Football

[richw]

I haven't seen the match but it is good to see that the referee still applied that laws of the game and dismissed the Bradford 'keeper, seen a lot of idiots complaining about ruining Matt Duke's big day... :roll:

To be fair a lot are comparing to Joe Hart's earlier on where Hart didnt even get booked. Dukes foul was pretty much a copy of Harts earlier today to what I've heard.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

To me though that says a lot more about the ref at Man City v Chelsea than the one at Swansea v Bradford.

 

[richw]

To me though that says a lot more about the ref at Man City v Chelsea than the one at Swansea v Bradford.

From my understanding of the rules, Kevin Friend was the referee with the correct decision.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

From my understanding of the rules, Kevin Friend was the referee with the correct decision.

I agree. The one at Man City v Chelsea who failed to dismiss Hart was wrong IMO and as such I don't think a valid comparison can be drawn along the line of 'But Hart didn't get sent of, why should Duke? Its ruined his big day blah blah blah' like I've seen some say.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

From my understanding of the rules, Kevin Friend was the referee with the correct decision.

Let us remember what the match score was at the time (3-0) when the incident involving the Bradford City goalkeeper occurred. Bradford City will have had far more finance generated for the club during this amazing cup run than the club could have ever envisaged at the start of the 2012/3 football season.

 

[richw]

Let us remember what the match score was at the time when the incident involving the Bradford City goalkeeper occurred. Bradford City will have had far more finance generated for the club during this amazing cup run than the club could have ever envisaged at the start of the 2012/3 football season.

but why should the rules be changed just because of the score line?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
An interesting fact 13 years ago today Bradford drew 1-1 with Villa in the premier league, Swansea drew 0-0 with Hull City in Division 3 (now league 2)

 

[DarloRich]

IN making the right decision today at Wembley the referee made the wrong decision from a sporting point of view. The application of common sense in that situation would have been so much better.

I understand the rules is rules brigade but i still dont think natural justice was served by the outcome.

( Plus i wonder how many would say the same thing if their team were involved!)

 

[Oswyntail]

....I understand the rules is rules brigade but i still dont think natural justice was served by the outcome. ....

What on earth is natural justice in this situation? Besides, I very much doubt he will suffer much, other than embarrassment, and it gave the sub goalie a chance to play at Wembley.
And you can imagine the effects of the precedent. SAF thirty years down the line clocking the ref with his zimmer, growling "You shunna send him off - the score was 3-0"

 

[MidnightFlyer]

IN making the right decision today at Wembley the referee made the wrong decision from a sporting point of view. The application of common sense in that situation would have been so much better.

The application of common sense in the ref's instance is to do his job properly. That he did. No matter what the circumstances, if they're playing on Hackney Marsh or Wembley, whether it's a mediocre mid-table League 1 clash or a League Cup or World Cup final, the rules should be applied equally and fairly, as Mr Friend did here. And yes, if the final involved Rangers I would be saying the same thing!

 

[D841 Roebuck]

The situation could be solved by giving the offending team a choice:

A - as now, player sent off, sub goalie has the chance to save the penalty.

B - no sending off, but no goalkeeper/defender for the penalty. The fouled forward kicks it into an empty net (or rolls it wide if Fernando Torres... )

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

but why should the rules be changed just because of the score line?

Perhaps you were thinking of another posting when you made this posting that appeared to be in a response to one that I had made. All I said in my posting was to remember what the scoreline was at the time of the incident (3-0), to reflect that the refereeing decision would not have made much change to the final outcome of the match. I made no comment whatsoever about any rule changes, nor would I ever remotely consider such a course of action.

 

[anthony263]

Good on Swansea for wining today certainly made me pleased especially since I know there will be some very depressed Cardiff city fans who will not be pleased about Swansea playing in europe next season especially if Cardiff finally get themselves promoted.

Of course that depends on Cardiff not slipping up as usual.

 

[richw]

Good on Swansea for wining today certainly made me pleased especially since I know there will be some very depressed Cardiff city fans who will not be pleased about Swansea playing in europe next season especially if Cardiff finally get themselves promoted.

Of course that depends on Cardiff not slipping up as usual.

Several Cardiff supporters I know claim they are happy a welsh team will be in Europe.

 

[DarloRich]

The application of common sense in the ref's instance is to do his job properly. That he did. No matter what the circumstances, if they're playing on Hackney Marsh or Wembley, whether it's a mediocre mid-table League 1 clash or a League Cup or World Cup final, the rules should be applied equally and fairly, as Mr Friend did here. And yes, if the final involved Rangers I would be saying the same thing!

What on earth is natural justice in this situation? Besides, I very much doubt he will suffer much, other than embarrassment, and it gave the sub goalie a chance to play at Wembley.
And you can imagine the effects of the precedent. SAF thirty years down the line clocking the ref with his zimmer, growling "You shunna send him off - the score was 3-0"

I expected that - A total lack of understanding of the essence of what is important. Knowing the cost of everything and the value of nothing. :roll:

A penalty and a yellow card would have been punishment enough.

(btw - The Hart situation looked VERY similar form where i was sitting - strange that!)

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Then what is important here in your eyes? As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't matter who it is, where, why, when etc. If he was the last man and denied a clear goal-scoring opportunity he should be dismissed from the field of play. I don't care if it's his big day out or whatever, it's immaterial, he should have the laws of the game applied to him.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
... And yes, I do think Hart should have been dismissed too.

 

[DarloRich]

Then what is important here in your eyes? As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't matter who it is, where, why, when etc. If he was the last man and denied a clear goal-scoring opportunity he should be dismissed from the field of play. I don't care if it's his big day out or whatever, it's immaterial, he should have the laws of the game applied to him.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
... And yes, I do think Hart should have been dismissed too.

I think it was a very easy decision to send off the Bradford keeper, i doubt De Gea would have been sent off.

Of course under the laws of the game the referee made the right decision. I just think sometimes the wrong decision can be the right one. A little brain power and common sense would have been better applied here than the letter of the law.

With two even sides then the referee is right to send the keeper off, however this was a bad enough miss match without making it more embarrassing. Perhaps it is because i support one of the ****ty little small clubs no one cares about that i feel so strongly about this.

(and i still dont believe you would say the same thing with Rangers 0-0 with 10 minutes left in the cup final! )

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Well it did happen back in the 2006 Champions League Final when Jens Lehmann was dismissed for Arsenal for the same offence, so by all means it occurs to the big teams.

(and i still dont believe you would say the same thing with Rangers 0-0 with 10 minutes left in the cup final! )

I would, I'd rather we won a cup fairly and by the rules of the game rather than have to rely on someone else's charity to get by. If I'm being totally honest it would tarnish if the victory for me.

 

[DarloRich]

Well it did happen back in the 2006 Champions League Final when Jens Lehmann was dismissed for Arsenal for the same offence, so by all means it occurs to the big teams.



I would, I'd rather we won a cup fairly and by the rules of the game rather than have to rely on someone else's charity to get by. If I'm being totally honest it would tarnish if the victory for me.

We shall have to agree to disagree i am afraid!

I think under the laws of the game the referee was right to send the keeper off. I think in being right he was very wrong!

 

[andrew bell]

you could tell by looking at Kevin friend's expression before he produced the red card was one of i don't want to but i have to produce a red card. he most certainly got it right, but it was with a very heavy heart

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

btw - The Hart situation looked VERY similar form where i was sitting - strange that!

I saw an opinion offered on BT Yahoo Sport forum that in the case of Hart, the reason why he was not given a red card in addition to the penalty being given, was that the striker was heading away from the goal at the time that the contact was made. Was this true or not ?

 

[Butts]

I thought Colin Murray had got the boot from MOD2 but he popped up again last night - does his agreement continue till the end of the season ?

 

[gazzak]

What most seem to forget is that if the Ref at Wembley had shown leniency then he'd probably have been demoted for a while. There is no give and take when it comes to goal scoring opportunities.

For the record, the Bradford keeper prevented a certain goal, the Man City keeper had a covering defender so it was no means going to be a certain goal.

 

[Oswyntail]

I expected that - A total lack of understanding of the essence of what is important. Knowing the cost of everything and the value of nothing. :roll:...

That is completely and utterly off beam, and you know it. It is the sort of soppy sentimentality that seems endemic in football. The whole point of sport is that there are rules, and they are followed. Should Bradman have been recalled to the wicket in his last test? Perhaps Lance Armstrong should be forgiven his cheating because he also had cancer. It is also deeply patronising to the "little" teams - of course they can't compete without a little hand from the ref, but try telling that to Arsenal or Aston Villa. And what value would actually have been added? A little bit more erosion of the morality that says if you break the rules you are punished? Or do you want to have the value of sport in right-on primary schools, where there are no losers? Piffle.

 

[andrew bell]

I thought Colin Murray had got the boot from MOD2 but he popped up again last night - does his agreement continue till the end of the season ?

His contract for MOTD2 has not been renewed from the end of the season. He will continue to present the show until 1 or 2 weeks before the season ends when the normal show will be shifted over due to the games being played on Sundays

 

[Geezertronic]

Referees cannot win. When they make a mistake they get slated, when they make the correct decision they get slated too.

It was a Red card according to the laws of the game, plain and simple. Whether it was morally right or not is irrelevant.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I recently noticed a comment made on a general sports forum where the question was carefully phrased...."Who was the first player to be sent off in a Wembley final ?"

"Kevin Moran of Manchester United in the 1985 FA Cup Final"... was the immediate answer....... "Not so", said the sage who set the question... "Look at the actual question that was asked".

Two days elapsed, then a bright spark came up with the correct answer..."Syd Hynes of Leeds, in the 1971 Rugby League Challenge Cup Final against Leigh".

Just goes to show that many football supporters assume that their sport is the only one that counts...:roll:

 

[MidnightFlyer]

To be fair though I think 99% of people would assume that anything wth regard to Wembley would be asked about football, and I certainly wouldn't say football is the only sport that counts! It's just rather easy to forget with the decades of association and hunreds of matches there that something other than football does take place there.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

West Ham United 2...Tottenham Hotspur 3

Another two more goals from Gareth Bale sees Tottenham Hotspur leapfrog over Chelsea in to third place in the Premiership.

 

[Oswyntail]

... Tottenham Hotspur leapfrog over Chelsea in to third place in the Premiership.

And the Great Toon leapfrog West Ham on......alphabetical order

 

[Geezertronic]

I was quite surprised that a Google search suggests that Paul Scholes was the first and only (football) player who was sent off whilst playing for England at the old Wembley (vs Sweden in 1999). The same Google search suggests that David Beckham is the only player to be sent off twice whilst playing for England (1998 vs Argentina and 2005 vs Austria