job.

 

[andrew bell]

Or they were testing the water to see how far they could push it before really making a decision.

It seems Evans is now showing some contrition, better late than never. Is he going for the sympathy vote now? Whoever has been advising him (Gordon Taylor and the PFA?) couldn't have done a worse job.

As the saying goes, better late than never. By sounds of what BBC have on their article, it seems he hasn't completely admitted his guilt but is sorry for what had happened, which is what I, and many others, wanted to hear.

 

[Antman]

As the saying goes, better late than never. By sounds of what BBC have on their article, it seems he hasn't completely admitted his guilt but is sorry for what had happened, which is what I, and many others, wanted to hear.

He still maintains his innocence

 

[familyguy99]

I see Latics chairman have quit the club over Evans saga if Oldham Chronicle is right.

Corney quits as Ched deal OFF

LATICS was a club in crisis this afternoon after the deal for convicted rapist Ched Evans was sensationally halted and Simon Corney believed to have quit as chairman.

http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/89746/corney-quits-as-ched-deal-off

 

[Tetchytyke]

Add to what was seen on Ched Evans' website, and the conviction is very dodgy.

You should read the judgment from the appeal. Fascinating reading.

McDonald was acquitted because he could show he had a reasonable belief that the girl had consented to sex. This was because they met outside the hotel and returned to the hotel together.

Evans was probably convicted on two reasons. Firstly he did not come to the hotel with the girl and did not have a key for the hotel room- he had to persuade the night porter at the hotel to provide him with one. He basically let himself into the room. Secondly, Evans- having finished with the girl- did not leave the hotel with McDonald, instead choosing to climb out of the emergency fire door. I also wonder what the video footage from his two friends- who were filming the act through the open window on their mobile phones- showed.

Both facts combined meant that Evans found it a lot harder to show that he had a reasonable belief she consented. I know he tried to spin it that she consented because of how she was when she entered the hotel, but he omitted one crucial fact- she entered the hotel with his mate, not him (and his mate was acquitted).

There are a lot of half-truths coming out from Evans about the event, and the appeal case judgment puts a lot of them nicely to bed. People ought to read it before pontificating.

How many of us here have had sex with a girl after meeting in a nightclub etc after a lot of drinking. This case is effectively setting that we can be done for rape if the girl wakes up and regrets, and says she was too drunk to know if she consented.

McDonald- who picked a drunk girl up in a chip shop and took her to a hotel- was acquitted.

Evans- who didn't pick up a drunk girl and instead lied to get access to the hotel room she was in- was convicted.

People picking up drunk girls in nightclubs have little to fear. Although, personally speaking, I prefer not to have sex when the other person isn't sober enough to scream for more.

 

[andrew bell]

As the saying goes, better late than never. By sounds of what BBC have on their article, it seems he hasn't completely admitted his guilt but is sorry for what had happened, which is what I, and many others, wanted to hear.

He still maintains his innocence

But he's apologised. That's what a lot of people was unhappy about. He may maintain his innocence but has apologised for what may of happened.

 

[Antman]

But he's apologised. That's what a lot of people was unhappy about. He may maintain his innocence but has apologised for what may of happened.

But why didn't he do that a long time ago? And what about his victim who has been subjected to all sorts of abuse and intimidation, why has Evans not publicly condemned that? Hopefully he will now maintain a low profile until his appeal is decided.

 

[Tetchytyke]

But he's apologised. That's what a lot of people was unhappy about

He hasn't taken the website (funded by his girlfriend's father) identifying his victim down, I notice...

 

[bb21]

And what about his victim who has been subjected to all sorts of abuse and intimidation, why has Evans not publicly condemned that?

It would seem that he has now.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30727380

Ched Evans: Convicted rapist and footballer issues apology

Footballer Ched Evans has apologised "for the effects" of his actions in 2011 but continues to maintain his innocence over his rape conviction.
Evans issued a statement hours after it emerged League One side Oldham Athletic would not be signing the player.
He was jailed in April 2012 for raping a woman, 19, at a north Wales hotel.
The 26-year-old said: "I wholeheartedly apologise for the effects that night in Rhyl has had on many people, not least the woman concerned."

...

Oldham pulled out of plans to sign the player on Thursday, citing threats made to staff and their families had the deal gone ahead.
A club director told BBC sports editor Dan Roan that a staff member was informed a named relative would be raped if the deal went ahead.

...

"Finally, it has been claimed that those using social media in an abusive and vindictive way towards this woman are supporters of mine. I wish to make it clear that these people are not my supporters and I condemn their actions entirely and will continue to do so."

...

I find the threats to staff at the club equally appalling.

He hasn't taken the website (funded by his girlfriend's father) identifying his victim down, I notice...

Not gonna make much of a difference now I guess, but it would be a nice gesture, assuming that it were indeed funded this way. (I have no knowledge either way.)

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I find the threats to staff at the club equally appalling.

With that I totally concur. How amazing that in the week that has seen so many expressions of support for freedom of speech in Britain after the atrocity that occurred in Paris is we find a selective mindset of certain individuals who do have their own vindictive views on how society should act...

 

[CC 72100]

With that I totally concur. How amazing that in the week that has seen so many expressions of support for freedom of speech in Britain after the atrocity that occurred in Paris is we find a selective mindset of certain individuals who do have their own vindictive views on how society should act...

Paul - you took the words right out of my mouth. I saw the alleged threats as a sad irony given the events yesterday (and events this morning in Montrouge).

 

[Tetchytyke]

I find the threats to staff at the club equally appalling.

So do I, although it seems Greater Manchester Police have no knowledge of these "threats" (David Conn is a senior football journalist with the Guardian and usually gets these things right).

 

[Antman]

So do I, although it seems Greater Manchester Police have no knowledge of these "threats" (David Conn is a senior football journalist with the Guardian and usually gets these things right).

Hmmm, so why have Oldham Athletic not reported these death threats to the police? This whole saga stinks!

 

[ReverendFozz]

Someone was telling me earlier that there was a chance Ched Evans may look to move abroad, but the Football Association would and try to block it for some reason or other...

Could he actually be prevented from going anywhere in the EU and would the EU legal team have a field day if Ched Evans was banned from leaving the country?

I dont know much about the law which I am asking

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Someone was telling me earlier that there was a chance Ched Evans may look to move abroad, but the Football Association would and try to block it for some reason or other...

Could he actually be prevented from going anywhere in the EU and would the EU legal team have a field day if Ched Evans was banned from leaving the country?

I dont know much about the law which I am asking

There is surely somewhat a difference in the Freedom of Movement in the EC to an unfettered person when compared with someone in England only part-way through the unfinished part of a prison sentence that is spent in the English community.

Like you, I would like to see the legal definition of the matter that you have raised.

 

[ReverendFozz]

There is surely somewhat a difference in the Freedom of Movement in the EC to an unfettered person when compared with someone in England only part-way through the unfinished part of a prison sentence that is spent in the English community.

Like you, I would like to see the legal definition of the matter that you have raised.

I am taking a guess, but would the only thing stopping him from leaving the country would be the terms of his licence on release, and isn't he on probation for the remainder of the 5 year sentence?

 

[andrew bell]

Someone was telling me earlier that there was a chance Ched Evans may look to move abroad, but the Football Association would and try to block it for some reason or other...

Could he actually be prevented from going anywhere in the EU and would the EU legal team have a field day if Ched Evans was banned from leaving the country?

I dont know much about the law which I am asking

Ministry of Justice has already said if Ched Evans does resume his career it will not be abroad as a clause of his early release. If that means until his licence is over and he can't leave the UK I'm not sure, but he can't reside abroad

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Hmmm, so why have Oldham Athletic not reported these death threats to the police? This whole saga stinks!

Perhaps there is some confusion here, but late this afternoon, the club have made a statement to the effect that these threats had been made and they are bound to have passed this information on to the police.

 

[ReverendFozz]

Ministry of Justice has already said if Ched Evans does resume his career it will not be abroad as a clause of his early release. If that means until his licence is over and he can't leave the UK I'm not sure, but he can't reside abroad

Because I read some team in Malta fancied signing him, I guess that is why the MOJ are publically saying it wont happen...

When it comes to working in football again, not really sure what I think about it, I would not want the controversy sorrounding my team though, that is not to say I think he should not work again...

I think right now, he should concentrate on his appeal, if, as he says, he innocent.

I dont know if it is a good comparison, but I can remember Craig Thomson of Hearts going to Lithuania around the time of his conviction for trying to groom young girls.

The other case that comes to mind is Graham Rix, had sex with a 15 year old and got straight back into the game on release, as did Marlon King after a sexual assault conviction...

 

[Antman]

Perhaps there is some confusion here, but late this afternoon, the club have made a statement to the effect that these threats had been made and they are bound to have passed this information on to the police.

Did you see the link Artic Troll posted above?

 

[ReverendFozz]

Not sure if it has been discussed...

I See Ched Evans website, set up by his father in law is being investigated by the attorney general

Ched Evans: Attorney general's office probe into website

The attorney general's office is considering whether a website supporting convicted rapist Ched Evans breached contempt of court laws.

This follows a letter of complaint from the victim's father in November.

A spokeswoman confirmed that a senior lawyer was "considering the issues" and said it was hoped a conclusion would be reached "shortly".

Oldham Athletic are considering whether to sign the footballer, who was freed from prison last October.

Prime Minister David Cameron said he expected any club considering hiring the 26-year-old player to "weigh their decisions very carefully".

'Number of issues'

A spokeswoman for the attorney general's office said: "The father of Ched Evans' victim asked the attorney general to consider a number of issues in relation to the website.

"One of our senior lawyers has been seriously considering the issues raised in the letter since we received it and we hope to reach a conclusion shortly."

The attorney general's office could order the chedevans.com website to be taken down.

It could also make a recommendation for criminal prosecution.

Protests innocence

Evans, who previously played for clubs including Manchester City and Sheffield United, was jailed in April 2012 for raping a woman in Rhyl, North Wales.

He was released from prison in October after serving half of the five-year sentence.

Mr Evans continues to protest his innocence, and an investigation into his conviction by the Criminal Cases Review Commission is under way.

Oldham Athletic has said talks about a possible signing of Mr Evans remain ongoing.

The League One club's chief executive Neil Joy said on Tuesday there would be no announcement for the time being, but did not rule out taking on the former Sheffield United star.

"Oldham Athletic is not at this stage making any official announcement with regard to the speculation concerning Ched Evans.

"Whilst acknowledging the considerable media attention, we continue to have conversations with representative bodies such as the PFA and will conduct due diligence with regard to any decision we make on this matter."

More than 50,000 people have signed an online petition urging Oldham not to sign the Wales international striker.

The woman who started the petition, who uses the pseudonym Jean Hachet, told the BBC: "He was convicted of rape and he still doesn't acknowledge it was rape. And that's the incredibly dangerous message".

'Role models'

Downing Street said on Tuesday that Prime Minister David Cameron expects any football club considering hiring Mr Evans to "weigh their decisions very carefully",

"Ultimately, it is for employers to take decisions, but the prime minister does think that footballers are role models and he is sure that any potential would-be clubs and employers will weigh their decisions very carefully," a spokesman said.

On Monday Labour leader Ed Miliband said he would not sign Evans if he was in Oldham's "shoes".

"He hasn't shown remorse and I wouldn't take him on," Miliband told BBC Radio Manchester.

 

[richw]

As the saying goes, better late than never. By sounds of what BBC have on their article, it seems he hasn't completely admitted his guilt but is sorry for what had happened, which is what I, and many others, wanted to hear.

He has now issued a statement that his legal advisors told him to say nothing, including making any form of apology.

So do I, although it seems Greater Manchester Police have no knowledge of these "threats" (David Conn is a senior football journalist with the Guardian and usually gets these things right).

GMP were claiming no knowledge even after their chief had made public comment that he was aware of comments but couldn't do anything until the club reported.

Someone was telling me earlier that there was a chance Ched Evans may look to move abroad, but the Football Association would and try to block it for some reason or other...

Could he actually be prevented from going anywhere in the EU and would the EU legal team have a field day if Ched Evans was banned from leaving the country?

I dont know much about the law which I am asking

I believe if he is on sex offenders register he would have to live in the UK.
Probation or early release may also prevent living abroad.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Did you see the link Artic Troll posted above?

Indeed I did, but my posting was made at a later time in the afternoon when a senior official of the club appeared on television to categorically state that those threats HAD been made. Are you saying that this club official was being untruthful in his statement that was made on national television?

 

[Antman]

Indeed I did, but my posting was made at a later time in the afternoon when a senior official of the club appeared on television to categorically state that those threats HAD been made. Are you saying that this club official was being untruthful in his statement that was made on national television?

Well you do have to wonder why these alleged threats have not been reported to the police

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Well you do have to wonder why these alleged threats have not been reported to the police

Have the police authorities themselves made a statement to that effect after the statement by the senior official of the club was made on national television. I cannot believe that the police would let any journalist make any such statement on their behalf after such a categorical statement was made.

Did you personally see the early evening television news coverage of that statement made by the senior club official where he categorically stated the types of threats that had been made against those employed by the football club? If you did, could the matter have been made any clearer in what was said?

 

[Antman]

Have the police authorities themselves made a statement to that effect after the statement by the senior official of the club was made on national television. I cannot believe that the police would let any journalist make any such statement on their behalf after such a categorical statement was made.

Did you personally see the early evening television news coverage of that statement made by the senior club official where he categorically stated the types of threats that had been made against those employed by the football club? If you did, could the matter have been made any clearer in what was said?

GMP are not aware of any threats being made against anybody connected with Oldham Athletic................make of that what you will.