First Group: General Discussion

[Volvodart]

The strike starting tomorrow has been suspended with the drivers being balloted on a final offer.

https://www.firstgroup.com/aberdeen...en-reach-agreement-unite-full-and-final-offer

 

[overthewater]

The strike starting tomorrow has been suspended with the drivers being balloted on a final offer.

https://www.firstgroup.com/aberdeen...en-reach-agreement-unite-full-and-final-offer

That is good news. What is revised hours of work and shift patterns ?

 

[winston270twm]

First Group have received a takeover approach of which the initial proposal has been rejected:
http://otp.investis.com/clients/uk/first_group/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=858&newsid=998669

 

[overthewater]

First Group have received a takeover approach of which the initial proposal has been rejected:
http://otp.investis.com/clients/uk/first_group/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=858&newsid=998669

Everyone saw that coming, but thankful there rejected it. Apollo Management seem like errr, Vultures but of course someone else might throw their hat into the ring now...

 

[Robertj21a]

First Group have received a takeover approach of which the initial proposal has been rejected:
http://otp.investis.com/clients/uk/first_group/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=858&newsid=998669

At least that should wake them up a bit. Interesting to see if they come back with a sensible offer..

 

[GaryMcEwan]

Either my eyes were deceiving me or it really was the case this afternoon, but I'm sure I saw an E200MMC with 240 route branding in a rather garish blue...

 

[overthewater]

It is the next route to get the route branding from mr Javis.....

https://www.flickr.com/photos/busmanscotland/41368876251/in/feed

 

[Jordan Adam]

I can't really see what a buyout like that would bring other than new management and more instability....

 

[GaryMcEwan]

It is the next route to get the route branding from mr Javis.....

https://www.flickr.com/photos/busmanscotland/41368876251/in/feed

Good lord, what highlighter colour is he going to pick next...

 

[Robertj21a]

I can't really see what a buyout like that would bring other than new management and more instability....

Probably a split up of the various parts of First Group and closure/sale of unprofitable units ?

 

[Stan Drews]

I can't really see what a buyout like that would bring other than new management and more instability....

I quite like the idea that it could bring fleetnames like ‘Manchester Apollo’

 

[Dai Corner]

I quite like the idea that it could bring fleetnames like ‘Manchester Apollo’

Or routes such as Apollo 13?

 

[overthewater]

I bet alot of people would love to see Glasgow Apollo back in action

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Probably a split up of the various parts of First Group and closure/sale of unprofitable units ?

To coin a phrase in an Essex Gentlemen's Club, they're Orsett Strippers. This is the same set of people behind Claire's Accessories, CEVA Logistics and Countrywide PLC - not good.

 

[Robertj21a]

To coin a phrase in an Essex Gentlemen's Club, they're Orsett Strippers. This is the same set of people behind Claire's Accessories, CEVA Logistics and Countrywide PLC - not good.

Absolutely, hence my comments above.

 

[overthewater]

There must seen something there, to get its teeth into, to make a quick profit.. but could the shareholders reject it or would there gamble? Mind you Vultures are a good word for them

 

[Robertj21a]

There must seen something there, to get its teeth into, to make a quick profit.. but could the shareholders reject it or would there gamble? Mind you Vultures are a good word for them

There'll have to be a better offer if they want to put it to a shareholder vote. This is a toe in the water to test reaction, and stir up a few disgruntled shareholders.

 

[overthewater]

There'll have to be a better offer if they want to put it to a shareholder vote. This is a toe in the water to test reaction, and stir up a few disgruntled shareholders.

Its the counter bid that going to be more interesting, this can't be the only company sniffing around First. I would be very surprised if someone else didnt come along and throw something into the pool - thinking how to asset strip it. Either way it's not good, and it was hoped this had been avoided.

Biggest Shareholders: I take it the rest belong to the public and employees?

• Majedie Asset Management Ltd. 105,140,322 8.69%
• Schroder Investment Management Ltd. 64,283,712 5.32%
• Threadneedle Asset Management Ltd. 63,621,244 5.26%
• Aberforth Partners LLP 62,193,190 5.14%
• Jupiter Asset Management Ltd. 60,603,024 5.01%
• Franklin Mutual Advisers LLC 60,595,200 5.01%
• West Face Capital, Inc. 60,455,000 5.00%
• Orbis Investment Management Ltd. 59,397,756 4.91%
• Dimensional Fund Advisors LP 39,898,162 3.30%
• Norges Bank Investment Management

 

[route101]

Noticed 240 route branding on E200 MCS today .

 

[Dentonian]

I quite like the idea that it could bring fleetnames like ‘Manchester Apollo’

They could resurrect competition on the 192, passing the front door.

 

[winston270twm]

First Group have received a takeover approach which has been rejected:
http://otp.investis.com/clients/uk/first_group/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=858&newsid=998669

There must seen something there, to get its teeth into, to make a quick profit.. but could the shareholders reject it or would there gamble? Mind you Vultures are a good word for them

They're seeing that the First Group business units are worth far more by being broken up & sold against remaining as part of a group. It was inventible that one of the hedge funds would make an approach, the group's been underperforming for years.

 

[winston270twm]

Its the counter bid that going to be more interesting, this can't be the only company sniffing around First. I would be very surprised if someone else didnt come along and throw something into the pool - thinking how to asset strip it. Either way it's not good, and it was hoped this had been avoided.

Biggest Shareholders: I take it the rest belong to the public and employees?

I very much doubt they'll b a queue of people looking to bid and take First Group on, most of the UK Transport groups hands will be tied by already having a large market share in the UK

 

[overthewater]

I dont believe it other transport groups, I believe it's the other hedge funds that will come sniffing.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

They're seeing that the First Group business units are worth far more by being broken up & sold against remaining as part of a group. It was inventible that one of the hedge funds would make an approach, the group's been underperforming for years.

Wondered why my shares had climbed in value - bought in at 84p!

For an investor, it is interesting.

For passengers or enthusiasts, I don't think it would be great news for UK Bus - stripping out costs, amount of investment?

 

[Robertj21a]

Wondered why my shares had climbed in value - bought in at 84p!

For an investor, it is interesting.

For passengers or enthusiasts, I don't think it would be great news for UK Bus - stripping out costs, amount of investment?

An opportunity for National Express to expand a little ? - or Abellio/RATP etc etc

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

An opportunity for National Express to expand a little ? - or Abellio/RATP etc etc

Tbh, we've had six years of people saying "oooh, I could see X buying Y" - I'm still waiting for Go Ahead to buy Livingston.....

 

[Robertj21a]

Tbh, we've had six years of people saying "oooh, I could see X buying Y" - I'm still waiting for Go Ahead to buy Livingston.....

True, but that was First Group management and policies to date. This would be an asset stripper looking for a quick return.

 

[overthewater]

It's more likley there do the dirty and have fours pots

* UK BUS - landed with good amount of debt.
* Greyhound
* Student Transit
* Rail.

This asset stripper not going to go around wasting it time selling of individual depots or operations, there just dump the whole of UK bus to someone else and make them cut it into pieces.... Mind you there could have two UK bus lots.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

True, but that was First Group management and policies to date. This would be an asset stripper looking for a quick return.

My point is that we will just have a welter of barely informed speculation. Simply substitute group business for OpCo!

 

[winston270twm]

Wondered why my shares had climbed in value - bought in at 84p!

For an investor, it is interesting.

For passengers or enthusiasts, I don't think it would be great news for UK Bus - stripping out costs, amount of investment?

TGW - did you buy more in the end?

The best scenario would be if First Group were to attract the interest of pension fund manager, one that wished to retain the entire group & had money to throw at it to turn it around.

I can't see anyone managing to pull off a takeover on the cheap, as all long term investors will need a fairly high share price just to break even.

It will be interesting to see what unfolds, the key is for Apollo Management to get the backing of a number of the main shareholders.