First Group: General Discussion

[BBC]

I'd be surprised if the 110 arrive in one year - more likely over two or three. Even then, there may well be cascades out of the region. Certainly, there's a lot of middle aged deckers in Bristol but the same is true of many other areas.

You're right. On their application the buses are due to be delivered from 2016-2019.

 

[THarris123]

Bath could get a lot of 57/8/9 plate volvo deckers from bristol if they win the bid.

Don't think many will head over to Bath. Most I suspect will head elsewhere. I suspect most of the 57 plates will stay in Bristol - they've branded some of them and not the 58 plates, which may suggest that they might stay for work at Hengrove or other routes in LH that don't get the gas buses.

I'd like to see some of the 58 plate B9s head to Kernow and BoS. The oldest should be the first to go and I still think that the 51 plate ALXs will head to Kernow.

 

[winston270twm]

The new vehicle order is being announced tomorrow.

A breakdown of First Groups 2016 new bus order is available to view now in the latest Bus & Coach buyer, I wouldn't get too over excited.....

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

A breakdown of First Groups 2016 new bus order is available to view now in the latest Bus & Coach buyer, I wouldn't get too over excited.....

Streetdecks, Streetlites, e400mmc, e200mmc then??

The disposition was where I thought you might get surprises but as Kernow has already been announced, that was probably the biggest one anyway

 

[Volvodart]

https://www.firstgroup.com/about-us/news/firstgroup-announces-%C2%A370m-investment-305-new-buses

FirstGroup announces £70m investment in 305 new buses
FirstGroup, the leading transport operator in the UK and North America, today announced that its bus division has ordered 305 new vehicles worth £70m.

The order by First Bus underlines its commitment to provide high quality services for its customers and partners and brings the company’s investment over the last six years to £455m in 2,500 new vehicles.

Today’s order also consolidates First Bus’s position as one of the largest operators of Low Carbon Emission Buses in the UK. 87% of the new vehicles will be Department for Transport approved ‘low carbon certified’, which First Bus estimates will save 4 million kg of CO2 per year. The 2016/17 investment will bring the company’s fleet of low carbon certified vehicles to around 1,000, believed to be one of the largest in the UK, saving in total an estimated 14.5 million kg of CO2 annually.

All 305 new buses will be fitted with the latest Euro VI engines, which produce 95% less oxides of nitrogen (NOx) emissions compared to buses with Euro V engines and as a result will help improve air quality in the towns and cities in which First Bus operates.

The order is good news for customers. All the new buses will feature the latest technology, with complementary on board Wi-Fi providing passengers with free internet access, and by the end of the financial year around 60% of the 6,300 First Bus fleet will be Wi-Fi enabled. Most passengers will also benefit from leather seats, while some of the new vehicles will be fitted with next stop audio-visual display screens and around 30% with USB charging points, allowing customers to charge their phones and tablets on the move.

The investment in technology to help keep customers connected on board reflects the commitment by First Bus to deliver a customer centric service that is simple, smart and seamless. Many First Bus customers are already benefiting from smart ticketing options and Real Time Information, while all customers can use their mobile phones as bus tickets through the company’s m-Ticket option. The company’s drive for innovative customer friendly improvements will continue through 2016/17.

With 98% of the order to be manufactured in the UK, the fleet investment by First Bus provides a big boost to British manufacturing helping to support hundreds of UK jobs. Scottish firm ADL will manufacture 204 vehicles, while Northern Ireland’s Wrightbus has secured an order for 91 buses, and Volvo has won a contract to build 10 coach chassis in Sweden, with the bodies manufactured by ADL.

Giles Fearnley, Managing Director of First Bus, said the order, which comprises 204 double deckers (the largest ever First Bus order of double deckers), will help encourage more customers across the UK to use the bus: “This is great news for First Bus customers. We are determined to make the bus a more compelling proposition, attract more customers and grow our business. Ensuring that our customers travel in modern, comfortable, fit for purpose vehicles which provide added value such as free Wi-Fi and USB charging is pivotal to our customer engagement strategy and our future success.”

He continued: “In 2015, we announced the largest order on record in the UK for vehicles with Euro VI engines, complementing efforts from our partners in local councils to improve air quality in our towns and cities. Our 2016 order again reflects our commitment to working with our partners to reduce emissions and improve the environment.”

“First Bus is proud to continue supporting British bus manufacturers,” he added. “Our manufacturing partners continue to lead the world in quality, innovation, fuel efficiency and value for money. I’m pleased that we’ve again invested heavily in our fleet and our tradition of supporting the British manufacturing industry remains strong.”

Recognising the commitment by First Bus to its partnerships, by way of many examples 14 new buses will enter service in Doncaster this month (April) marking the start of the ‘Doncaster Bus Partnership’ in May. The successful Sheffield Bus Partnership will benefit from a further 10 new vehicles. The strong developing partnership in Cornwall will see First Bus invest £7.1m in 30 new vehicles. Meanwhile thanks to high profile partnerships in the West of England, particularly Bristol, 68 new vehicles worth £18.1m are earmarked for its operations.

Full details of the First Bus order:

Manufacturer
Vehicle Model
Quantity
ADL / Volvo
Plaxton (ADL) body / B11R (Volvo) chassis coaches
10
ADL
Enviro 200 MMC single decker
71
ADL
Enviro 400 MMC double decker
80
ADL
Enviro 400 MMC Gyro double decker
8
ADL
Enviro 400 double decker (exact spec to be confirmed)
45
Wrightbus
StreetDeck double decker
71
Wrightbus
StreetLite Max single decker
20

 

[Robertj21a]

Wrightbus not doing so well with their offerings this year. I'm told that there have been 'far too many' problems with some of the Streetdecks.

 

[THarris123]

Do we know what will be for where?

We know that
30 E400s for Kernow
12 E400s for Bristol
8 E400s for Bath
3 Streetdecks for Bristol

What are the vehicles going to Yorkshire?

Quite a lot of E200s on order too. I was rather surprised by that.

Are the 45 don't know spec E400s for Bristol? That would add up in WoE to 68.
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Wonder if the Gyro ones are for Bath?

Of course Streetdeck order includes 25 to Leicester and 8 to Norwich.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Do we know what will be for where?

We know that
30 E400s for Kernow
12 E400s for Bristol
8 E400s for Bath
3 Streetdecks for Bristol

What are the vehicles going to Yorkshire?

Quite a lot of E200s on order too. I was rather surprised by that.

Are the 45 don't know spec E400s for Bristol? That would add up in WoE to 68.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Wonder if the Gyro ones are for Bath?

Of course Streetdeck order includes 25 to Leicester and 8 to Norwich.

Streetlites to Donny and Rotherham and Streetdecks to Bramley reported.

Suspected e200s would feature - ADL have moved ahead of Wright in terms of quality.

 

[BBC]

No mention of gas bus bid....

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

No mention of gas bus bid....

That may be the e400 spec to be confirmed

 

[BBC]

That may be the e400 spec to be confirmed

Seem far too few, they outlined 75 in the financial year 2016/17 in the bid. But you're probably right.

 

[83G/84D]

The Volvo B8RLE isn't attracting many orders - wonder why?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The Volvo B8RLE isn't attracting many orders - wonder why?

Too expensive to buy. Too expensive to run.

The UK bus market has moved on to lightweight, fuel efficient vehicles. Also, too expensive to repair when they do go wrong!

 

[overthewater]

Are the holding back the Gas bus announcement until after the local elections?

 

[83G/84D]

Too expensive to buy. Too expensive to run.

The UK bus market has moved on to lightweight, fuel efficient vehicles. Also, too expensive to repair when they do go wrong!

I thought that might be the reason, cheers. Shame I'd have liked to have seen them on the 14/18 in Kernow.

 

[Robertj21a]

Do we know what will be for where?

We know that
30 E400s for Kernow
12 E400s for Bristol
8 E400s for Bath
3 Streetdecks for Bristol

What are the vehicles going to Yorkshire?

Quite a lot of E200s on order too. I was rather surprised by that.

Are the 45 don't know spec E400s for Bristol? That would add up in WoE to 68.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Wonder if the Gyro ones are for Bath?

Of course Streetdeck order includes 25 to Leicester and 8 to Norwich.

Streetdeck order does NOT include the 25 (Leicester) and 9 (Norwich) that were delivered recently - they were additional to the main 2015 order.

 

[THarris123]

Streetdeck order does NOT include the 25 (Leicester) and 9 (Norwich) that were delivered recently - they were additional to the main 2015 order.

Thanks for confirming!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Streetdeck order does NOT include the 25 (Leicester) and 9 (Norwich) that were delivered recently - they were additional to the main 2015 order.

I confess that I didn't know it was a supplementary order. That makes more sense. Is that clearing out the last ALXs and e400s from Leicester? Anything else - not an operation I come across much

 

[Robertj21a]

I confess that I didn't know it was a supplementary order. That makes more sense. Is that clearing out the last ALXs and e400s from Leicester? Anything else - not an operation I come across much

Yes, all the ex-Leicester E400s moved on to Bristol (first batch) or Basildon (recent batch). Just 2 x ALX400s are left, expected to go to First West Yorkshire any day.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Yes, all the ex-Leicester E400s moved on to Bristol (first batch) or Basildon (recent batch). Just 2 x ALX400s are left, expected to go to First West Yorkshire any day.

I knew a couple of ALXs were hanging on - saw one as I wandered through Beaumont Leys on business a couple of months ago so expected it to be on its way!

Does that leave the Gemini B7s behind?

 

[overthewater]

Does this mean the only deckers in Leicester will soon be the 25 Streetdeck?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Does this mean the only deckers in Leicester will soon be the 25 Streetdeck?

They already have some Streetdecks from last year

 

[Robertj21a]

They already have some Streetdecks from last year

Leicester had 5 Streetdecks last year plus the 25 just delivered. There's also 8 Volvo/Geminis and the 2 AX400s for deckers. Single decks include two batches of Streetlites and a number of Volvo B7/Wright.

 

[overthewater]

Cheers to both.

 

[tbtc]

So 480 for Stagecoach versus 305 for First?

 

[overthewater]

So 480 for Stagecoach versus 305 for First?

Stagecoach is much bigger remember, but I have to agree I was expecting at least 400 new buses from First, I also expecting alot more deckers.

 

[THarris123]

Stagecoach is much bigger remember, but I have to agree I was expecting at least 400 new buses from First, I also expecting alot more deckers.

How can you expect more from First? The last couple of years they've got in 350-400 ish, most of which are single deck, which are cheaper than deckers. First aren't really in the best financial situation, so I think it is about right.
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Streetlites to Donny and Rotherham and Streetdecks to Bramley reported.

Suspected e200s would feature - ADL have moved ahead of Wright in terms of quality.

Is that all the 20 Streetlites to Doncaster and Rotherham and all the 68 Streetdecks to Bramley?

Where are the other 38 E400s going and all the E200s? I assume from Firsts article that 10 E200s will be for Sheffield?

Scotland doesn't get a mention in the article either, so could we see the rest go to somewhere like Manchester? Maybe a few to Cymru?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

£97m vs £70m is perhaps a more valid comparison esp as Stagecoach have ordered 45 bread vans
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

How can you expect more from First? The last couple of years they've got in 350-400 ish, most of which are single deck, which are cheaper than deckers. First aren't really in the best financial situation, so I think it is about right.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Is that all the 20 Streetlites to Doncaster and Rotherham and all the 68 Streetdecks to Bramley?

Where are the other 38 E400s going and all the E200s? I assume from Firsts article that 10 E200s will be for Sheffield?

Scotland doesn't get a mention in the article either, so could we see the rest go to somewhere like Manchester? Maybe a few to Cymru?

Think 30-ish to Bramley

 

[507021]

I assume from Firsts article that 10 E200s will be for Sheffield?

I'd have thought Enviro400s would be more likely for Sheffield, personally.

 

[THarris123]

I'd have thought Enviro400s would be more likely for Sheffield, personally.

I thought in the article it said single deckers?