First Greater Glasgow

[route101]

Yeah that would make the most sense. Seems the most sensible reason although it also highlights the issue with not having social media staff that are local.
[/QUOT

Just thought I should give my impressions as a non-local of First’s Glasgow network. I’ve just been there for a few days, so just a snapshot really.

The buses around the city looked clean most of the time, and the ones I travelled on all appeared to be clean inside. Drivers largely friendly, although did have 2 unfriendly and unhelpful ones.

Although there were some quite new vehicles, the fleet did have quite a lot of older vehicles, with some very noisy Volvos. I’m usually of the opinion that as long as a bus is clean and comfortable (which they were), age doesn’t matter too much. Some Tridents were quite uncomfortable though and having really noisy Volvos probably isn’t a good image. But largely a good and well maintained fleet from what I saw though. Branded vehicles seemed to stay on their proper routes too.

This isn’t really the fault of First, but travelling around the city centre could often be quite painfully slow, with constant stop/start at traffic lights. So there could be some improvements to bus priority I think. The amount of roadworks and the expanded pavements for social distancing probably impacted my time there too.

I think the map provided by First for the Glasgow was really good, especially as it includes most routes from other operators which is rare from a commercial operator. There could be an improvement with mapping the city centre though, as I found it fairly difficult to work out where the buses stopped. Not sure of a solution though.

I was disappointed with the app. I did buy a paper day ticket on one day, which worked fine. But another day I thought I’d try buying it on the app. The app itself is good I think, clear and easy to use. In practice however, every bus I went on was unable to scan my phone properly, and I’m not sure why (you scan the QR code on the ticket on your phone, just like you have to do with the paper ticket). It seems other passengers were having this problem. Most drivers just waved me on, some had a look at it, and other drivers thought it was invalid or it was the wrong ticket with one being quite rude. So, it was a bit of a hassle, and I think that would put some passengers off using the bus again, especially if they are anxious people. I’ll use the paper one next time!

From an enthusiasts point of view, it was great to see so many older Wright vehicles, which appear to be getting rarer now. On routes 60/60A were ex-London Tridents which was good to see before they presumably go soon.
For me, it was good to see so many ‘heavyweight’ single deckers as I am not used to them in my area. The newer MMC vehicles looked impressive, but especially the route 500 airport vehicles - they looked excellent, although for obvious reasons I didn’t see anyone using them!

I had that once or twice with the app. Anyone else hate it when you cant hear it accepting and the driver has to see its accepted haha.

Yes , i feel its a big merry go around for some services that go Argyle St, Queen St, Ingram , Glassford st , the number 6 for example. The pavements with stops extended out in street look terrible.
I think the 500 airport buses are the only ones in Scotland with City bodies, id like to see them in normal spec in Scotland.
Suppose its anywhere , you get rude drivers and friendly , i suppose being a freindly bus driver in Glasgow , you may be a new green driver and may harden up over time.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

McColls could bank on this and run there bit of the M3 at those times with there ALX400s

McColls only have a couple of evening journeys with the M3

 

[PaulMc7]

Noticed earlier that there's unneccessary amounts of extras being ran on the 1s. Was in the car with my girlfriend and seen 4 Clydebank 1s between Scotstoun and Argyle St on top of the other 1s in this time. Think we also seen 1 of each except a 1A too if I remember correctly

 

[lastbus]

Noticed earlier that there's unneccessary amounts of extras being ran on the 1s. Was in the car with my girlfriend and seen 4 Clydebank 1s between Scotstoun and Argyle St on top of the other 1s in this time. Think we also seen 1 of each except a 1A too if I remember correctly

How are they unnecessary?

 

[PaulMc7]

How are they unnecessary?

4 in around 15 mins on top of 4 other 1s is pretty unnecessary especially when the 1C and 1D were both double deckers and were not massively busy. The 1 and 1B weren't busy either

 

[lastbus]

4 in around 15 mins on top of 4 other 1s is pretty unnecessary especially when the 1C and 1D were both double deckers and were not massively busy. The 1 and 1B weren't busy either

They are social distancing dupes passenger numbers are looked at before these are put on.

 

[PaulMc7]

They are social distancing dupes passenger numbers are looked at before these are put on.

Fair enough. Counted about 6/7 passengers combined on the 4 of them with 2 completely empty. Would have said the 1C was about half full and the 1/1B were just over half full. Would have thought maybe 2 would have been fine. 4 just seems incredibly overkill

 

[lastbus]

Fair enough. Counted about 6/7 passengers combined on the 4 of them with 2 completely empty. Would have said the 1C was about half full and the 1/1B were just over half full. Would have thought maybe 2 would have been fine. 4 just seems incredibly overkill

These are on all day you maybe seen them at a quiet time.

 

[PaulMc7]

These are on all day you maybe seen them at a quiet time.

Was about 3:15/3:20pm. Would there be a better way to space them out maybe? Would probably result in a better spread of resources

 

[route101]

Was about 3:15/3:20pm. Would there be a better way to space them out maybe? Would probably result in a better spread of resources

I think someone said you cant do that with dupes , as you would have to register it as a service.

 

[PaulMc7]

I think someone said you cant do that with dupes , as you would have to register it as a service.

Ah fair enough. Just seems like a waste of money having that many when the dupes are completely empty and are so close together on routes that aren't that short from their full service. Literally just a 1C and 1D down from full service on the 1s. Would probably be easier if the timetable was just normal especially if the extra 1C/1D were both double deckers

 

[PaulMc7]

I wonder when First will actually announce the cuts for the 30th given that it's now under 3 weeks away. Seen that there's now a petition for saving the X1 doing the rounds now as well as one for the 31 that was going around a good while beforehand.

Doubt either petition will save the bus that they're for though. Also worth noting that if the X1 was saved from being axed it would be the 3rd time in 10 months it's been saved

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I wonder when First will actually announce the cuts for the 30th given that it's now under 3 weeks away. Seen that there's now a petition for saving the X1 doing the rounds now as well as one for the 31 that was going around a good while beforehand.

Doubt either petition will save the bus that they're for though. Also worth noting that if the X1 was saved from being axed it would be the 3rd time in 10 months it's been saved

Operators usually do it 2-3 weeks beforehand. Any sooner and people seem to forget about it then get surprised.

Wasn't there an X1 petition before? As I said then, if only a proportion of those 4000 people actually used the bus daily, then it wouldn't be a problem. Hence the problem with social media and doing consultations....often a lot of noise with people nodding like Churchill dogs when asked if they'll use a service but not a huge amount of substance.

 

[PaulMc7]

Operators usually do it 2-3 weeks beforehand. Any sooner and people seem to forget about it then get surprised.

Wasn't there an X1 petition before? As I said then, if only a proportion of those 4000 people actually used the bus daily, then it wouldn't be a problem. Hence the problem with social media and doing consultations....often a lot of noise with people nodding like Churchill dogs when asked if they'll use a service but not a huge amount of substance.

Yeah the one before ended up with closer to 5000 signatures. I think the problem though came after when it was going to be axed in February. There was quite a few comments around regarding ticket machines and them not working. Definitely does make it more likely for people to not trust First if something wasn't quite right

 

[overthewater]

Still wouldn't have helped off all those 5000 people traveled only at peak times

 

[PaulMc7]

Still wouldn't have helped off all those 5000 people traveled only at peak times

If the X1 at peaks was matched off peak we 100% wouldn't be talking about it being axed ever lol. Also think it's suffered a lot because of First letting the situation go on so long without changing anything. Took them long enough to try and make it more attractive to use so it was never going to work

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

If the X1 at peaks was matched off peak we 100% wouldn't be talking about it being axed ever lol. Also think it's suffered a lot because of First letting the situation go on so long without changing anything. Took them long enough to try and make it more attractive to use so it was never going to work

Still wouldn't have helped off all those 5000 people traveled only at peak times

It's the train that killed it. Cheap off peak fares means that the X1 is only really attractive to pensioners and the pass remuneration just isn't enough

 

[PaulMc7]

It's the train that killed it. Cheap off peak fares means that the X1 is only really attractive to pensioners and the pass remuneration just isn't enough

Train definitely played a part but there's definitely more to it than just that I think. The train would be utterly useless if you stayed close to the X1 terminus too. 25 mins on the bus just from the terminus to Hamilton town centre. I do think it was a longer term problem though not helped by First keeping it the same until the branding and lower fares earlier in the year. Definitely think there's a lack of reason to go into Glasgow City Centre now too unless you absolutely have to. Shops or restaurants etc just aren't enough anymore. It's good for tourists etc but there's no "wow" factor in Glasgow that leaves people wanting to go constantly if you've been a few times

 

[Voyager lad]

Definitely think there's a lack of reason to go into Glasgow City Centre now too unless you absolutely have to. Shops or restaurants etc just aren't enough anymore. It's good for tourists etc but there's no "wow" factor in Glasgow that leaves people wanting to go constantly if you've been a few times

I must agree that especially after Covid Glasgow just doesn’t feel like a top destination. The majority of shops people would go to can be found closer to home at retail parks or places like The Fort and Braehead. I still don’t feel comfortable going to a cafe or restaurant considering the risks. I think for services like the X1 a local approach is probably best, ie keep it between Hillhouse and Hamilton but ditch the service to Glasgow, much like what was originally happening in February. It’ll be a long time before Glasgow gets close to pre Covid passenger numbers.

 

[PaulMc7]

I must agree that especially after Covid Glasgow just doesn’t feel like a top destination. The majority of shops people would go to can be found closer to home at retail parks or places like The Fort and Braehead. I still don’t feel comfortable going to a cafe or restaurant considering the risks. I think for services like the X1 a local approach is probably best, ie keep it between Hillhouse and Hamilton but ditch the service to Glasgow, much like what was originally happening in February. It’ll be a long time before Glasgow gets close to pre Covid passenger numbers.

Yeah I fully agree. IMO it needs to be a local service off peak with peak journeys into Glasgow if you don't want to absolutely drive away more passengers. I could imagine something similar happening with the X8 by having that become a Pollok local service off peak considering the 10 isn't actually that slow anyway. Glasgow was already losing novelty before covid but it's 100% sped up by covid. I think First are going to have to get incredibly creative pretty quickly if they want to get people onto buses

 

[route101]

According to the first website , 32 and X1 services still suspended.

Councillor is meeting First today with regards to 31 up to East Kilbirde. M1 local service has been mentioned, no good to me as no city link but might be useful to some. Also mentioned the buses at the top of Castlemilk at 75 terminus and how some of them could be extended to East Kilbride, not sure he specifically meant the 75 , dont think so. While i do agree the 31 was mostly dead off peak, it has been the biggest section of route withdrawn for a while.

 

[PaulMc7]

According to the first website , 32 and X1 services still suspended.

Councillor is meeting First today with regards to 31 up to East Kilbirde. M1 local service has been mentioned, no good to me as no city link but might be useful to some. Also mentioned the buses at the top of Castlemilk at 75 terminus and how some of them could be extended to East Kilbride, not sure he specifically meant the 75 , dont think so. While i do agree the 31 was mostly dead off peak, it has been the biggest section of route withdrawn for a while.

Don't even know what could be extended to EK from Castlemilk that would work tbh. The 46 just by being every 30 mins is the only option really but then it doesn't go to the city centre and it's already a fairly long route so would be over 2 hours if extended. At least even if the option to switch over to a city centre bus at Castlemilk was there it wouldn't be so bad

 

[martyjon]

Help please. I will be traveling to Glasgow Bailleston by rail to visit relatives but their residence is some distance from the rail station on a fairly new housing development on the site of the closed Zoo site at a place called Broomhill or Uddington but walking is painful for me. Directions given to me advise me to turn right out of Bailleston station and walk to the main road then turn right and walk over the railway bridge to the roundabout and take the 1st exit off to the roundabout and keep walking until you come to our road. We'll leave a front door key under a stone by the back french window door. My relatives say there is a bus service which passes the station but don't know where it goes. There is no taxi rank at the station. From my description of my directions to their home does any forum poster know the area and can tell me if there is a bus service which would deposit me near my relatives home or if there is details of a local taxi service on a station information board. Thanks in advance for any help posted.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Train definitely played a part but there's definitely more to it than just that I think. The train would be utterly useless if you stayed close to the X1 terminus too. 25 mins on the bus just from the terminus to Hamilton town centre. I do think it was a longer term problem though not helped by First keeping it the same until the branding and lower fares earlier in the year. Definitely think there's a lack of reason to go into Glasgow City Centre now too unless you absolutely have to. Shops or restaurants etc just aren't enough anymore. It's good for tourists etc but there's no "wow" factor in Glasgow that leaves people wanting to go constantly if you've been a few times

The lack of a wow factor is another issue outside First's control though arguably Glasgow's still a bigger pull than most.

It might just be that the X1 is one of those routes that clearly has a demand from High Earnock (where the train doesn't have a presence) and in the peak. However, those weren't enough passengers pre-Covid and certainly won't be enough going forward.

If only 10% of those who signed the petition used the bus each day, the X1 would survive. Such is the problem with online petitions etc and not always representative of reality.

 

[smtglasgow]

Help please. I will be traveling to Glasgow Bailleston by rail to visit relatives but their residence is some distance from the rail station on a fairly new housing development on the site of the closed Zoo site at a place called Broomhill or Uddington

A lot depends on exactly where you’re going. Firsts 240 & 255 from the city centre both stop on Hamilton Rd next to the flats on the site of the old zoo. But if you’re going to the newbuild houses which extend almost to the M73 (ie. turning left at the roundabout at the bottom of the Muirhead Rd), you might be as well sticking to the train. Unfortunately, this area is very car-centric. If walking is a problem, think about a taxi, at least for part of the journey. If you’ve got time, a bus to the Duke St entrance to the Parkhead Forge (60/60a bus from city) and a taxi from the rank opposite the bus stop might be worth thinking about. Alternatively, you'll be able to pick up a taxi at Shettleston station (from Queen St low level). Both Shettleston & the Forge are about 15 minutes drive from Broomhouse.

 

[PaulMc7]

The lack of a wow factor is another issue outside First's control though arguably Glasgow's still a bigger pull than most.

It might just be that the X1 is one of those routes that clearly has a demand from High Earnock (where the train doesn't have a presence) and in the peak. However, those weren't enough passengers pre-Covid and certainly won't be enough going forward.

If only 10% of those who signed the petition used the bus each day, the X1 would survive. Such is the problem with online petitions etc and not always representative of reality.

It's not anything First can control but it's definitely a factor with some routes. Even before Covid I'd hardly call Glasgow a big pull to anyone except tourists. There's really not much in the city centre anymore than you can't do locally especially in terms of shops and food options. As I say though it's a bus First didn't do anything to change the fortunes of for so long so brought on by themselves really

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It's not anything First can control but it's definitely a factor with some routes. Even before Covid I'd hardly call Glasgow a big pull to anyone except tourists. There's really not much in the city centre anymore than you can't do locally especially in terms of shops and food options. As I say though it's a bus First didn't do anything to change the fortunes of for so long so brought on by themselves really

Curious that you say all that about Glasgow now being tourist orientated and no pull for shoppers but then still blame First. We just have to accept that some services just reach the end of their lifecycle.

 

[PaulMc7]

Curious that you say all that about Glasgow now being tourist orientated and no pull for shoppers but then still blame First. We just have to accept that some services just reach the end of their lifecycle.

If First don't change things for so long then they can be blamed. As I say, Glasgow has been tourist orientated for at the very least 6/7 years and it took til this year for any fare offers and branding on the X1. Obviously passenger numbers were going to fall if that's the case. Ultimately it's up to First to do what they can control and give people reasons to use their buses and over the years here that hasn't happened. If people didn't HAVE to use First then I personally doubt many would. First get helped by the fact a lot of people don't have other options for their journey

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

If First don't change things for so long then they can be blamed. As I say, Glasgow has been tourist orientated for at the very least 6/7 years and it took til this year for any fare offers and branding on the X1. Obviously passenger numbers were going to fall if that's the case. Ultimately it's up to First to do what they can control and give people reasons to use their buses and over the years here that hasn't happened. If people didn't HAVE to use First then I personally doubt many would. First get helped by the fact a lot of people don't have other options for their journey

I'm not getting you. If Glasgow is tourist orientated for 6/7 years, do you think that a fares offer is going to change that? Isn't part of the problem that they have no problem filling seats in the peaks, but in the off peak, they are competing with a subsidised rail service? It's a service that's run its course.

You are right that people are captive to whichever bus operator is in their town or city as we have very few instances of true competition.

 

[PaulMc7]

I'm not getting you. If Glasgow is tourist orientated for 6/7 years, do you think that a fares offer is going to change that? Isn't part of the problem that they have no problem filling seats in the peaks, but in the off peak, they are competing with a subsidised rail service? It's a service that's run its course.

You are right that people are captive to whichever bus operator is in their town or city as we have very few instances of true competition.

If it happened earlier it might have especially given that the bus only takes 25 mins to the city centre from Hamilton town centre. Also worth noting that the train goes nowhere near Buchanan Bus Station from Hamilton so it's not as direct competition compared to what some other services have to deal with. It's a form of competition but it's not like it's majorly favourable compared to the X1. The "I wouldn't be seen dead on a bus" attitude definitely plays a part here too but in Glasgow the biggest contributors to that are First

First need to do a ton of work to give people a reason to use their services and building a good customer relationship is the place to start with that. When you have Stagecoach announcing changes to the public 9/10 weeks before they plan to make them and with a couple of weeks to give feedback there's no excuse for First not to do it. With social media use etc there's no real excuse anymore for First not to use it better