First Glasgow: Clydebank Services

[Strathclyder]

Since we are talking Clydebank history, can someone remind me of the route of the old Kelvin 5/5A? I know that one was Faifley (mirroring the 62) and the other Old Kilpatrick (presumably sticking to the Dumbarton Road, similar to the current "one" services)? But did they follow the same route from Clydebank into Glasgow? Which corridor were Kelvin competing on (62, 66 etc)?

A bit before my time, but from the visual evidence I can glean from Flickr etc., the 5/5A (later split, with the eastern section becoming the 6 and the western section the 5A/5B) competed on the 62 corridor, the route from Clydebank to Glasgow seemingly differing little between the two; only difference was that the Kelvin service ran along Argyle St from Central Station as opposed up Hope St & left onto St. Vincent St. Not sure what it did once it reached Anderston station though, whether it took the left onto the A804 slip road & left onto St. Vincent St or along the Clydeside Expressway as far as the junction with Finnieston St, up Finnieston St & then left onto Argyle St from there.

Am sure someone with more knowledge than I of this period/section of Glasgow's bus history can enlighten us both, as I really don't know one way or the other for certain lol

 

[smtglasgow]

I too, having been a local for over 15 years, been impressed by the way they just keep on going, defying the odds. Operating on a bare-bones basis (e.g, the blinds in some of the present Darts date from the time their fleet was almost entirely made up of various Merc breadvans) seems to work, plus their 4 routes, the 400 (from Partick to Drumchapel) in particular, seem to do well enough. Don't see them throwing in the towel just yet.

That's a brilliant wee history - thanks. Avondale seem to do OK - they have that tried and tested indie tactic of getting in front of the First bus and staying there. One thing I never understand is why there are so many buses going to Duntocher. First and Avondale both run at least every 10 mins during the day but you rarely see a busy bus. Hard to see who's making money, but it's been like that for years. Also the evening service is a tender, hardly a sign that the route is a goldmine.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

That's a brilliant wee history - thanks. Avondale seem to do OK - they have that tried and tested indie tactic of getting in front of the First bus and staying there. One thing I never understand is why there are so many buses going to Duntocher. First and Avondale both run at least every 10 mins during the day but you rarely see a busy bus. Hard to see who's making money, but it's been like that for years. Also the evening service is a tender, hardly a sign that the route is a goldmine.

I reckon it's more about power, stance and dominance than anything else on FiGs part, however, since they removed the 6 from Mountblow I would've thought extending the 6 route with a reworked timetable to Duntocher ovcourse could replace the 81, this would also make sense to compete on a Duntocher basis with City buses 17.

 

[Bus Lightyear]

(and great user name!)

Cheers

(going further off topic, but it struck me as odd at the time that Kelvin and Clydeside made such big efforts to compete in Glasgow whilst Central Scottish seemed much more modest in the big city, despite Strathclyde taking the fight to them in places like Cumbernauld)

Kelvin ran services to the likes of Milton, Summerston and Pollok but it was the cross-city 5/5A (Easterhouse - Faifley/Old Kilpatrick) where they perhaps found most success as it lasted into the mid 90s. Clydeside also extended services from the city centre to Balornock and Garthamlock and ran frequently from Nitshill and Darnley.

Strathclyde extended from the city boundary to the likes of Kirkintilloch, Cumbernauld, Airdrie, Hamilton, Johnstone, Erskine and Dumbarton but it was East Kilbride where they became the biggest player following KCB's decision to exit that market in 1990 with the exception of services from Hamilton etc.

 

[route101]

Cheers



Kelvin ran services to the likes of Milton, Summerston and Pollok but it was the cross-city 5/5A (Easterhouse - Faifley/Old Kilpatrick) where they perhaps found most success as it lasted into the mid 90s. Clydeside also extended services from the city centre to Balornock and Garthamlock and ran frequently from Nitshill and Darnley.

Strathclyde extended from the city boundary to the likes of Kirkintilloch, Cumbernauld, Airdrie, Hamilton, Johnstone, Erskine and Dumbarton but it was East Kilbride where they became the biggest player following KCB's decision to exit that market in 1990 with the exception of services from Hamilton etc.

Yeah now with the exception of the 201 , East Kilbrides services are city routes that were extended out . Pretty much no local EK only services though .

 

[laseandre]

There was also the little-remembered X17 to Duntocher, peak only in competition with Citybus, it even had a couple of specially branded Darts...

http://www.gcsbromleygarage.com/127...01 to 2010-01-12/slides/fig4090301050908.html

 

[Scousedwill]

I'm not sure if this will be of interest to anyone (August 2008).

View attachment 55977

Any one got info of the 42 in that time period?

Tia

 

[Jordan Adam]

Any one got info of the 42 in that time period?

Tia

Yup, Here's the PDF version of the timetable from November 2008.
Monday - Friday
Saturday
Sunday

 

[PaulMc7]

Yup, Here's the PDF version of the timetable from November 2008.
Monday - Friday
Saturday
Sunday

This was my main bus at the time. Never really the most reliable of services. Certainly the 1C is far better over the 42 although I'd argue that the 38B over the east end part to Barlanark is more unreliable than the 42/42A were

 

[CM]

Ahh the 42, one of those routes that was actually quite well used but First couldn't help but chip away at it. It was almost as if they wanted people to stop using it.

 

[PaulMc7]

Ahh the 42, one of those routes that was actually quite well used but First couldn't help but chip away at it. It was almost as if they wanted people to stop using it.

Been a lot of old cross-city routes like that tbh. The old 16 was miles better than what it is now and the 4/4A is the same. The loss of a West-end link from Knightswood killed the 4/4A and the X4 is a fairly average replacement and completely dead outside peaks

 

[PaulMc7]

Back to Clydebank as an area how do you guys think it does in terms of bus service? It has an awful lot tbh especially considering it's barely an attractive place to go anymore for anyone that isn't local to it. Shops closing a lot quicker than even 10/15 years ago. I'm only 10 mins away by bus and I've rarely actually got off there apart from a couple of occasions in recent months. Surprised Avondale do as well as they do to just keep lasting tbh and Mcgills keep up with their 757 and X22 as well. First have plenty there but I think it's going to be a struggle more and more as other shops close

 

[Zakforbes4]

With clydebank I seen avondale managed to get some fairly new 200darts my question is how come they still can never seem to by new buses even though they've been running for so long do they just not make that much money

 

[Observer]

Too expensive to buy new, you're looking at upwards of £130k or higher. Older E200s are dropping in price, some going under £25k now. You can figure the rest out to understand.

 

[scosutsut]

Digging through my very rusty memory of the mid to late 90s from the Dumbarton D routes side I recall the Helensburgh route wasn't a D number and it only ran to Dumbarton at the time.

The route that I remember served Clydebank was the D2 which went from Westcliff - Dumbarton - Bellsmyre(?) - Bowling - Old Kilpatrick - Clydebank and the D5 that was Balloch - Renton(?) - Dumbarton - Bowling - OK - Clydebank.

So much variety back in those days! Bread van transits, Nationals, Leopards, Dorchesters, B58s, and older (1980s) B10Ms. You would have had Loch Lomond Coaches running against Kelvin on both for a time too.

Edit - sorry this doesn't answer the original question as I'm talking of the dying days of SB Holdings! I left in 2000 by then it was a sea of the quite excellent PS type B10Ms but I'd arrived at an age where I paid considerably less attention to these things!

 

[smtglasgow]

What I’ve never understood about Avondale is why they’ve never had a go at attacking the strongest First routes – why not try something to Faifley or out to Dalmuir/Old Kilpatrick?

 

[awsnews]

What I’ve never understood about Avondale is why they’ve never had a go at attacking the strongest First routes – why not try something to Faifley or out to Dalmuir/Old Kilpatrick?

They have operated out to Dumbarton in the past and another service went to Braehead. Normally they need all their authorisation to run their current services, the last PI capped the fleet size.

 

[smtglasgow]

Thanks. Should have been clearer - i’m not a fan of Avondale, so it wasn’t a plea for them to expand! Just not clear how they keep going when so many of their buses seem to run with just a handful of passengers. The Duntocher and Drumchapel runs are very over-bused, so there isn’t a fortune to be made there. The 400 seems to do OK – at least at the Partick end.

 

[CM]

Too expensive to buy new, you're looking at upwards of £130k or higher. Older E200s are dropping in price, some going under £25k now. You can figure the rest out to understand.

They've bought new buses before for SPT work but since then those Enviro 200s are about the newest buses they've bought. These days it seems like instead of fixing a bus to put it through an MOT they just buy another one to replace it.

 

[Zakforbes4]

If I was avondale I would run what is numbered the 81B but call it 500 Duntocker-Parkhall-Clydebank-Asda-Linvale

 

[awsnews]

Digging through my very rusty memory of the mid to late 90s from the Dumbarton D routes side I recall the Helensburgh route wasn't a D number and it only ran to Dumbarton at the time.

The route that I remember served Clydebank was the D2 which went from Westcliff - Dumbarton - Bellsmyre(?) - Bowling - Old Kilpatrick - Clydebank and the D5 that was Balloch - Renton(?) - Dumbarton - Bowling - OK - Clydebank.

So much variety back in those days! Bread van transits, Nationals, Leopards, Dorchesters, B58s, and older (1980s) B10Ms. You would have had Loch Lomond Coaches running against Kelvin on both for a time too.

Edit - sorry this doesn't answer the original question as I'm talking of the dying days of SB Holdings! I left in 2000 by then it was a sea of the quite excellent PS type B10Ms but I'd arrived at an age where I paid considerably less attention to these things!

At the risk of going further off topic looking through a 1993 KCB timetable it confirms the following:
Dumbarton to Helensburgh was the D16, 16 was the number used by Weirs for their Helensburgh to Coulport service.
The D2 was Westcliff to Clydebank via Castlehill, Dumbarton town centre, Bellsmyre and Bowling.
D5 was Balloch to Clydebank via Renton (as was the D4 in the evenings). These are what are now the 1 and 1A.
No services from the Vale went east of Clydebank with the exception of a single D5 in the morning which extended to South Street for the shipyard.
By this time services were joint with Allanders Coaches

 

[scosutsut]

At the risk of going further off topic looking through a 1993 KCB timetable it confirms the following:
Dumbarton to Helensburgh was the D16, 16 was the number used by Weirs for their Helensburgh to Coulport service.
The D2 was Westcliff to Clydebank via Castlehill, Dumbarton town centre, Bellsmyre and Bowling.
D5 was Balloch to Clydebank via Renton (as was the D4 in the evenings). These are what are now the 1 and 1A.
No services from the Vale went east of Clydebank with the exception of a single D5 in the morning which extended to South Street for the shipyard.
By this time services were joint with Allanders Coaches

I appreciate it, I wasn't a million miles off! The town was well covered in those days. Strangely, I never, ever got the bus to Clydebank though, we always saw that as a job for the train!