FGW advance fares on last train

[TimTraveller]

I book many of the last trains from Paddington to Bath, dep 23.30. Off-peak, advance purchases are often as low as £14.50 or £17 single. However, they have suddenly made the advance fare for the 23.30 a ridiculous £55. When I queried it with First GW I was given the usual fob-off about a limited number of advance tickets, probably all sold, etc. But it seems to me that they are penalising those who are forced by work etc to take the last train. I am aware of the electrification works to Bath over the summer and the revised times, but even for dates before and after the work is due to take place, the last train is coming in at £55, rather than £17. Does anyone have any insights into this? Thank you,

 

[30907]

Super Offpeak at £32 single £56 return might be a better bet?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Advance fares are for maximising income from spare seats. So if the train is full, they should be increased in price or removed entirely. I don't see that there is a massive problem with that, though it might be annoying if you have to use that train.

 

[father_jack]

Super Offpeak at £32 single £56 return might be a better bet?

There's clearly something wrong with the system if there's a £55 fare showing when the SSS is £32.20 but I saw a guy on a train today with a fixed time BTH-PAD for £73.50 around 1500........... (And he was on an earlier train) :cry:

But you have to remember that when you buy a "_______ only" (insert TOC) ticket they get all the money rather than divvying it up among all the companies that work the route. That's why there are various trains over what seem like exclusive lines (0609 BTH-GLC via BTM and 0700 CDF-MAN via BTM or the one each way a day XC that call at WSM just for example) to catch FGW money......

 

[455driver]

That's why there are various trains over what seem like exclusive lines (0609 BTH-GLC via BTM and 0700 CDF-MAN via BTM or the one each way a day XC that call at WSM just for example) to catch FGW money......

The 0609 was to pick up some senior Virgin Cross Country Managers and has just never been removed.
The 0700 and WSM services are to retain diversionary route knowledge.

 

[Mojo]

The 0700 from Cardiff also provides a key peak hour commuter service into Bristol. It runs where there would normally be a Great Western service, so I am not sure if it helps them out in terms of providing extra capacity if they would otherwise only be able to run a 2-car unit.

 

[ValleyLines142]

The 0700 from Cardiff also provides a key peak hour commuter service into Bristol. It runs where there would normally be a Great Western service, so I am not sure if it helps them out in terms of providing extra capacity if they would otherwise only be able to run a 2-car unit.

Indeed, and even that service (which is usually a single 220) is rammed! I'm a regular on it.

I'm planning on going to London today but the cheapest ticket is £28, highly irritating when there is already a replacement bus between Newport and Cardiff this weekend!

 

[bnm]

FGW basically broke the Advance Purchase system during the May fares round. They tried to load to many AP tiers across many flows.

I believe the issue is still not fully fixed for online outlets, with higher price points than those available from stations. I'd suggest checking AP availability at a staffed station. There's a chance lower tiers may be available from there.

Although it could be fixed now and FGW have just decided that the market will bear more expensive APs.

However I think there is no justification whatsoever to offer AP fares that are more expensive than the walk up ticket valid on the same train.

 

[455driver]

Indeed, and even that service (which is usually a single 220) is rammed! I'm a regular on it.

I'm planning on going to London today but the cheapest ticket is £28, highly irritating when there is already a replacement bus between Newport and Cardiff this weekend!

So you think that £28 is too much to get from Cardiff to London do you? :roll:

 

[Bletchleyite]

However I think there is no justification whatsoever to offer AP fares that are more expensive than the walk up ticket valid on the same train.

It's a little silly, but as they should never be sold it's probably neither here nor there.

 

[Greenback]

If someone buys an Advance ticket that's more expensive than the walk up single costs, whose fault is it? The passenger for not checking? FGW's for selling them? Or a bit of both?

 

[gray1404]

If someone buys an Advance ticket that's more expensive than the walk up single costs, whose fault is it? The passenger for not checking? FGW's for selling them? Or a bit of both?

I think it would be the TOC running ticket office in question that told you the ticket. This is because they have to sell you the cheapest appropriate ticket for the journey being made (unless of course the customers requests something) and if a walk up this cheaper then the advance, then it would be the walk up they should sell.

 

[30907]

If its on the FGW or other Mixing Desk site, I think it's the passenger. It was looking there that showed me the alternative.

And for all its faults, NR defaults to the cheapest - I think!

 

[Hadders]

If its on the FGW or other Mixing Desk site, I think it's the passenger. It was looking there that showed me the alternative.

And for all its faults, NR defaults to the cheapest - I think!

But National Rail doesn't sell tickets.

 

[Mojo]

If its on the FGW or other Mixing Desk site, I think it's the passenger. It was looking there that showed me the alternative.

And for all its faults, NR defaults to the cheapest - I think!

Once you select 'Advance' it shows the prices next to the trains. In this case it shows the higher rate which I think is quite misleading!

 

[kieron]

But National Rail doesn't sell tickets.

It does let you choose tickets. Most of the time, this lets you buy tickets with FGW without having to look at their ticket selector thing.

As such, it's reasonable to bring it up as an alternative to the works of thetrainline, WebTIS and Assertis.

 

[Busaholic]

I book many of the last trains from Paddington to Bath, dep 23.30. Off-peak, advance purchases are often as low as £14.50 or £17 single. However, they have suddenly made the advance fare for the 23.30 a ridiculous £55. When I queried it with First GW I was given the usual fob-off about a limited number of advance tickets, probably all sold, etc. But it seems to me that they are penalising those who are forced by work etc to take the last train. I am aware of the electrification works to Bath over the summer and the revised times, but even for dates before and after the work is due to take place, the last train is coming in at £55, rather than £17. Does anyone have any insights into this? Thank you,

Does Sir Peter Hendy still live in Bath? A personal letter, after 16th July?

 

[GatwickDepress]

It does let you choose tickets. Most of the time, this lets you buy tickets with FGW without having to look at their ticket selector thing.

As such, it's reasonable to bring it up as an alternative to the works of thetrainline, WebTIS and Assertis.

Indeed. Quite a lot of people use National Rail to find tickets and purchase it through whatever website it sends them to.

 

[Starmill]

Advance fares are for maximising income from spare seats. So if the train is full, they should be increased in price or removed entirely.

Wrong! They're the main way in which some TOCs decide where their revenue is coming from and who goes on what trains, using price discrimination much more effectively than Off-Peak / Anytime ever does (don't believe me? Why are there so many empty trains leaving Euston in the evening peak, and people standing up at 1900?). The number of people travelling on other ticket types can only be vaguely estimated, and each TOC doing the pricing only gets a relatively small portion of what walk-up tickets earn. If the train is full, chances are it's because too many walk-up ticket holders wanted to use a train to which the TOC already allocated a sensible number of Advances

Some TOCs take a slightly more helpful view from the point of loadings, like Northern, on the basis that they don't really care as much about Advance tickets - but that does mean they lose out a lot because they have very empty trains and low ORCATs shares.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Wrong!

Got any evidence?

They're the main way in which some TOCs decide where their revenue is coming from and who goes on what trains, using price discrimination much more effectively than Off-Peak / Anytime ever does (don't believe me? Why are there so many empty trains leaving Euston in the evening peak, and people standing up at 1900?).

If VT were doing what you allege effectively this would not be the case. But it is, and it is because of the validities of walk-up tickets.

 

[Starmill]

Well you might think it is, but they never sell any cheap tickets for 17 : xx trains do they? The lowest tier is available on, for example, the 1920 Manchester service.

I haven't got any evidence I can share, but I think we both are too smart to believe the people in yield management care much if there's people standing on a train. Standees are profitable, and there's no effective way to make the TOC manage overcrowding if it's making them a lot of money. The only way that happens is of the TOC management want to try it as a way of reducing the heaps of bad press they're getting.